Why Goldman Sachs Believes Coach's (COH) Turnaround Is Alienating Consumers

[whateve]

You're absolutely right about Kristin! I thought it was a great line and bought many pieces from it! I got turned off when all of the sudden they abandoned it, and upper end bags like the haircalf Kristin were just sent automatically to the outlet at blowout prices. TBH, I got rid of a LOT of my Kristin after this. I bought most of mine on PCE. I think I kept the original $1k woven Sage bags like in the link below (there were 3 colors, and they later came out with Laila versions which I bought but got rid of). That's pretty much it other than a patent crossbody I've used quite a bit on trips, etc.

http://www.ladyandtheblog.com/2011/...es-the-kristen-woven-sage-satchel-from-coach/

You're also right in that you don't get near the bang for the buck like you used to a few years ago. I guess it's a combination of things, but it did get to a point where I looked at $800+ bags and couldn't rationalize even those on PCE when some of my earlier ones were nicer (at least to me). So slowly I stopped buying.

I got into Bal a while as well. I was first attracted in a very MAJOR way by the outremer color, and it kind of blew up a bit from there, lol! I haven't bought a Bbag in a while, though. I wonder what people think of Alexander Wang taking over the reins? I did look the other weekend at NM because I'm getting urge again for a bag, and I think I want a mini City or regular City, but so far the colors have not enticed me. I have been buying a bit of Alexander Wang's bags too since I (mostly) left Coach. I really like the Rocco/Rockie.

Yes, the colors and styles.... I think they did have to back off production, and taking fewer color risks and cutting back the number of styles I guess had to happen as well, but I don't want a whole wardrobe of black, and it seems the bags I like from SV's line are black or red. I love the red nubuck Rhyder, but I also just bought red currant and a black bag from the line, so I'm not sure I want other red or black bags. There are colors I like in the Rhyder 24, Crosby, and Edie, so perhaps I'll pick up some of those when they go on sale, which I think they will because I haven't seen the dept stores selling many of them (at least as of now). As for leather, I do think the Dakotah leather is nice, but the lining and how they are doing the creed now is a little disappointing to me, especially when I look at Legacy Thompson, Legacy, etc, from a few years ago. Maybe I'm just an old dog at this point!

Oh, and there is a Bal outlet at Woodbury Commons in NY. Don't know if there's another one, but I've never seen the popular bags there (although I haven't been in a while). Definitely not like Coach, MK, etc, though! I hate the ripping off of retail bags, especially from lines that were never supposed to go to the outlet (i.e. Legacy, Poppy, etc). Not only did they blow the retail leftovers out at the outlets, albeit a bit later than they do now (6 months-1yr), but they actually made knockoffs for the outlet (MFF). I will never ever forgive them for taking the fuchsia Bleecker St. LE Legacy Peyton that was a Legacy shop/gallery store item in limited production and making a knockoff for the outlet. I walked in the outlet and both bags were sitting side by side on the table. My husband tells this story in EVERY Coach store we go in, lol! The MFF had slightly lower quality leather, but you know, people were picking up the MFF version not realizing the LE was also sitting there. Same color, etc., just cheaper grade, so the LE version was a far better deal given that it was an $800 bag. That's just one example of buying a "limited edition that you HAD TO GET NOW or it would be sold out forever" that ended up being knocked off. These bags were lower production than SV line, and yet some still ended up at the outlet...as well as being remade...and during better economic times! Nope, not believing ANYTHING they say regarding "limited edition" or "limited production". You simply never know what they might do. Who knows...they might restock the nubuck Rhyder since it was a hit like the Anna Sui Dragonfly, but you're absolutely right...by then everyone will have moved on, and they will probably end up at the outlets. Unless they make firm changes and stop doing this kind of stuff, they will never succeed in keeping the customers that they seem to be looking for. BTW, I loved the Anna Sui bags so much I bought two of the fleur de lis because I was afraid I would ruin the first one...so one at PCE and one at full price (that one was $1k and the dragonfly $800)! I don't think I ever got the full price adjusted to PCE price either. Also PCE for dragonfly, and guess what ended up at the outlets after being restocked, taking the "limited" factor out of play?? I didn't look back because I loved the bags, and to this day, I have not returned the new one I haven't used, but once you have this happen year after year, you stop believing that anything will change despite their promises. This is why I have my "firm" one retail full price bag rule for fall. I'm actually loving the Nordies sales and price matching these days...for other brands.

I went to Woodbury Commons earlier this year, thinking I was going to get a lot of great deals on premium brands. You're right, there is nothing at the Bal outlet other than a few odd colors and styles. The same was true at the Dior outlet. All they had were the large yellow Anselm Reyle camouflage bags. My dream bag is a quilted Versace. They had some quilted bags at the Versace outlet, but nothing fantastic, and the discounts weren't very good.

The Coach outlet was so crowded I couldn't even get into the door. Coach wants to redefine themselves as a luxury brand, but if to do so would mean limiting the number of outlets and the merchandise in the outlets, I don't know if they would do it. The outlets are where they make the profits; I don't see how they could scale them back. With recent reports that they are closing many FP stores and converting others into outlets, it seems like they are more committed to the outlets than FP.

 

[ltbag]

You're absolutely right about Kristin! I thought it was a great line and bought many pieces from it! I got turned off when all of the sudden they abandoned it, and upper end bags like the haircalf Kristin were just sent automatically to the outlet at blowout prices. TBH, I got rid of a LOT of my Kristin after this. I bought most of mine on PCE. I think I kept the original $1k woven Sage bags like in the link below (there were 3 colors, and they later came out with Laila versions which I bought but got rid of). That's pretty much it other than a patent crossbody I've used quite a bit on trips, etc.

http://www.ladyandtheblog.com/2011/...es-the-kristen-woven-sage-satchel-from-coach/

You're also right in that you don't get near the bang for the buck like you used to a few years ago. I guess it's a combination of things, but it did get to a point where I looked at $800+ bags and couldn't rationalize even those on PCE when some of my earlier ones were nicer (at least to me). So slowly I stopped buying.

I love reading your posts. I am a nyc girl so I used to go to the Bal outlet at Woodbury and they never had the moto line there. Most premier designers either have stuff made for their outlets like Gucci or they get the weird stuff that no one wants. Coach is the only brand I know of that take their best selling bags and remove them mid-season to the outlet.

I too, bought tons of Kristins. I had sages, wovens, every color you could think of. But when they killed the line, I got angry and started to give them away to friends. (I don't resell my bags, I give them away when I am done with them). I now don't have any Kristins. Same with Phoebe. I loved it when it came out, bought a bunch of colors and when they started selling them dirt cheap at the outlets, I gave all of mine away.

I think all but a few of the Vevers bags will end up at the outlet. They may try to keep them back until after the semi-annual sale or they may try to quietly sell them through other liquidation points like saks off fifth instead of the outlets. But they made too many of them and no one wants them at full price and they will end up somewhere.

As for the Dakotahs, well I bought them at 25% off (except for the teal which I paid full price for) and I will be ok if they end up at the outlets. I think the ones with the tons of fringe that close with a turnlock will definitely end up at the outlet. I have not seen even ONE reveal of that style here and I dont think it is selling. If the Vevers stuff all ends up at the outlets at the same pace other things end up at the outlets then this new strategy will be dead.

As for the hype of "sell outs" don't believe it. Net a porter gets very few of anything and is basically a marketing ploy for Coach. The red suede Rhyder 33 is still available on all the Asia sites, and I think small amounts of the clothing were made to see if it would sell at all so sell outs don't mean a lot.

I buy Coach because the other brands i like do not seem worth the money right now either. I have tons of bbags in every color and I don't need another one. The Dakotahs were truly something new, and that is why I am still buying Coach at least at this point...

 

[abwd]

You're absolutely right about Kristin! I thought it was a great line and bought many pieces from it! I got turned off when all of the sudden they abandoned it, and upper end bags like the haircalf Kristin were just sent automatically to the outlet at blowout prices. TBH, I got rid of a LOT of my Kristin after this. I bought most of mine on PCE. I think I kept the original $1k woven Sage bags like in the link below (there were 3 colors, and they later came out with Laila versions which I bought but got rid of). That's pretty much it other than a patent crossbody I've used quite a bit on trips, etc.

http://www.ladyandtheblog.com/2011/...es-the-kristen-woven-sage-satchel-from-coach/

You're also right in that you don't get near the bang for the buck like you used to a few years ago. I guess it's a combination of things, but it did get to a point where I looked at $800+ bags and couldn't rationalize even those on PCE when some of my earlier ones were nicer (at least to me). So slowly I stopped buying.

I got into Bal a while as well. I was first attracted in a very MAJOR way by the outremer color, and it kind of blew up a bit from there, lol! I haven't bought a Bbag in a while, though. I wonder what people think of Alexander Wang taking over the reins? I did look the other weekend at NM because I'm getting urge again for a bag, and I think I want a mini City or regular City, but so far the colors have not enticed me. I have been buying a bit of Alexander Wang's bags too since I (mostly) left Coach. I really like the Rocco/Rockie.

Yes, the colors and styles.... I think they did have to back off production, and taking fewer color risks and cutting back the number of styles I guess had to happen as well, but I don't want a whole wardrobe of black, and it seems the bags I like from SV's line are black or red. I love the red nubuck Rhyder, but I also just bought red currant and a black bag from the line, so I'm not sure I want other red or black bags. There are colors I like in the Rhyder 24, Crosby, and Edie, so perhaps I'll pick up some of those when they go on sale, which I think they will because I haven't seen the dept stores selling many of them (at least as of now). As for leather, I do think the Dakotah leather is nice, but the lining and how they are doing the creed now is a little disappointing to me, especially when I look at Legacy Thompson, Legacy, etc, from a few years ago. Maybe I'm just an old dog at this point!

Oh, and there is a Bal outlet at Woodbury Commons in NY. Don't know if there's another one, but I've never seen the popular bags there (although I haven't been in a while). Definitely not like Coach, MK, etc, though! I hate the ripping off of retail bags, especially from lines that were never supposed to go to the outlet (i.e. Legacy, Poppy, etc). Not only did they blow the retail leftovers out at the outlets, albeit a bit later than they do now (6 months-1yr), but they actually made knockoffs for the outlet (MFF). I will never ever forgive them for taking the fuchsia Bleecker St. LE Legacy Peyton that was a Legacy shop/gallery store item in limited production and making a knockoff for the outlet. I walked in the outlet and both bags were sitting side by side on the table. My husband tells this story in EVERY Coach store we go in, lol! The MFF had slightly lower quality leather, but you know, people were picking up the MFF version not realizing the LE was also sitting there. Same color, etc., just cheaper grade, so the LE version was a far better deal given that it was an $800 bag. That's just one example of buying a "limited edition that you HAD TO GET NOW or it would be sold out forever" that ended up being knocked off. These bags were lower production than SV line, and yet some still ended up at the outlet...as well as being remade...and during better economic times! Nope, not believing ANYTHING they say regarding "limited edition" or "limited production". You simply never know what they might do. Who knows...they might restock the nubuck Rhyder since it was a hit like the Anna Sui Dragonfly, but you're absolutely right...by then everyone will have moved on, and they will probably end up at the outlets. Unless they make firm changes and stop doing this kind of stuff, they will never succeed in keeping the customers that they seem to be looking for. BTW, I loved the Anna Sui bags so much I bought two of the fleur de lis because I was afraid I would ruin the first one...so one at PCE and one at full price (that one was $1k and the dragonfly $800)! I don't think I ever got the full price adjusted to PCE price either. Also PCE for dragonfly, and guess what ended up at the outlets after being restocked, taking the "limited" factor out of play?? I didn't look back because I loved the bags, and to this day, I have not returned the new one I haven't used, but once you have this happen year after year, you stop believing that anything will change despite their promises. This is why I have my "firm" one retail full price bag rule for fall. I'm actually loving the Nordies sales and price matching these days...for other brands.

I remember getting this Legacy Tote for around $400 and I walked in the outlet a month later and they had a cardboard horrible version that was exactly the same. I was actually carrying this bag and customers started picking up the MFF whiskey color and saying that it looked great on me!!! I was absolutely dumbfounded!!!

I stopped buying Coach after that and saved my $$ for Burberry, Chanel , and LV!!

I came back with the Borough and started liking some of the styles again. And with the price points rising for the other brands as well, I just didn't think they were worth it either.

 

[whateve]

I remember getting this Legacy Tote for around $400 and I walked in the outlet a month later and they had a cardboard horrible version that was exactly the same. I was actually carrying this bag and customers started picking up the MFF whiskey color and saying that it looked great on me!!! I was absolutely dumbfounded!!!

I stopped buying Coach after that and saved my $$ for Burberry, Chanel , and LV!!

I came back with the Borough and started liking some of the styles again. And with the price points rising for the other brands as well, I just didn't think they were worth it either.

View attachment 2776746

My MFF Zoe from 2009 has fantastic leather. You can't tell it from FP. I almost think this is worse. If I had bought one at FP and then saw the identical bag made for outlet selling at less than half what I paid, I'd be madder than seeing a delete.

My last few purchases have been Henri Bendel. I really love the quality, the price, and the fact that I never see anyone else with them.

 

[abwd]

My MFF Zoe from 2009 has fantastic leather. You can't tell it from FP. I almost think this is worse. If I had bought one at FP and then saw the identical bag made for outlet selling at less than half what I paid, I'd be madder than seeing a delete.

My last few purchases have been Henri Bendel. I really love the quality, the price, and the fact that I never see anyone else with them.

Mad doesn't begin to describe it. It didn't have the Legacy striped lining, but everything else was identical. It is like seeing a counterfeit if your bag, but Coach was making it and pushing it!

 

[abwd]

My MFF Zoe from 2009 has fantastic leather. You can't tell it from FP. I almost think this is worse. If I had bought one at FP and then saw the identical bag made for outlet selling at less than half what I paid, I'd be madder than seeing a delete.

My last few purchases have been Henri Bendel. I really love the quality, the price, and the fact that I never see anyone else with them.

I will have to check out Henri Bendel!!

 

[ltbag]

My last few purchases have been Henri Bendel. I really love the quality, the price, and the fact that I never see anyone else with them.

I love Henri Bendel accessories. I have some scarfs, key fobs, makeup bags etc. I have not bought a bag yet though but I love that store.

 

[whateve]

I will have to check out Henri Bendel!!

I love Henri Bendel accessories. I have some scarfs, key fobs, makeup bags etc. I have not bought a bag yet though but I love that store.

I have three pieces from the No. 7 collection. It was made to commemorate Chanel (Henri Bendel was the first retailer to introduce Chanel to the US) and the nappa leather is just as soft and scrumptious as Chanel's. I also have a clutch in a beautiful caviar leather and several fobs. I have some jewelry too. If I had a store near me, I'm sure I'd have more of everything.

 

[abwd]

I love Henri Bendel accessories. I have some scarfs, key fobs, makeup bags etc. I have not bought a bag yet though but I love that store.

My MFF Zoe from 2009 has fantastic leather. You can't tell it from FP. I almost think this is worse. If I had bought one at FP and then saw the identical bag made for outlet selling at less than half what I paid, I'd be madder than seeing a delete.

My last few purchases have been Henri Bendel. I really love the quality, the price, and the fact that I never see anyone else with them.

Oh s$!t. I am screwed. These are beautiful!!!!

 

[CoachMaven]

I have three pieces from the No. 7 collection. It was made to commemorate Chanel (Henri Bendel was the first retailer to introduce Chanel to the US) and the nappa leather is just as soft and scrumptious as Chanel's. I also have a clutch in a beautiful caviar leather and several fobs. I have some jewelry too. If I had a store near me, I'm sure I'd have more of everything.

I just moseyed over to the Henri Bendel site. Oh.....my.....goodness!!! I love MANY of their designs! I think I just found a new designer to collect....

 

[swags]

I remember getting this Legacy Tote for around $400 and I walked in the outlet a month later and they had a cardboard horrible version that was exactly the same. I was actually carrying this bag and customers started picking up the MFF whiskey color and saying that it looked great on me!!! I was absolutely dumbfounded!!!

I stopped buying Coach after that and saved my $$ for Burberry, Chanel , and LV!!

I came back with the Borough and started liking some of the styles again. And with the price points rising for the other brands as well, I just didn't think they were worth it either.

View attachment 2776746

This was my favorite leather. The leather they used for the knockoff version wasn't terrible but they should not have copied that line imo. I still think they should make a few pieces from the 2006 legacy line a classic.

The bag I am seeing all over town now is the leather phoebe. It is a good looking bag. I am not seeing as much signature these days.

 

[CoachMaven]

I remember getting this Legacy Tote for around $400 and I walked in the outlet a month later and they had a cardboard horrible version that was exactly the same. I was actually carrying this bag and customers started picking up the MFF whiskey color and saying that it looked great on me!!! I was absolutely dumbfounded!!!

I stopped buying Coach after that and saved my $$ for Burberry, Chanel , and LV!!

I came back with the Borough and started liking some of the styles again. And with the price points rising for the other brands as well, I just didn't think they were worth it either.

View attachment 2776746

I had this exact bag design in the straw version with white leather trim. While I loved it, it didn't fit right on the shoulders. I really, really wish they'd remake this line though, because I would love a Gigi this time around!!!

 

[abwd]

I had this exact bag design in the straw version with white leather trim. While I loved it, it didn't fit right on the shoulders. I really, really wish they'd remake this line though, because I would love a Gigi this time around!!!

The Gigi was amazing but crippling. To this day I have never carried anything so heavy!!! I had the evergreen which was more of a light blue/sea foam and was one of the most gorgeous bags I have ever owned. Unfortunately, the leather turned funky yellow a couple of years ago and I had to send her back.

It was probably for the best because she was a beast!!!!

 

[abwd]

This was my favorite leather. The leather they used for the knockoff version wasn't terrible but they should not have copied that line imo. I still think they should make a few pieces from the 2006 legacy line a classic.

The bag I am seeing all over town now is the leather phoebe. It is a good looking bag. I am not seeing as much signature these days.

If they were smart, they would do an anniversary line in 2016 and bring some of these beauties back.

 

[nerual13]

If they were smart, they would do an anniversary line in 2016 and bring some of these beauties back.

don't hold your breath