Women sues country club after waiter spills wine on her Hermes
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This.
In Germany - where I life - this artice/story would make no sense at all and I am a bit shocked by some people's very strange sense of justice.
I skimmed through this thread quickly. There are likely points made I missed. I'm wondering about a few things. Carrying a Birkin to a country club is no big deal, I don't think of this woman as a show off for doing so. I imagine there are other Birkin wearers and scads of Chanel and other expensive bags worn there and at other CC's too. It would be poor taste to bring it to, say, a soup kitchen you're volunteering at or some such place. A CC? nope. There are disparaging comments made here about bringing a Birkin to a CC. A CC is not Denny's. (Although Denny's corp owner likely has WAY more money than most CC's.) What if the same thing happened to a Chanel? Balenciaga? Coach? a $10 bag from Target? Then could somebody please create a flow chart for us to know when it's acceptable to become offended/judgmental and how much we're allowed to be offended, vs when it's not? Please include a million branches of the flow chart so we can be absolutely sure when it's OK or not.
If one gets their property destroyed, regardless what the property is--bags, car, whatever, I can understand compensation, legal or otherwise in a lot of instances. The wealth level of the property owner has zero bearing. Should Bill Gates' property get crapped on all day every day with no recourse just because he's rich? If his wife gets punched in the face, or mugged (or worse) should they just suck it up because she shouldn't have been walking in a lovely park without bodyguards? I've seen places compensate for dry cleaning spilled-on clothes. Not sure what would happen if cabernet were spilled on a white mink. CC's insurance company or customer's home owner's insurance--provided a proper rider was purchased? Don't know. The classic "if you forget your diamond ring on a sink counter" is covered if you're carrying the proper insurance. (Be prepared for your insurance company to dump you and nobody else willing to insure you unless your premiums are astronomical.)
Was the Birkin completely destroyed, or could it be repaired? The conspiracy side of me wonders if the lady purposely put her purse in harm's way to frame the CC for compensation for that bag, regardless of motive--greed, guilt over buying the bag, loves drama; or sincerely feels justified to sue for damage. Did she inadvertently (or purposely) wave her hand, bump the waiter and cause him to spill? Ultimately, it's a purse, not a Van Gogh. Granted, it could appreciate in value over time, but so does a classic Corvette. Here's the Blue Book value of it today, done.
I think there's a good deal not made public. If it goes to court, the lady's reputation of past insurance claims will be argued. If there's a tape of the room it happened in it'll play a role. (I think this would be a smart practice of all restaurants to do--especially CC's and banquet venues.) We're often surprised at verdicts. It'll be interesting to find out what this will be.
If one gets their property destroyed, regardless what the property is--bags, car, whatever, I can understand compensation, legal or otherwise in a lot of instances. The wealth level of the property owner has zero bearing. Should Bill Gates' property get crapped on all day every day with no recourse just because he's rich? If his wife gets punched in the face, or mugged (or worse) should they just suck it up because she shouldn't have been walking in a lovely park without bodyguards? I've seen places compensate for dry cleaning spilled-on clothes. Not sure what would happen if cabernet were spilled on a white mink. CC's insurance company or customer's home owner's insurance--provided a proper rider was purchased? Don't know. The classic "if you forget your diamond ring on a sink counter" is covered if you're carrying the proper insurance. (Be prepared for your insurance company to dump you and nobody else willing to insure you unless your premiums are astronomical.)
Was the Birkin completely destroyed, or could it be repaired? The conspiracy side of me wonders if the lady purposely put her purse in harm's way to frame the CC for compensation for that bag, regardless of motive--greed, guilt over buying the bag, loves drama; or sincerely feels justified to sue for damage. Did she inadvertently (or purposely) wave her hand, bump the waiter and cause him to spill? Ultimately, it's a purse, not a Van Gogh. Granted, it could appreciate in value over time, but so does a classic Corvette. Here's the Blue Book value of it today, done.
I think there's a good deal not made public. If it goes to court, the lady's reputation of past insurance claims will be argued. If there's a tape of the room it happened in it'll play a role. (I think this would be a smart practice of all restaurants to do--especially CC's and banquet venues.) We're often surprised at verdicts. It'll be interesting to find out what this will be.
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T
the_black_tie_diyer
Nuts. Totally, unbelievable.
Kind regards,
Oliver
Kind regards,
Oliver
Genuinely feel bad for the employee. Even the lady’s attorney acknowledged that it was an accident.
The plot thickens!
Surely there is much more to this story. If the CC believes it's the waiter's fault, why? It's like saying the waiter deliberately damaged her property, the "why" is beside the point. Maybe the plaintiff was a real jerk and humiliated the waiter. Even so, if someone humiliates you and you punch or hit that person, or destroy some property belonging to that person in "retaliation", you're the one in trouble. Did the waiter do it out of pure malicious intent? Even so, the CC is the entity that hired him. It'd be interesting if the waiter tries to sue the plaintiff, claiming she bumped him and caused him to spill, which could also be true.
If an establishment can sue an employee over such an accident, then the next waiter who spills cabernet on somebody's couture clothing will be in deep trouble. Will waitstaff anywhere want to take on such liability, even if you risk spilling coffee in a diner?
One take-away: If the CC wins and doesn't owe compensation, then this opens the door for dining establishments to deny indoor property claims, at least in cases of where something is spilled and stains or ruins, whether it's wine, blueberry sauce, syrup on your ostrich feather boa, whatever.
Bottom line: the purse is damaged. The "how" is another story. The "why" doesn't matter. The defendant "who" appears to be the CC regardless of the "how".
The country club gave itself a black eye. I read an article where the Birkin was "of great sentimental" value. I don't care how much or little it's sentimental. It's a "one of a kind, they don't make that color any more". I don't care, a similar bag is valued at $13,000 or whatever.
Even eye witnesses to this event would be interesting, or shaky. Depending how big of a scene the bag owner made, they may or may not remember. If there was an argument that escalated, I think the CC is still liable, unless the waiter could convince that the plaintiff or plaintiff's dining guest caused him to spill (by moving an arm or something).
Surely there is much more to this story. If the CC believes it's the waiter's fault, why? It's like saying the waiter deliberately damaged her property, the "why" is beside the point. Maybe the plaintiff was a real jerk and humiliated the waiter. Even so, if someone humiliates you and you punch or hit that person, or destroy some property belonging to that person in "retaliation", you're the one in trouble. Did the waiter do it out of pure malicious intent? Even so, the CC is the entity that hired him. It'd be interesting if the waiter tries to sue the plaintiff, claiming she bumped him and caused him to spill, which could also be true.
If an establishment can sue an employee over such an accident, then the next waiter who spills cabernet on somebody's couture clothing will be in deep trouble. Will waitstaff anywhere want to take on such liability, even if you risk spilling coffee in a diner?
One take-away: If the CC wins and doesn't owe compensation, then this opens the door for dining establishments to deny indoor property claims, at least in cases of where something is spilled and stains or ruins, whether it's wine, blueberry sauce, syrup on your ostrich feather boa, whatever.
Bottom line: the purse is damaged. The "how" is another story. The "why" doesn't matter. The defendant "who" appears to be the CC regardless of the "how".
The country club gave itself a black eye. I read an article where the Birkin was "of great sentimental" value. I don't care how much or little it's sentimental. It's a "one of a kind, they don't make that color any more". I don't care, a similar bag is valued at $13,000 or whatever.
Even eye witnesses to this event would be interesting, or shaky. Depending how big of a scene the bag owner made, they may or may not remember. If there was an argument that escalated, I think the CC is still liable, unless the waiter could convince that the plaintiff or plaintiff's dining guest caused him to spill (by moving an arm or something).
Looks like we may have more information. A new thread was started: https://forum.purseblog.com/threads...bag-with-a-wine-spill-what-do-you-do.1020145/
linking another article: https://m.sfgate.com/news/article/A...B9k3cit16fDPh6dfC3zqlUjI5fXXhxgYdUdk-4TduJK_k
Mods: Please merge because I believe them to be the same. @mistikat Thank you.
linking another article: https://m.sfgate.com/news/article/A...B9k3cit16fDPh6dfC3zqlUjI5fXXhxgYdUdk-4TduJK_k
Mods: Please merge because I believe them to be the same. @mistikat Thank you.
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Maybe the CC should post a sign at the door. “Not responsible for your property. Bring good stuff at your own risk”.
There is clearly a lot more to the story than is in the press (as is usually the case). I’m guessing that the employee was acting maliciously and deliberately when “spilling” wine all over the lady, her husband, and her H bag. This was no accident. And it was not an action that was at the direction of, or of any benefit to, her employer’s interest. Accordingly, the country club should not be vicariously liable under the doctrine of respondeat superior. To the contrary, if she were a patron at a night club, and the club’s bouncer (reasonably foreseeably) got into a fight while attempting to enforce security measures on behalf of the club, then his tortious acts causing damage to the bystanding lady might attach liability to the club. That is a far cry from what appears to have happened at the country club though.
Put another way, if you’re at a country club, and the valet driver crashes your car while trying to park, the country club likely will be on the hook. However, if a cook from the country club goes on break and steals your car from the valet lot, and gets into an accident, the country club may escape liability and actually sue the cook (just like the country club has sued the waiter as an individual defendant via a cross-claim).
In short, it’s not a matter whether a business/venue is responsible for accidents of its employees. Rather, it’s more a question of whether the employee’s actions were intentional, malicious, and/or not reasonably foreseeable by the employer. To the extent that an employee’s actions are deemed criminal, insurance coverage likely won’t apply. That’s why the employer can sue the employee.
Put another way, if you’re at a country club, and the valet driver crashes your car while trying to park, the country club likely will be on the hook. However, if a cook from the country club goes on break and steals your car from the valet lot, and gets into an accident, the country club may escape liability and actually sue the cook (just like the country club has sued the waiter as an individual defendant via a cross-claim).
In short, it’s not a matter whether a business/venue is responsible for accidents of its employees. Rather, it’s more a question of whether the employee’s actions were intentional, malicious, and/or not reasonably foreseeable by the employer. To the extent that an employee’s actions are deemed criminal, insurance coverage likely won’t apply. That’s why the employer can sue the employee.
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The following is from The Washington Post:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/nati...aiter-after-wine-spills-hermes-kelly-handbag/
A $30,000 handbag. A disastrous wine spill. And now, a country club is suing its own waiter.
By
Teo Armus
November 12, 2019
It all started with a handbag.
Maryana Beyder’s wasn’t just any ordinary bag, though. It was a pink Hermès Kelly clutch, since discontinued by the pricey French fashion house. Beyder’s husband had gifted her the purse, worth $30,000, as a 30th birthday present.
So after a waiter at a posh New Jersey country club spilled some red wine on the luxury handbag last year, the real estate agent sued for negligence, demanding that the Alpine Country Club pay her the eye-popping price of her spoiled handbag.
That lawsuit had already made local headlines, but on Monday, the club in Demarest, N.J., responded with a surprising move of its own: It’s now suing its own employee — the waiter who allegedly spilled the wine — in the latest legal development after a dinner gone downhill.
Beyder and her husband were enjoying a meal at the clubhouse on Sept. 7, 2018, when a server named in the lawsuit only as “John Doe” approached their table.
“Whoever the waiter was proceeded to pour red wine and didn’t stop,” Beyder’s lawyer, Alexandra Errico, told the North Jersey Record. “Poured it all over her. Poured it all over her husband. And poured it all over a very expensive Hermès bag.”
Like the country club, Errico did not immediately respond to a request for comment from The Washington Post.
Perhaps for as long as they have existed, the gold-accented Hermès bags, named after Grace Kelly, have been considered a sign of luxury, in no small part due to their high price tags and limited quantity. The bottoms of the bags are crafted with three layers of leather, and celebrity owners include Jennifer Lopez, Victoria Beckham, and Kylie and Kendall Jenner.
Beyder’s handbag is far from the costliest item sold by Hermès. In 2017, one of its purses — made from the hide of a Nile River crocodile, with 18-karat gold buckles and diamond-encrusted strap loops — was sold for about $376,000 at an auction in Hong Kong.
But her purse was still valuable enough to become the subject of a year-long legal battle between Beyder and the club.
Initially, her attorney said, she reached out to Alpine Country Club to resolve the matter, but the establishment eventually stopped responding to her complaints. The same was true of her insurance company, which failed to comprehend how a bag could have such a high price tag, Errico said.
But as she noted to the New York Post, the club is “very, very, very rich.” So Beyder sued on Oct. 29 in Bergen County Superior Court.
Alpine Country Club, which was founded in 1928 by a group of civic leaders who called themselves the “forty millionaires,” boasts 196 acres of rolling green hills, an 18-hole golf course, and the four-bedroom, six-bathroom condo of Eric Bolling, the former Fox News host who agreed to leave the network after reports that he had sent sexually explicit photos to colleagues. Members of the club are reportedly required to pay a $65,000 initiation fee, plus $19,000 in annual dues.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/nati...aiter-after-wine-spills-hermes-kelly-handbag/
A $30,000 handbag. A disastrous wine spill. And now, a country club is suing its own waiter.
By
Teo Armus
November 12, 2019
It all started with a handbag.
Maryana Beyder’s wasn’t just any ordinary bag, though. It was a pink Hermès Kelly clutch, since discontinued by the pricey French fashion house. Beyder’s husband had gifted her the purse, worth $30,000, as a 30th birthday present.
So after a waiter at a posh New Jersey country club spilled some red wine on the luxury handbag last year, the real estate agent sued for negligence, demanding that the Alpine Country Club pay her the eye-popping price of her spoiled handbag.
That lawsuit had already made local headlines, but on Monday, the club in Demarest, N.J., responded with a surprising move of its own: It’s now suing its own employee — the waiter who allegedly spilled the wine — in the latest legal development after a dinner gone downhill.
Beyder and her husband were enjoying a meal at the clubhouse on Sept. 7, 2018, when a server named in the lawsuit only as “John Doe” approached their table.
“Whoever the waiter was proceeded to pour red wine and didn’t stop,” Beyder’s lawyer, Alexandra Errico, told the North Jersey Record. “Poured it all over her. Poured it all over her husband. And poured it all over a very expensive Hermès bag.”
Like the country club, Errico did not immediately respond to a request for comment from The Washington Post.
Perhaps for as long as they have existed, the gold-accented Hermès bags, named after Grace Kelly, have been considered a sign of luxury, in no small part due to their high price tags and limited quantity. The bottoms of the bags are crafted with three layers of leather, and celebrity owners include Jennifer Lopez, Victoria Beckham, and Kylie and Kendall Jenner.
Beyder’s handbag is far from the costliest item sold by Hermès. In 2017, one of its purses — made from the hide of a Nile River crocodile, with 18-karat gold buckles and diamond-encrusted strap loops — was sold for about $376,000 at an auction in Hong Kong.
But her purse was still valuable enough to become the subject of a year-long legal battle between Beyder and the club.
Initially, her attorney said, she reached out to Alpine Country Club to resolve the matter, but the establishment eventually stopped responding to her complaints. The same was true of her insurance company, which failed to comprehend how a bag could have such a high price tag, Errico said.
But as she noted to the New York Post, the club is “very, very, very rich.” So Beyder sued on Oct. 29 in Bergen County Superior Court.
Alpine Country Club, which was founded in 1928 by a group of civic leaders who called themselves the “forty millionaires,” boasts 196 acres of rolling green hills, an 18-hole golf course, and the four-bedroom, six-bathroom condo of Eric Bolling, the former Fox News host who agreed to leave the network after reports that he had sent sexually explicit photos to colleagues. Members of the club are reportedly required to pay a $65,000 initiation fee, plus $19,000 in annual dues.
Personally, I would rather forgo potential compensation than have my name appear in the newspapers because of a case like this. (Of course, she could have sued without going to the papers). How embarrassing.