I'm in need of advice..my authenticated K28 is deemed fake by Paris HQ

[Carrierae]

Ok, I have never had a bag authenticated...but I question why we doubt the verdict of H who has had the opportunity to examine the bag multiple times in person.

It seems like the authentication was done over photos.....isn’t it more probable that the photos didn’t catch all the details that would imply that this was a very passable fake? I don’t think this is a knock on the authenticator...people make mistakes all the time. My bigger frustration is the outright denial that the authenticator could possibly be wrong....especially since this bag was never handled in person. I don’t doubt her credibility in the slightest, but I recognize that there will always be some extreme minimal chance of error on any bag that’s being authenticated via photos.

I truly believe that H did their due diligence to thoroughly check the integrity of the bag. I do believe that the authenticator’s finding was also probably correct based off of the photos she examined...but that also doesn’t rule out the possibility of her verdict being ultimately incorrect due to lack of accurate information submitted.

I scratch my head that some still want to find H as undeniably wrong when they have been the only ones to examine the bag in question in person, multiple times.

 

[Juda]

I agree with that last paragraph. Nothing beats looking at the bag and this is the apparent maker and 3 rounds of inspection. With all due respect to everyone involved if we don't trust Hermes why are we buying their bags or even on this forum?

My thoughts exactly.
Since we are trying to help OP (and some make sense of what happened) to all parties insisting that H made a mistake, how would they have handled the situation?
With all due respect to both trusted authenticators and re sellers (in general) what would have they done since they both stand by their autnetications and products respectively?
Again, I am trying to help the lovely SupaUltra_J not judging anyone.

 

[aki_sato]

I’m so sad for you @SupaUltra_J

I hope you will be compensated in no time and find closure of this ordeal.

I respect Bababebi and a thought cross my mind: even if the three assessments outcome is not conclusive, how would we know?
I’ve learnt, there’s always politics in corporations sadly.
I used to work in a large international corporation where a manager is a total bully. Turnover in her team is absolutely high. One colleague confided in me that she put a complaint to HR. HR escalated the matter to the head of department who’s the bully is reporting to.

Then she was ‘invited’ to discuss the matter with the Head of Department who ended up telling her that there is nothing he could do because the bully has been in the company for so long and she is good at what she does!
He admits that her people management needs work on which he would discuss with her.

At the end, my colleague resigned because bully made her life even more difficult and even on her exit interview document she was warned by the bully not to write anything negative because bully would get to read it anyway before it’s being submitted to HR.

To the day I still shook my head everytime I remember.

So what I’m trying to point out, due to politics, company/ corporations will cover and protect each other.

I’m not saying H is incorrect in their assessment- but even if they are, I doubt they will come out and admit that as that will show incompetence and ruin their credibility.
It’s more important for them to show unison conclusion than admitting (if possible) a mistake their own has made!

And they can definitely do that because, who can challenge their decision??
There is no one else higher than them that can offer expertise.

 

[marbella8]

Why do you persist in this? I am sure OP looked at the bag? Should she have re-photographed and had another authentication carried out if it appeared to be the same bag? Are we to suspect that every respected reseller somehow has multiple copies of the same bag to sell -- especially one in this unusual style and color? This is an unfair blame of the OP IMHO.

Some people are consistently mean, thread-after-thread. I am so glad you said something. I am getting so sick of rudeness. I miss the old days of tpf, where people seemed to be more polite.

 

[Carrierae]

I’m so sad for you @SupaUltra_J

I hope you will be compensated in no time and find closure of this ordeal.

I respect Bababebi and a thought cross my mind: even if the three assessments outcome is not conclusive, how would we know?
I’ve learnt, there’s always politics in corporations sadly.
I used to work in a large international corporation where a manager is a total bully. Turnover in her team is absolutely high. One colleague confided in me that she put a complaint to HR. HR escalated the matter to the head of department who’s the bully is reporting to.

Then she was ‘invited’ to discuss the matter with the Head of Department who ended up telling her that there is nothing he could do because the bully has been in the company for so long and she is good at what she does!
He admits that her people management needs work on which he would discuss with her.

At the end, my colleague resigned because bully made her life even more difficult and even on her exit interview document she was warned by the bully not to write anything negative because bully would get to read it anyway before it’s being submitted to HR.

To the day I still shook my head everytime I remember.

So what I’m trying to point out, due to politics, company/ corporations will cover and protect each other.

I’m not saying H is incorrect in their assessment- but even if they are, I doubt they will come out and admit that as that will show incompetence and ruin their credibility.
It’s more important for them to show unison conclusion than admitting (if possible) a mistake their own has made!

And they can definitely do that because, who can challenge their decision??
There is no one else higher than them that can offer expertise.

I understand your example...but couldn’t this logic be applied towards the authenticator? That being incorrect in an authentication could show incompetence and ruin credibility, therefore, it’s in the best interest of her business to stand by her original declaration? Especially since no authenticator has more credibility than this one?

I could honestly see this going both ways...but so far, it seems like a one-sided argument. Both have enough reason to stand by their original judgement.

 

[marbella8]

As promised I'm to share the latest status as my case progresses. The aftersales team from my boutique forwarded me the result from the latest assessment. Long story short - worse did come to worst.
.
"As requested, we have escalated your concerns to our After-Sales Department in Paris. Our After-Sales Directors have confirmed that the handbag in question has indeed not been manufactured by Hermès Paris. The Letter of Expertise and Affidavit will be issued to you shortly."

Not sure what else I could do to further my case at this stage. My store has done all they can to appeal to HQ. I have also submitted all I had on my end. I would imagine the letter will explain in more details who has examined the bag and what procedure has been carried out.

Feel like I should just cave in, pack my learnings and move on. Always buy directly from the boutique; Keep the receipt for life; Let go of any specific style that you missed.) After all without the original purchase document what else could I do?

OP- don’t give up, please. The few photos you posted were not enough to be definitive of whether or not it was a fake or not, but I know (as I have used her myself many times) that @bababebi requires many more photos than what you posted and that I am sure her decision is correct.

If I were you, I would file a lawsuit ASAP in small-claims court against Hermes USA and Paris (limit is $10,000 in California for individuals I believe, and if not $7,500.00), of you don’t want to hire an attorney, and that way they’ll be forced not to destroy the bag, and will have to bring the bag to court, and hopefully @bababebi will be able to be a witness for you. Best of luck.

 

[FugitiveRouge]

I have only sympathy to share. I'm so sorry to hear this story and the headache it must have caused you. I was hoping for a happy ending.

 

[AnnaE]

I have been away from the forum for a while and missed this entire thread, which I read in one go.

@SupaUltra_J, I am so very sorry about this situation -- you seem to be handling it better than most of us would.

I know this is not helpful, but it seems to me that there are several scenarios:

• OP is not being truthful and swapped out the bag at some point.
• The bag was the same throughout the whole saga, but:
  • Both an experienced reseller and an authenticator, both of whom I would trust personally, are wrong.
  • Or Hermes is wrong.

I would personally go with Hermes being wrong. This is a rare bag and it is more likely that someone at Hermes is not familiar with it than that someone made a fake of this model and fooled two people who know their bags (or that OP had the same exact fake of a fairly rare bag sitting around to execute a fraud).

Personally, I would use the bag and believe it to be authentic in this type of situation, but it looks like the most unfortunate consequence here is that OP would not be getting her bag back (since I believe Hermes destroys those items they deem fake). My heart goes out to the OP and all parties involved here. I can't even begin to think of who is at fault here.

As a separate discussion, I see microchips being brought up as an authentication feature. I have no idea if Hermes actually uses them, but I would be fascinated to learn more if that's the case. However, the odds of Hermes having the right technology in 2005 are minimal and I highly doubt that that is what Hermes used to issue an authenticity verdict. (As an aside, I may be wrong, but because of European data privacy laws, I believe Hermes would be required to tell customers if they did indeed use such technology).

 

[pinkiestarlet]

OP, so sorry to hear that there is the final decision from H, I was praying that it will be a good outcome but alas. I do hope the affidavit will offer more explanation to you.

 

[Rouge H]

At this point if it were me, I’d be on a flight to Paris retrieving my bag. No one has the right to destroy another’s property based on their opinions only. Especially since their opinions have been wrong in the past

 

[allywchu1]

feel very sorry for OP and also for such a beautiful bag...

 

[papertiger]

Was the post deleted suggesting Hermès maybe ....er ....lied? To discourage the resell market?

Not that I know of

 

[papertiger]

Not at all dear, I deleted my post because I realized that OP has made her decision based on what she believed ... and I think that is most important.

I've now deleted the empty post

 

[srubka99]

Ok, she only bought bag few months ago... so it could be that fake bag was produced based on super detailed photos of bag or maybe the fake producers had this actual bag and have made few copies based on real one. If the super copies are So good - couldn’t someone make a bag to tiniest details if they had photos of all of those details ? Hence bababei could compare it to her bags and they would look good enough... or second scenario where someone bought bag , made same and returned the fake one to reseller.... if someone made super fake with all right details maybe one could not say from photos it was actually fake?

 

[PJW5813]

If only bababebi could be invited to visit Hermes, examine the bag and discuss it with the Hermes experts.
It might then be possible to know the reasons why there is disagreement between them on the authenticity of the bag.

There have been too many unsubstantiated opinions about Hermes staff. Because they have been aired in the public domain, Hermes was being backed into a corner making it even more difficult to change its opinion.
It is good to see that some members are now responding to the wider picture trying to figure out how this problem happened. There does not seem to be an easy Occam's razor solution here.

With regard to returning the bag to OP, if Hermes consider it a fake it would be illegal for Hermes to export it from France. Likewise if Hermes stated it was fake it would be illegal for OP to go to Paris to retrieve (exporting would be involve) her bag, even if that were possible .