Scarves Ode to the Vintage Scarves

[Serva1]

I think your scarf is beautiful!! Please keep collecting and posting - I am just loving the amount of work, creativity and inspiration an H scarf can have ...wear her in great health !

Thank you, love the inspiration and rich heritage of H scarves and yes, there is still space in my closet for more scarves and shawls especially for old vintage!

 

[sunyeo78]

Thank you, I have always loved history (all kinds of fields even cultural and art) and have a soft spot for tapestries. Hoping to visit France and see the Bayeux tapestry some day. How nice to have a son who is interested in European history, there is so much to explore and when travelling it makes the journey more interesting. Boys in their teens read less nowadays but reading is so important!

This one has some colour running issues but they are not so noticeable when wearing the scarf and with the special material (not 100% silk) just add character. Enclosed a pic, an 80 year old piece is seldom flawless

Love this amazing scarf!

 

[Serva1]

Love this amazing scarf!

Thank you sunyeo, I have been obsessed about vintage lately and I guess it’s because I love the brand and like to have more pieces in my collection that are unique and show the heritage of the brand

 

[Julide]

A question about vintage designs. Do we have an idea of how many colourways were produced back then? Today I know that the number varies but I wonder if the colourways were a lot less than what is produced now. TIA!!

 

[Serva1]

A question about vintage designs. Do we have an idea of how many colourways were produced back then? Today I know that the number varies but I wonder if the colourways were a lot less than what is produced now. TIA!!

This is a very good question, Julide, I’ve been thinking about this too and for my Tapisserie de Bayeux (1940) I have found 3 cws, but some have been made of another material.

 

[turfnsurf]

This is a very good question, Julide, I’ve been thinking about this too and for my Tapisserie de Bayeux (1940) I have found 3 cws, but some have been made of another material.

Agree! I believe the quantity of each early vintage issue was substantially less than today’s issues, and read somewhere that they might have produced on demand when they ran out (would account for different copyright marks; possibly as in Le Bois De Bologne. I imagine our very knowledgeable @marietouchet might know more accurate intel.

Received this Les Robes scarf from my mom which was given to her in 1968 from my father who passed away when I was young. Planning on having it framed due to the sentimental value it has. My mom forgot she had it until recently.

What an incredibly special keepsake!

 

[marietouchet]

A question about vintage designs. Do we have an idea of how many colourways were produced back then? Today I know that the number varies but I wonder if the colourways were a lot less than what is produced now. TIA!!

Many part question - quick answer. You almost have to specify which design, in which decade to get an accurate answer. Sorry to sound curt but there is no quick answer
VINTAGE SCARF - There is like 80 years of scarves and the answer is different in each decade
NBR CWS - You have to distinguish between nbr of cws per season, and nbr of cws ever produced. Ca 2000, you can go to the booklets, and some designs were done in back-to-back seasons, PERSEPOLIS was one of those rare ones in those booklets, 10 cws approx in SS and AW collections in same year, so, 20 cws total. But, that is only ca 2000, it was different and un-documented in the 1990s and ca 2010 etc.
For some 1950s-1960s ones, there seem to have been about 5 cws EVER printed, at same time? But, not for BDG, cf infra
EXCEPTIONS - there are some 40-50 CLASSIC designs, CLES, BDG, EX LIBRIS etc that have (almost) never been out of production. There were decades when you could walk into a store and get a light pink CLES. They kept printing the same cw, time and again - that is different yet again, same cw, diff printing

 

[Julide]

This is a very good question, Julide, I’ve been thinking about this too and for my Tapisserie de Bayeux (1940) I have found 3 cws, but some have been made of another material.

Thank you for responding Serva, yes in researching different eras, I have found it hard to know how many CWs were produced. I am happy to hear that I am not the only one on ato find out more information.

Many part question - quick answer. You almost have to specify which design, in which decade to get an accurate answer. Sorry to sound curt but there is no quick answer
VINTAGE SCARF - There is like 80 years of scarves and the answer is different in each decade
NBR CWS - You have to distinguish between nbr of cws per season, and nbr of cws ever produced. Ca 2000, you can go to the booklets, and some designs were done in back-to-back seasons, PERSEPOLIS was one of those rare ones in those booklets, 10 cws approx in SS and AW collections in same year, so, 20 cws total. But, that is only ca 2000, it was different and un-documented in the 1990s and ca 2010 etc.
For some 1950s-1960s ones, there seem to have been about 5 cws EVER printed, at same time? But, not for BDG, cf infra
EXCEPTIONS - there are some 40-50 CLASSIC designs, CLES, BDG, EX LIBRIS etc that have (almost) never been out of production. There were decades when you could walk into a store and get a light pink CLES. They kept printing the same cw, time and again - that is different yet again, same cw, diff printing

Thank you MT, I do not find your direct answer curt. I find it helpful. I had started my “research” last year when looking into vintage scarves. As you have mentioned as you progress to earlier designs circa 1960 and earlier you find a smaller quantity of CWs. I had asked because though I have found this to be true most of the time like you mentioned there have been a few designs which are not like the others, meaning more than a handful of CWs were produced. It had left me to question if they were: 1. A reissue mislabeled or 2. An oddity that season that may occur occasionally. Since many times I had not found supporting evidence of a reissue, it seams I must conclude in the later theory. Thank you for responding to my question

 

[marietouchet]

Thank you for responding Serva, yes in researching different eras, I have found it hard to know how many CWs were produced. I am happy to hear that I am not the only one on ato find out more information.


Thank you MT, I do not find your direct answer curt. I find it helpful. I had started my “research” last year when looking into vintage scarves. As you have mentioned as you progress to earlier designs circa 1960 and earlier you find a smaller quantity of CWs. I had asked because though I have found this to be true most of the time like you mentioned there have been a few designs which are not like the others, meaning more than a handful of CWs were produced. It had left me to question if they were: 1. A reissue mislabeled or 2. An oddity that season that may occur occasionally. Since many times I had not found supporting evidence of a reissue, it seams I must conclude in the later theory. Thank you for responding to my question

IMHO, to really answer the question throughly is impossible - let me give an example
LA REALE - I own some of the later ones, mine are ca 2000s, and I have 3 cws, I think that is a lot of any one design... I have photos of my later ones - see me for photos of light orange, burnt orange or wine cws from 2000s.
BUT, REALE has been done in like 70 cws, yes, I have collected photos of other cws of scarves that I dont own, I have photos covering 80 years
YES I have noticed that sometimes I misfile photos , I can get it wrong
YES there are unexplained things in the photos, I label those as CURIOSITY - not sure if they are authentic or fake - my system is that I make no judgments on some scarves that I dont own - they are good enough to pass for real in photos, but in person is different
I have collected photos of some 10 (or so different) variants of REALE, copyrights moved, font changed, etc suggesting 10 different printings
BUT, in order to share that here, I would need to share photos of scarves that I dont own - some would call them bootlegged photos
It is OK to collect photos for personal use, but sharing that is another matter entirely , no I am not a copyright expert, I solve the problem by choosing not to share photos of HS that I dont own
NO ONE single collector has enough HS or authorized photos from friends of all 70 variants of REALE, that is not possible.
And, of course the observations for REALE are totally diff from that for BDG, CLES, EX LIBRIS etc etc

 

[Julide]

IMHO, to really answer the question throughly is impossible - let me give an example
LA REALE - I own some of the later ones, mine are ca 2000s, and I have 3 cws, I think that is a lot of any one design... I have photos of my later ones - see me for photos of light orange, burnt orange or wine cws from 2000s.
BUT, REALE has been done in like 70 cws, yes, I have collected photos of other cws of scarves that I dont own, I have photos covering 80 years
YES I have noticed that sometimes I misfile photos , I can get it wrong
YES there are unexplained things in the photos, I label those as CURIOSITY - not sure if they are authentic or fake - my system is that I make no judgments on some scarves that I dont own - they are good enough to pass for real in photos, but in person is different
I have collected photos of some 10 (or so different) variants of REALE, copyrights moved, font changed, etc suggesting 10 different printings
BUT, in order to share that here, I would need to share photos of scarves that I dont own - some would call them bootlegged photos
It is OK to collect photos for personal use, but sharing that is another matter entirely , no I am not a copyright expert, I solve the problem by choosing not to share photos of HS that I dont own
NO ONE single collector has enough HS or authorized photos from friends of all 70 variants of REALE, that is not possible.
And, of course the observations for REALE are totally diff from that for BDG, CLES, EX LIBRIS etc etc

Thank you for the detailed explanation.I understand the copyright issue, so many things to be aware of now.
Do you think Hermes keeps a precise record of their scarves?

 

[marietouchet]

Thank you for the detailed explanation.I understand the copyright issue, so many things to be aware of now.
Do you think Hermes keeps a precise record of their scarves?

NO - not a PRECISE record
1 My basis for saying this is a 1990s issue of Le Monde - sorry cant remember which one off the top of my head - anyway there was an ad in there - H wanted to buy copies of its products that I did not have in its archives, it did not own copies of all its HS at the time
So, their archives were far from complete, and they have surely fill in some of the gaps, but where did they get the info? They are the experts, paradox
2 YES they have a database somewhere, cf supra regarding historical accuracy, but I doubt every SA has access to the gold standard database
3 WHAT IS AN ISSUE ? there is the pesky little question of H and limited production, they like you to believe their HS were/are all limited production, it is part of their mystique, bit directly contradicts the idea that the black ASTROLOGIE or pink CLES were never out of production for like 30-40 years, we KNOW that for certain, there are silks still in abundance with a cornucopia of copyrights
IMHO H likes to deliberately not answer questions fully, just like me LOL
They choose not to share what they know, I think the Coleno book was scrutinized, some problematic designs were deliberately omitted
If you had access to their COMPLETE (supposedly PRECISE) knowledge, it would be like patchy, a bit here, a bit there , a LONG story

 

[turfnsurf]

It’s Vintage week over at the SOTD thread & I thought I’d share some of my oldies over here as well...
L’Arrier Main-1969
Ascot 1831-1969
Petite Venerie-1968/‘71?
Les Robes-1968

Le Debuche-1968
Frontaux et Cocardes -1968
Paris - London 1850-1966/‘67?
Mors et Filets-1966

La Promenade de Longchamps-1965
Etriers-1964
Chiens et Valets-1963
Chateaux de France(Chateaux-Jardins)-1963

Cadre Noir-1963
Couvertures et Tenues de Jour-1962
Phaeton-1958 (black)
Phaeton-1958 (yellow)

Panache et Fantaisie-1958
Le Bois De Bologne-1957/58?
Harnais Francais-1957
Grande Vénerie Royale-1957

Versailles/Le Pave du Roy-1954
Grand Prix de Polo-1955
Harnais A l’Anglais-1955 (red/blue)
Harnais A l’Anglais-1955+ (wine/black)

 

[Jacaranda1]

Dear lovely ladies

I am new to pb so I am unsure as to where to direct this question - I am looking for an archive of all colour ways released on vintage scarves. I understand this would be a monumental task to document and I have looked at the usual online databases without much luck.
Does anyone have any sources or suggestions please?
Thanking you in advance.

Kindest Regards

 

[Jacaranda1]

Many part question - quick answer. You almost have to specify which design, in which decade to get an accurate answer. Sorry to sound curt but there is no quick answer
VINTAGE SCARF - There is like 80 years of scarves and the answer is different in each decade
NBR CWS - You have to distinguish between nbr of cws per season, and nbr of cws ever produced. Ca 2000, you can go to the booklets, and some designs were done in back-to-back seasons, PERSEPOLIS was one of those rare ones in those booklets, 10 cws approx in SS and AW collections in same year, so, 20 cws total. But, that is only ca 2000, it was different and un-documented in the 1990s and ca 2010 etc.
For some 1950s-1960s ones, there seem to have been about 5 cws EVER printed, at same time? But, not for BDG, cf infra
EXCEPTIONS - there are some 40-50 CLASSIC designs, CLES, BDG, EX LIBRIS etc that have (almost) never been out of production. There were decades when you could walk into a store and get a light pink CLES. They kept printing the same cw, time and again - that is different yet again, same cw, diff printing

Dear marietouchet

Would you be able to help if I am very specific?
I would like to find the colour ways released for Grande Largue - 1st ed. 1980, perhaps you can point me to a source?

Thanking you in advance.

 

[momasaurus]

Reviving this thread. What are your favorite vintage designs? Do you think H should revive/renew/refresh them (without just adding polka-dots)? PIX, PLEASE!