What do y'all think about the Balenciaga SS23 & Adidas collab "teddy" controversy?

[Swanky]

Bears repeating!

We'd like to leave this thread open, but political conspiracy theories, among other comments need to stop. Discuss the topic only please, let's keep the discussion open and all responses to others need to remain respectful.

Also, let’s stick closely to topic, it really helps preventing tangents and drama.

 

[Love Of My Life]

Many will continue to question, has Balenciaga learned anything about this campaign &
the ramifications that it has had on the brand?
The apologies.. many are just not buying into all of it
Time will tell & with a couture collection coming up in January, it will be interesting to
see how the clientele respond to the show as it will be several weeks since all this
controversary began
If Denma was to be fired it would have happened by now as well as if he was going to resign that
would have happened too, JMO

 

[roomservicemenu]

I have decided that this is my last post on this thread and I need not comment much further.

I am a contemporary artist and fashion designer and I do like the driving concept behind Balenciaga's brilliant dissection of American culture (at least a fringe element) through the ad. It is pretty postmodern and works well as an anti-ad ad.

Unfortunately, the ad which is directed more at an European audience who understands irony and sociopolitical commentary failed terribly with an American audience. We just don't have any understanding of subtle satire/subversion/dark humor; but in case, at this point, I feel that I am going to be speaking to deaf ears and I will remain to support Demna as much as I can.

They have nothing to apologize at this point. In any case, Balenciaga should think hard and just makes ads specifically for Americans and then ads for the rest of the world. That will solve the problem. (Look at the news coverage for this flap up; we aren't getting much out of American news coverage).

Their most brilliant idea: "Supporting Balenciaga’s Spring/Summer 2023 collection, the ‘Garde-Robe’ campaign, which featured the likes of Bella Hadid and Nicole Kidman, saw Balenciaga opt for an “office” theme that displayed a host of legal documents across the set, with a page from a Supreme Court ruling of United States v. Williams being spotted. The document included several references to child pornography, with the case ultimately deeming the promotion of child pornography illegal and not protected under freedom of speech."

If there is any other fashion news which has such intellectual depth like Balenciaga, please tell me. Anyways I'm finally out of this room.

EDIT: In order to understand what the ad is really about, you must look at Bliss Foster's video about the ad regarding clones. It's a very cynical look at our world today where celebrity is all about cloning. Like Kim is a clone of Kanye, etc.



I will end this on a quote by Jean BAUDRILLARD about cloning and sexuality: "What, if not a death drive, would push sexed beings to regress to a form of reproduction prior to sexuation (besides, isn't it this form of scissiparity, this reproduction and proliferation through pure contiguity that is for us, in the depths of our imaginary, death and the death drive - what denies sexuality and wants to annihilate it, sexuality being the carrier of life, that is to say of a critical and mortal form of reproduction?) and that, at the same time, would push them metaphysically to deny all alterity, all alteration of the Same in order to aim solely for the perpetuation of an identity, a transparency of the genetic inscription no longer even subject to the vicissitudes of procreation?"

SECOND POSTSCRIPT: Regarding the ruling, we have https://www.beaconbroadside.com/broadside/2008/06/what-were-they.html

Balenciaga ads tend to be very hypertextual and refer one to another. Basically the child ad is a commentary on that ruling shown in another ad. In any case, from the article we quote "The Court's ratification of a flat ban on child pornography had a relatively minimal impact on the First Amendment. Admittedly, the ruling did cause serious problems for some photographers, ranging from parents taking innocuous photos of their children to fine art photographers whose works included nude photos of children (among the more well-known examples are David Hamilton, Jock Sturges, and Sally Mann). But on the whole, it was relatively easy to draw a bright line between legal and illegal images, and law enforcement made substantial progress in fighting child pornography.

Most of those gains, however, have been wiped out by computers, the Internet, and digital cameras, all of which have made the production and distribution of child pornography vastly easier and far more difficult to combat. These new technologies have also blurred the previously bright line between legal and illegal images: many websites feature very young-looking but still adult models; some individuals use software to blend two or more legal images into composite child pornography; and others use animation software to create completely artificial (but increasingly realistic) child pornography images."

Demna is just brilliant. He understands the pulse of our digital age where children are being exploited. He is a refugee and knows that the current situation in the Ukraine is where we are seeing violence against children happen again and again. (https://thehill.com/policy/internat...n-have-been-raped-tortured-by-russian-forces/)

Once again, we tend to be complaining about an ad and Demna is pointing out that we are all armchair hypocrites for raising arms about child exploitation while ignoring where the real violence against children is happening.

“European audience”, Europe is a continent with 44 different countries all having their own cultures, languages and history. What European audiences are you talking about exactly? What country? Do you mean all of them?

 

[chloehandbags]

Don't think I can answer without deletion, due to it being off topic, but the bunny thing is referenced in Alice in Wonderland (which has connections with p*dophilia, due to its author being that way inclined) and Hugh Hefner openly called all the women he kind of collected throughout his life "bunny girls", so we know the latter isn't "conspiracy theory", at least.

It really happened, in front of us all.

It was even televised.

Also, I should add that I know "Angel" is a word they use to describe certain unfortunate children, as I was told it was straight from the horse's mouth, as it were.

He had no reason to lie.

 

[heatherB]

I have decided that this is my last post on this thread and I need not comment much further.

I am a contemporary artist and fashion designer and I do like the driving concept behind Balenciaga's brilliant dissection of American culture (at least a fringe element) through the ad. It is pretty postmodern and works well as an anti-ad ad.

Unfortunately, the ad which is directed more at an European audience who understands irony and sociopolitical commentary failed terribly with an American audience. We just don't have any understanding of subtle satire/subversion/dark humor; but in case, at this point, I feel that I am going to be speaking to deaf ears and I will remain to support Demna as much as I can.

They have nothing to apologize at this point. In any case, Balenciaga should think hard and just makes ads specifically for Americans and then ads for the rest of the world. That will solve the problem. (Look at the news coverage for this flap up; we aren't getting much out of American news coverage).

Their most brilliant idea: "Supporting Balenciaga’s Spring/Summer 2023 collection, the ‘Garde-Robe’ campaign, which featured the likes of Bella Hadid and Nicole Kidman, saw Balenciaga opt for an “office” theme that displayed a host of legal documents across the set, with a page from a Supreme Court ruling of United States v. Williams being spotted. The document included several references to child pornography, with the case ultimately deeming the promotion of child pornography illegal and not protected under freedom of speech."

If there is any other fashion news which has such intellectual depth like Balenciaga, please tell me. Anyways I'm finally out of this room.

EDIT: In order to understand what the ad is really about, you must look at Bliss Foster's video about the ad regarding clones. It's a very cynical look at our world today where celebrity is all about cloning. Like Kim is a clone of Kanye, etc.



I will end this on a quote by Jean BAUDRILLARD about cloning and sexuality: "What, if not a death drive, would push sexed beings to regress to a form of reproduction prior to sexuation (besides, isn't it this form of scissiparity, this reproduction and proliferation through pure contiguity that is for us, in the depths of our imaginary, death and the death drive - what denies sexuality and wants to annihilate it, sexuality being the carrier of life, that is to say of a critical and mortal form of reproduction?) and that, at the same time, would push them metaphysically to deny all alterity, all alteration of the Same in order to aim solely for the perpetuation of an identity, a transparency of the genetic inscription no longer even subject to the vicissitudes of procreation?"

SECOND POSTSCRIPT: Regarding the ruling, we have https://www.beaconbroadside.com/broadside/2008/06/what-were-they.html

Balenciaga ads tend to be very hypertextual and refer one to another. Basically the child ad is a commentary on that ruling shown in another ad. In any case, from the article we quote "The Court's ratification of a flat ban on child pornography had a relatively minimal impact on the First Amendment. Admittedly, the ruling did cause serious problems for some photographers, ranging from parents taking innocuous photos of their children to fine art photographers whose works included nude photos of children (among the more well-known examples are David Hamilton, Jock Sturges, and Sally Mann). But on the whole, it was relatively easy to draw a bright line between legal and illegal images, and law enforcement made substantial progress in fighting child pornography.

Most of those gains, however, have been wiped out by computers, the Internet, and digital cameras, all of which have made the production and distribution of child pornography vastly easier and far more difficult to combat. These new technologies have also blurred the previously bright line between legal and illegal images: many websites feature very young-looking but still adult models; some individuals use software to blend two or more legal images into composite child pornography; and others use animation software to create completely artificial (but increasingly realistic) child pornography images."

Demna is just brilliant. He understands the pulse of our digital age where children are being exploited. He is a refugee and knows that the current situation in the Ukraine is where we are seeing violence against children happen again and again. (https://thehill.com/policy/internat...n-have-been-raped-tortured-by-russian-forces/)

Once again, we tend to be complaining about an ad and Demna is pointing out that we are all armchair hypocrites for raising arms about child exploitation while ignoring where the real violence against children is happening.

Brilliant or human trash? I believe or may have been you who mentioned Terry Richardson earlier. Clearly many people thought he was brilliant to start, but he was clearly trash.

 

[Brooklynite]

Many will continue to question, has Balenciaga learned anything about this campaign &
the ramifications that it has had on the brand?
The apologies.. many are just not buying into all of it
Time will tell & with a couture collection coming up in January, it will be interesting to
see how the clientele respond to the show as it will be several weeks since all this
controversary began
If Denma was to be fired it would have happened by now as well as if he was going to resign that
would have happened too, JMO

I just learned that it was not just this campaign. This designer has featured babies, toddlers, dolls in runway shows, as recent as in September. Really nauseating.

 

[Noorasi]

Yes, the Balenciaga Mud Show for SS23 featured for example a male model carrying a baby doll and a bag with bloody blankets for the baby. It was not a toy looking doll, but one of those life-like expensive baby dolls with a very sad face. At the time I saw it as part of their end-of-the-world aesthetic of models stomping in mud like zombies. Of course now that they've continued to push the boundaries with the theme of suffering children, it looks less and less like a random misstep and has become a major vision that is being showcased and studied in their commercial materials.

It does look like exploring bad things that can happen to children has become part of their brand's current identity. As we've discussed, everyone's free to make their own decisions on whether that's an artistic discourse or something more sinister.

 

[dangerouscurves]

Our purchases maybe just a drop in the ocean but we have to boycott it collectively to make it more effective. Just remember, we all have the power.
At the end of the day, bags and shoes are their bread and butter and we were their costumers for them. Not these celebrities who are given for publicity.

 

[jimmyshoogirl]

Took me a few days to get through this thread. Whew. It’s a lot.

I don’t own any thing Balenciaga to not wear or get rid of, so what can I actually do? Aside from being mad and going back and forth on here or attacking someone from wearing the brand (which is hella weird). Is there a petition to sign to get rid of the director and his crew? Is there a email for the higher ups to spam? The only real action I’ve seen is @papertiger (kudos!!) writing a letter and the protesting.

ETA: I guess one thing I can do is stop buying my 7 year old son Addidas. He has tons

 

[caramello]

Not only that, but some people are very bad at hiding their perversions and have an impulse to tell other people what they are all the time.

Presumably, they get a kick out of it?

THIS! or they're trying to get a kick out of our reaction of whether we 'believe them' or not.

I just want to say I came on to this forum to see if TPFers were discussing this topic and having a deeper conversation about it as consumers of luxury items. I'm so glad for the open discussion as some of it has gotten into deeper layers and has been eye opening and shocking but nonetheless I'm glad I'm more informed.

 

[PRinLA]

Agreed… I have a couple of handbags from 2012 and 2015. I don’t wanna get rid of them but I don’t wanna get cancelled for wearing them either

I think it is completely unfair to judge or cancel someone for purchasing items that occurred before this mess. Balenciaga has an incredibly rich history and I feel like it’s throwing away the baby with the bath water to just never wear our items that we purchased and loved before.

Furthermore, I’ve been keeping an eye on Adidas news throughout the course of this incident and they just kept it pushing, churning out news content of their Bad Bunny Collab etc. I haven’t heard a peep of condemnation for their involvement with the second campaign. It sometimes feels like selective outrage.

Just my two cents. I understand and believe anyone is justified to think, believe and react however they wish to this but I do think it’s ridiculous to fault consumers in any capacity for items already purchased.

 

[addiCCted]

I have some balenciaga items from many moons ago and whilst I agree we shouldn’t retroactively condemn the product and people in the past, I will not be wearing these items in the near future. It’s a small maybe ineffectual protest but I don’t want to encourage more support for their brand. Also every time I look at my bags it just reminds me of this campaign. I have other nice things that can come out and play.

 

[QuelleFromage]

I'm certainly not planning on judging anyone by the brands they wear. Plenty of people are unaware of this situation, and the Bal sneakers in particular are popular across a really wide audience.

 

[mrceral]

Balenciaga photographer surprised by anger at kids with BDSM teddies

Gabriele Galimberti, 45, took the photos used by Balenciaga in their latest campaign, showing children with S&M teddies. He said parents were present and thought the bears were punk.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[LVLoveaffair]

And remember, there are many who have been gifted Balenciaga who don’t even know they are carrying Balenciaga, like my 90 year old Mom. Please give people some grace and don’t assume everybody knows what we know.

I agree but it’s hard to unsee some things. One comment can undo a lot in recent years. There’s so much boycotting anyway. I teach Kindergarten so this is a sore spot for sure.

 

[Yikkie]

I've long been over Balenciaga and all I could say now, is that I'm glad I've sold every single piece I owned.