eBay, etc. General Question/Answer Thread

[Mulberrygal]

I'm probably a bit late to the party on this one. I've only recently noticed that Paypal no longer refunds fees when you refund a buyer
It's just not on! I've mostly only sold lower value items lately but what if this was an expensive handbag and someone files a SNAD totally unjustly. Do PP still withhold their fees if a refund is given? It's yet another reason to sadly have no faith in selling handbags on EBay!
There are so many situations where it's not the sellers fault. I have twice had bids on the same collection only item for example. The buyer has paid on both occasions then asked me to post it. I've ended up having to refund and PP have kept their fee! Is there anything I can do about this?

This has happened to me, fortunately only on low value sales. Buyer cancelled their purchase and I refunded before shipping.

PayPal changed their policy. As far as I know there's nothing you can do except increase your prices slightly.

It happened to me once with a $45 item. The buyer asked to cancel before shipping. It happened a few other times when I gave partial refunds or accepted returns. None of the items were particularly expensive. In March Paypal sent me a message that they were temporarily forgoing charging me fees on refunds through April 30 since I had been particularly affected by recent customer behavior. As it happened, I didn't have any returns or cancellations during that period.

Catbird, unfortunately putting up my prices won't help if I have to refund. I'm having to pay the buyer money from my own funds to make up the difference of PP charges If I charge more, I'll have to refund more out of my own pocket

Anyway..........this has just happened again and I'm really getting fed up now, 3rd one this week and through no fault of my own

Item was advertised as collection only. I asked the buyer when he would collect and he asked for delivery. I don't want to post as it's a bulky heavy item but I gave him a delivery price add on.........upshot, he didn't want to pay for delivery and asked for a refund.

Whateve, do you think I'm within my rights to withhold the amount PP are charging me? Can I just do a partial refund. I don't see why I should keep taking this out of my own pocket

 

[Catbird9]

Catbird, unfortunately putting up my prices won't help if I have to refund. I'm having to pay the buyer money from my own funds to make up the difference of PP charges If I charge more, I'll have to refund more out of my own pocket

I see your point but the idea is that not every order would need to be refunded so overall you would come out ahead.

Anyway..........this has just happened again and I'm really getting fed up now, 3rd one this week and through no fault of my own

Item was advertised as collection only. I asked the buyer when he would collect and he asked for delivery. I don't want to post as it's a bulky heavy item but I gave him a delivery price add on.........upshot, he didn't want to pay for delivery and asked for a refund.

Whateve, do you think I'm within my rights to withhold the amount PP are charging me? Can I just do a partial refund. I don't see why I should keep taking this out of my own pocket

I don't think you can, unfortunately. It's not set up that way, it's something you agree to by using the service.

I understand your frustration. I have almost given up selling on eBay and this is one of the reasons.

 

[whateve]

Catbird, unfortunately putting up my prices won't help if I have to refund. I'm having to pay the buyer money from my own funds to make up the difference of PP charges If I charge more, I'll have to refund more out of my own pocket

Anyway..........this has just happened again and I'm really getting fed up now, 3rd one this week and through no fault of my own

Item was advertised as collection only. I asked the buyer when he would collect and he asked for delivery. I don't want to post as it's a bulky heavy item but I gave him a delivery price add on.........upshot, he didn't want to pay for delivery and asked for a refund.

Whateve, do you think I'm within my rights to withhold the amount PP are charging me? Can I just do a partial refund. I don't see why I should keep taking this out of my own pocket

You can't do that.

 

[ksuromax]

this is beyond ridiculous!!
i placed an order on evil bay about a week ago, paid in full, and a few days later the Seller sent me a msg saying that due to current situation their usual shipping option is not available and they are exploring other ways of shipping my parcel to me. Yesterday he said that alternative logistics was also unable to deliver it, and in between i told him, if it's not possible i'm ok to cancel it for now and re-vist again when things clear up. So, yesterday when he said that alternative option was not available either, with apologies he advised that order would be cancelled with immediate refund.
ok, fine.
today i have checked my CC account and i see that my refund is 6.5$ short.
i asked the Seller why, and he sent me screenshot of the refund transaction where in the end of it PayPal fees were deducted from my refund.
WTF?? it was not a dispute, it was not anything that would involve PP at any stage to assist, why on earth they deduct anything from my refund?
it's not a big deal, mere 6.5$, but heck why???
what is if was a big deal??

 

[Mulberrygal]

I see your point but the idea is that not every order would need to be refunded so overall you would come out ahead.
I don't think you can, unfortunately. It's not set up that way, it's something you agree to by using the service.

I understand your frustration. I have almost given up selling on eBay and this is one of the reasons.

I'm only getting rid of a few, low cost items now Catbird and most are collection only so I'm having to pay the fees taken by PP when refunding the buyer
I don't see anything in the T&C's.when I use PP I'm agreeing to them not refunded that fee to me. PP say it's nothing to do with them and between me and the buyer.

You can't do that.

I've practically given up selling on eBay too. I feel the gain is too small and the hassle too big.

This withholding fees by PP is really infuriating I've had another one this week that's paid for a ollection only item. They live miles away and I know they won't be collecting. It's going to end up costing me money selling in this way, The item is too long for any courier to take.
Buyers just don't read the description.. ....I can't make it any easier. First line reads. COLLECTION ONLY!

What if I start the first line of the listing
COLLECTION ONLY - IF YOU PAY AND CAN'T COLLECT, I RESERVE THE RIGHT TO REFUND ONLY THE AMOUNT I RECEIVE FROM PAYPAL.

 

[Catbird9]

this is beyond ridiculous!!
i placed an order on evil bay about a week ago, paid in full, and a few days later the Seller sent me a msg saying that due to current situation their usual shipping option is not available and they are exploring other ways of shipping my parcel to me. Yesterday he said that alternative logistics was also unable to deliver it, and in between i told him, if it's not possible i'm ok to cancel it for now and re-vist again when things clear up. So, yesterday when he said that alternative option was not available either, with apologies he advised that order would be cancelled with immediate refund.
ok, fine.
today i have checked my CC account and i see that my refund is 6.5$ short.
i asked the Seller why, and he sent me screenshot of the refund transaction where in the end of it PayPal fees were deducted from my refund.
WTF?? it was not a dispute, it was not anything that would involve PP at any stage to assist, why on earth they deduct anything from my refund?
it's not a big deal, mere 6.5$, but heck why???
what is if was a big deal??

I'm wondering if this seller's terms mention any kind of "restocking fee" in case a buyer requests to cancel an order. Which it sounds like you did...sort of?

 

[ksuromax]

I'm wondering if this seller's terms mention any kind of "restocking fee" in case a buyer requests to cancel an order. Which it sounds like you did...sort of?

Seller sent me a screen shot, fully refunded
eBay CS operator suggested it could be due to currency exchange, she said it's indeed 6.5$ less in their records, too.
Anyway, i sent an email to PP, maybe they can enlighten me

 

[Catbird9]

I'm only getting rid of a few, low cost items now Catbird and most are collection only so I'm having to pay the fees taken by PP when refunding the buyer
I don't see anything in the T&C's.when I use PP I'm agreeing to them not refunded that fee to me. PP say it's nothing to do with them and between me and the buyer.

I've practically given up selling on eBay too. I feel the gain is too small and the hassle too big.

This withholding fees by PP is really infuriating I've had another one this week that's paid for a ollection only item. They live miles away and I know they won't be collecting. It's going to end up costing me money selling in this way, The item is too long for any courier to take.
Buyers just don't read the description.. ....I can't make it any easier. First line reads. COLLECTION ONLY!

What if I start the first line of the listing
COLLECTION ONLY - IF YOU PAY AND CAN'T COLLECT, I RESERVE THE RIGHT TO REFUND ONLY THE AMOUNT I RECEIVE FROM PAYPAL.

You could put terms in your listing. For example, you could reserve the right to charge a cancellation fee of 3%.

But for Pickup-only sales, maybe consider using Craigslist, Facebook, or another method of selling.

Here is a link to the current PayPal user agreement about how they're keeping the fees when you give a buyer a refund:

https://www.paypal.com/us/webapps/mpp/ua/useragreement-full#refunds-reversals-chargebacks

"If you refund a payment for goods or services, there are no fees to make the refund, but the fees you originally paid as the seller are not returned to you. The amount of the refunded payment will be deducted from your PayPal account."

I guess we should be grateful they're not charging us another fee to make the refund. Yet.

 

[BeenBurned]

this is beyond ridiculous!!
i placed an order on evil bay about a week ago, paid in full, and a few days later the Seller sent me a msg saying that due to current situation their usual shipping option is not available and they are exploring other ways of shipping my parcel to me. Yesterday he said that alternative logistics was also unable to deliver it, and in between i told him, if it's not possible i'm ok to cancel it for now and re-vist again when things clear up. So, yesterday when he said that alternative option was not available either, with apologies he advised that order would be cancelled with immediate refund.
ok, fine.
today i have checked my CC account and i see that my refund is 6.5$ short.
i asked the Seller why, and he sent me screenshot of the refund transaction where in the end of it PayPal fees were deducted from my refund.
WTF?? it was not a dispute, it was not anything that would involve PP at any stage to assist, why on earth they deduct anything from my refund?
it's not a big deal, mere 6.5$, but heck why???
what is if was a big deal??

I'm wondering if this seller's terms mention any kind of "restocking fee" in case a buyer requests to cancel an order. Which it sounds like you did...sort of?

Seller sent me a screen shot, fully refunded
eBay CS operator suggested it could be due to currency exchange, she said it's indeed 6.5$ less in their records, too.
Anyway, i sent an email to PP, maybe they can enlighten me

You could put terms in your listing. For example, you could reserve the right to charge a cancellation fee of 3%.

But for Pickup-only sales, maybe consider using Craigslist, Facebook, or another method of selling.

Here is a link to the current PayPal user agreement about how they're keeping the fees when you give a buyer a refund:

https://www.paypal.com/us/webapps/mpp/ua/useragreement-full#refunds-reversals-chargebacks

"If you refund a payment for goods or services, there are no fees to make the refund, but the fees you originally paid as the seller are not returned to you. The amount of the refunded payment will be deducted from your PayPal account."

I guess we should be grateful they're not charging us another fee to make the refund. Yet.

There's NO REASON why you shouldn't receive a refund of every cent you paid. You bought the item, paid for it and because of the seller's (BS) lack of inability to ship, you canceled.

I don't think "restocking fees" are ebay legal any longer and for full refunds, YOU should get your full payment but it costs the seller the paypal fee. The seller shouldn't be retaining any fee that is HER cost of doing business!

I'm not even sure why the seller can't ship by "their usual shipping option." I've sold quite a few items during the quarantine and USPS is still working, still shipping and still delivering. Some of my items were picked up at my home and for others, I was happy to take a "field trip" so I took them to the post office. I've seen some delays with items taking up to a few days longer to be delivered and I've also seen fewer interim scans. But otherwise, there have been no issues.

Although I don't ship by UPS or Fedex, I've also received items from them so I call BS on your seller.

 

[whateve]

There's NO REASON why you shouldn't receive a refund of every cent you paid. You bought the item, paid for it and because of the seller's (BS) lack of inability to ship, you canceled.

I don't think "restocking fees" are ebay legal any longer and for full refunds, YOU should get your full payment but it costs the seller the paypal fee. The seller shouldn't be retaining any fee that is HER cost of doing business!

I'm not even sure why the seller can't ship by "their usual shipping option." I've sold quite a few items during the quarantine and USPS is still working, still shipping and still delivering. Some of my items were picked up at my home and for others, I was happy to take a "field trip" so I took them to the post office. I've seen some delays with items taking up to a few days longer to be delivered and I've also seen fewer interim scans. But otherwise, there have been no issues.

Although I don't ship by UPS or Fedex, I've also received items from them so I call BS on your seller.

Her order was international. It's possible that some of the international options aren't available due to covid-19.

And I bet that the currency exchange is the reason for the difference.

 

[ksuromax]

Her order was international. It's possible that some of the international options aren't available due to covid-19.

And I bet that the currency exchange is the reason for the difference.

i suspect that, too, but i still do not understand why this works this way? there's an amount i paid in local currency, and it's reflected in eBay system, why the same amount is refunded back?
just for argument sake, if, e.g. the currency rate increased overnight, would that have resulted in refunding me more than i actually paid??
i don't think so

 

[BeenBurned]

Her order was international. It's possible that some of the international options aren't available due to covid-19.

And I bet that the currency exchange is the reason for the difference.

I didn't realize it was international but I still don't think an honorable seller would keep funds and not make a buyer whole when the buyer did nothing wrong and isn't responsible for the cancellation. (Even if the buyer requested to cancel, the reason was because the seller claimed she couldn't ship. How is that fair to the buyer?)

 

[Catbird9]

I don't think "restocking fees" are ebay legal any longer

You're right, I didn't know that.

Sellers can charge a "handling fee" as part of their shipping charge, though.

 

[BeenBurned]

You're right, I didn't know that.

Sellers can charge a "handling fee" as part of their shipping charge, though.

Yup, it's built in.

 

[N.M.Nevuhmynd]

Order for two items was placed Saturday morning.

Order Update email received Monday noon saying ''shipped'. USPS Tracking shows accepted at 4PM Monday.

Purchase History page shows one due today, 4/30 (which didn't happen) and the other due tomorrow, 5/1 even though they both have the same tracking number. USPS shows the one tracking number due Saturday, 5/2 and 'on time'.

I could have claimed the $5, but the other one came in on time. Didn't feel it was worth it, so I passed.

PayPal changed their policy. As far as I know there's nothing you can do except increase your prices slightly.

Keep in mind they are a payment processor. They processed the payment. Twice, once to the seller, then again back to the buyer.

For anyone that has a Merchant Account with a CC company, or any of the other newer payment services, how does this work? Do they also keep the fees?