Chanel’s Rise & STALL: Defects, Difficulties & Deflection (formerly the 19 tote saga thread)

TPF may earn a commission from merchant affiliate
links, including eBay, Amazon, and others

#61
mpacia said:
I also want to point out that I just watched the YouTube video of a woman who I believe was posted earlier in this thread, who I believe you may be referencing. She is not a leather expert. She’s very well researched, but admits she’s not certain why the reissue bag leather appears the way it does, and goes into detail about other things she’s unsure about. She is not a leather expert!

To say the Chanel bags are not 100% leather is deceptive. The bags aren’t technically 100% leather because they have materials in place against the leather to create structure. So although a bag may not be “100%” solid leather the way a belt is it doesn’t mean the leather being used isn’t 100% leather. And this matters because there’s people on here saying or worrying their leather bag is fake, which is inaccurate.
Click to expand...
I am not referencing her. In the least. I am referencing lifelong leather experts, some of which have worked on more Chanel bags than any other leather expert in the world. Bonded leather is "technically" leather. Every leather is split. EVERY LEATHER. And there are grades to all of them. If something is premier leather grade, it's disclosed as such. "Top grain" or "full grain". Most places, when using 100% leather, disclose the items are 100% leather, like Chloe, or BV, or higher end LV bags. There are descriptors of materials used, in detail. Chanel doesn't disclose any of this, no record of which tannery, which process, and has no leather stamps anywhere, even in the enclosures. "Leather" does NOT mean "100% leather". I can run one of my "lambskin" 19's under water for 5 minutes and nothing absorbs. Nothing. That's more than a little coating, that means there are no pores in the leather. It's really all right there, you just have to be willing to look. And when bags arrive smelling like chemicals, it's not a good look.

I never said Chanel is fake leather. I said Chanel is making bags using bonded leather. And I stand behind that, as do leather experts who are repairing the hordes of Chanel bags coming directly to them from overseas in defective condition before they've even hit boutiques. THAT is a problem.
 
  • Like
  • Wow
Reactions: anitalilac, PurseCloset, littlebunnyfoufou61 and 22 others
#65
TraceySH said:
I am not referencing her. In the least. I am referencing lifelong leather experts, some of which have worked on more Chanel bags than any other leather expert in the world. Bonded leather is "technically" leather. Every leather is split. EVERY LEATHER. And there are grades to all of them. If something is premier leather grade, it's disclosed as such. "Top grain" or "full grain". Most places, when using 100% leather, disclose the items are 100% leather, like Chloe, or BV, or higher end LV bags. There are descriptors of materials used, in detail. Chanel doesn't disclose any of this, no record of which tannery, which process, and has no leather stamps anywhere, even in the enclosures. "Leather" does NOT mean "100% leather". I can run one of my "lambskin" 19's under water for 5 minutes and nothing absorbs. Nothing. That's more than a little coating, that means there are no pores in the leather. It's really all right there, you just have to be willing to look. And when bags arrive smelling like chemicals, it's not a good look.

I never said Chanel is fake leather. I said Chanel is making bags using bonded leather. And I stand behind that, as do leather experts who are repairing the hordes of Chanel bags coming directly to them from overseas in defective condition before they've even hit boutiques. THAT is a problem.
Click to expand...
I didn’t say you said the leather is fake, but there’s people saying they wonder if their leather bags are fake, that’s what I’ve been referencing this whole time.

I can’t chime in on what kind of leather is being used because I’m no expert and haven’t spoken to any. Does Hermes disclose their leather? I don’t recall seeing materials being described in my items from them. I’ve never received a Chanel item that didn’t smell anything other than leather, so I can’t say I’ve every come across anything with a chemical smell. And I guess I can’t recall looking at the paperwork inside Chanel items referring to what leather is used. I figure that’s what the code is for on the bags, to tell you what leather your bag is made from. I’ve never questioned the Chanel items I own because they’ve always smelled of leather.

But if you run a caviar bag under water it will also repel water. I don’t know how they make caviar leather but it’s clearly treated in an extensive fashion.

I worked in luxury retail and have been educated about the way a lot of items are made. It’s far more complex than some of us believe. Unless I speak to someone who worked with Chanel who can confirm the way something was made it’s hard to really know. I’m not saying you’re wrong about certain things, or other people are, but I don’t think the bonded leather is a general rule for a lot of their bags. It sounds like a new issue because there’s a lot of us on here who’ve had Chanel bags for years and this issue has only recently come up because of the Chanel 22 bags.
 
  • Like
Reactions: urma
#66
TraceySH said:
For our next round, we have Clorox degreaser w/ bleach sprayed on, rubbed in and wiped off with a Clorox wipe, then put back under hot water, dried off. "Lambskin" LMAO.

View attachment 5577485

View attachment 5577486

View attachment 5577487

View attachment 5577488

View attachment 5577489

View attachment 5577490

View attachment 5577491

View attachment 5577492
Click to expand...
You may not see effects now, but keep doing this and that area will wear. Not sure the coating they use, but I much prefer this than natural lamb.

This coating very much reminds me of my Proenza PS11 bag. I had no idea it was made from coated lamb until long after I purchased it. It looked brand new for months even after heavy every day use, but at some point when I took a closer look I could see the eventual breakdown of leather on a microscopic level. But otherwise it looked brand new for so long. I resold it and it still looked new although I could see the leathers cracking in certain areas that wasn’t visible to others.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Taty
#67
TraceySH said:
For our next round, we have Clorox degreaser w/ bleach sprayed on, rubbed in and wiped off with a Clorox wipe, then put back under hot water, dried off. "Lambskin" LMAO.

View attachment 5577485

View attachment 5577486

View attachment 5577487

View attachment 5577488

View attachment 5577489

View attachment 5577490

View attachment 5577491

View attachment 5577492
Click to expand...
I'm sorry but that Clorox degreaser on that bag is about to make me pass out at work. Wouldn't that break down the finish on the bag???? miss-j-confused.gif
 
  • Haha
  • Like
Reactions: barbiedollxo, Saturday14, luxurista and 25 others
#69
TraceySH said:
For our next round, we have Clorox degreaser w/ bleach sprayed on, rubbed in and wiped off with a Clorox wipe, then put back under hot water, dried off. "Lambskin" LMAO.

View attachment 5577485

View attachment 5577486

View attachment 5577487

View attachment 5577488

View attachment 5577489

View attachment 5577490

View attachment 5577491

View attachment 5577492
Click to expand...
Naked Lamb would not survive… it can probably handle some water but not super hot water , I’m surprised bag didn’t melt . We need a chanel leather cobbler/expert to dissect our 19 or 22 bags, peel it layer by layer ( video will go viral for sure). To me bonded leather for over $5k bag should at least last more than a day ha ha…
 
  • Like
Reactions: Taty, Imzp22, Roie55 and 8 others
#70
I’m so ambivalent about this since these synthetic leather coatings are supposed to be hard wearing and provide an extra layer of protection to these delicate leathers.

A lot of sneakers/leather craftsmen and customizers say this layer can be removed with a cheap leather deglazer (Amazon has the ones by Angelus for $5) or Acetone in a pinch.

these coatings as meant to withstand water at even hot temperatures and typical surface cleaners.
 
  • Like
  • Thanks
Reactions: Taty, platanoparty and bagsaremyjam
#71
mpacia said:
I didn’t say you said the leather is fake, but there’s people saying they wonder if their leather bags are fake, that’s what I’ve been referencing this whole time.

I can’t chime in on what kind of leather is being used because I’m no expert and haven’t spoken to any. Does Hermes disclose their leather? I don’t recall seeing materials being described in my items from them. I’ve never received a Chanel item that didn’t smell anything other than leather, so I can’t say I’ve every come across anything with a chemical smell. And I guess I can’t recall looking at the paperwork inside Chanel items referring to what leather is used. I figure that’s what the code is for on the bags, to tell you what leather your bag is made from. I’ve never questioned the Chanel items I own because they’ve always smelled of leather.

But if you run a caviar bag under water it will also repel water. I don’t know how they make caviar leather but it’s clearly treated in an extensive fashion.

I worked in luxury retail and have been educated about the way a lot of items are made. It’s far more complex than some of us believe. Unless I speak to someone who worked with Chanel who can confirm the way something was made it’s hard to really know. I’m not saying you’re wrong about certain things, or other people are, but I don’t think the bonded leather is a general rule for a lot of their bags. It sounds like a new issue because there’s a lot of us on here who’ve had Chanel bags for years and this issue has only recently come up because of the Chanel 22 bags.
Click to expand...
Yes, Hermes discloses in GREAT detail. But they've got their own issues too, and all machine made (except B, K, & a few parts of the C). I've noticed some of their leathers are thinner lately tho. You also said Chanel's lambskin is delicate. And, ummm, clearly it's not. Unless it's on a classic then it falls apart. I have some great pics of a pink lambskin jumbo I got last year that arrived discolored just from being in a box (BN from boutique). It was horrid. And Chanel did NOT stand behind that one (later the whole line was recalled).

I am not here to convince you. I really don't care if you buy or not. I have bought more Chanel than probably anyone on this forum. My posts here are for people who welcome information about making expensive purchases. They are not for people like you who don't want to hear, don't want to investigate, and don't want to see. So if it's not helpful for you, just move on. No need to belabor a point that you can't substantiate.

What you DO say, that's key, is that you "don't know". And you say that quite a few times. And this, THIS, is exactly the point. NO one knows anything 100% because Chanel chooses that. They choose to withhold information, withhold production and materials specificity, withhold transparency in the manufacturing chain, along with all the other things they keep from their customers (product information, colors, dimensions, release dates, rules, shipping restrictions, availability, exceptions, etc). They do it in all other areas too, RTW, even the diamonds that come in their fine jewelry (color? clarity? no disclosures). It's not circumscribed to "leather" products, it's the company approach in general. If that works for you, then great!
 
  • Like
  • Insightful
  • Haha
Reactions: anitalilac, gainzilla, Kohaku_River and 40 others
#75
TraceySH said:
Yes, Hermes discloses in GREAT detail. But they've got their own issues too, and all machine made (except B, K, & a few parts of the C). I've noticed some of their leathers are thinner lately tho. You also said Chanel's lambskin is delicate. And, ummm, clearly it's not. Unless it's on a classic then it falls apart. I have some great pics of a pink lambskin jumbo I got last year that arrived discolored just from being in a box (BN from boutique). It was horrid. And Chanel did NOT stand behind that one (later the whole line was recalled).

I am not here to convince you. I really don't care if you buy or not. I have bought more Chanel than probably anyone on this forum. My posts here are for people who welcome information about making expensive purchases. They are not for people like you who don't want to hear, don't want to investigate, and don't want to see. So if it's not helpful for you, just move on. No need to belabor a point that you can't substantiate.

What you DO say, that's key, is that you "don't know". And you say that quite a few times. And this, THIS, is exactly the point. NO one knows anything 100% because Chanel chooses that. They choose to withhold information, withhold production and materials specificity, withhold transparency in the manufacturing chain, along with all the other things they keep from their customers (product information, colors, dimensions, release dates, rules, shipping restrictions, availability, exceptions, etc). They do it in all other areas too, RTW, even the diamonds that come in their fine jewelry (color? clarity? no disclosures). It's not circumscribed to "leather" products, it's the company approach in general. If that works for you, then great!
Click to expand...
I said almost all their lambskin is delicate, with the exception of the 19. I don’t recall if I disclosed that, but I believe I did. I know that’s the only Chanel lamb that isn’t. I said almost all lambskin is extremely delicate, that’s a fact.

I’m not saying Chanel doesn’t have issues, they absolutely do!!! But to make a blanket statement that their bags are all made from bonded leather, etc, I believe is false. There’s a difference here. I have purchased SO many Chanel bags. And a lot of people have owned Chanel for a long time with no issues on their bags.

I’m not going to keep going back and forth with you. Stop buying Chanel then. You’re complaining about your one lamb bag being treated so much that you’re questioning the material. To me the original bag you posted doesn’t look anything like the 22 bag issues, it looks like the rubbing of your clothes ripped the lamb off.

I only came on here originally to say something about all the fake leather statements. I never said you were wrong. But I’ve literally never had your experience with chemical smelling products either.

I don’t think you want to see the other side to your argument. Just stop buying the bags and be done with it.
 
  • Like
  • Thanks
Reactions: Taty and lovieluvslux
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top