Barenia croc/alligator Birkin

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#91
bababebi said:
I believe I read once an old Le Monde d"Hermes article about oil curing the skins of Barenia alligator and crocodile but I cannot find it and I did not keep it. If anyone can find it that would be enlightening.

To the best of my knowledge Fauve is the color, it is color code #34 and Barenia is the skin. I assume that Barenia means the method of oil curing either the hides for the leather bags or the skins of exotic ones.

I am looking right now at an Hermes orange box tag that says "SAC BIRKIN 30 ALLIGATOR MISSISIPPIENSIS BARENIA
COLOR: 34 FAUVE"

Exotic Barenia comes in Niloticus Crocodile and Porosus Crocodile as well as Alligator. The color is always Fauve.
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:ty: for this, D! :flowers: I know we always have to be careful with water and leather, but everyone agrees with normal barenia we don’t have to be as careful. Does it same apply to exotic barenia? I have caught more than a fair share of water on the normal barenia, and would love to add a barenia croc if water is not a concern. :nuts:
 
#92
bababebi said:
I believe I read once an old Le Monde d"Hermes article about oil curing the skins of Barenia alligator and crocodile but I cannot find it and I did not keep it. If anyone can find it that would be enlightening.

To the best of my knowledge Fauve is the color, it is color code #34 and Barenia is the skin. I assume that Barenia means the method of oil curing either the hides for the leather bags or the skins of exotic ones.

I am looking right now at an Hermes orange box tag that says "SAC BIRKIN 30 ALLIGATOR MISSISIPPIENSIS BARENIA
COLOR: 34 FAUVE"

Exotic Barenia comes in Niloticus Crocodile and Porosus Crocodile as well as Alligator. The color is always Fauve.
Click to expand...

Respectfully I disagree with you. I have discussed an oil tanned (Bariena) exotic numerous times with my SA (at one of the largest stores in USA. When he inquired with Paris about obtaining a barenia, oil tanned, exotic my ONLY option was alligator as no other exotic skins are made this way. It may have been written in Le Monde that barenia exotics were available in other exotic skins, however only alligator is/was available for purchase. Maybe barenia croc was a window only piece? Fauve is a color. It can be obtained via oil tanning (fauve barenia) or via “regular” tanning process (barenia). This color is available in other exotic skins, however this will NOT be an oil tanned bag. The reason this gets so confusing is because most people assume the color is “fauve barenia” and refer to the color as such. This is incorrect. The color is fauve. The skin a type of leather (i.e. alligator or cow) and the dying process is barenia. Barenia is not a leather type. Barenia is the oil tanning process.

I have multiple alligator CDC and bearn wallets. If water gets on them a spot is left. Matte leaves less of a spot then gloss, however water spots appear on both. I assumed this would be the same for my barenia alligator bag and so I am always careful to check the weather and such. I got to thinking that maybe because the bag is oil tanned vs “regular tanned” (not sure the name of that process water spots would disappear like on a barenia cow (not sure what type of cow leather is used) leather bag? Or will water spots “stain”!on any alligator skin bag no matter how it’s tanned?

I will ask my SA that sold me the bag.
 
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#93
LVLover said:
I got to thinking that maybe because the bag is oil tanned vs “regular tanned” (not sure the name of that process water spots would disappear like on a barenia cow (not sure what type of cow leather is used) leather bag? Or will water spots “stain”!on any alligator skin bag no matter how it’s tanned?

I will ask my SA that sold me the bag.
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That is the ultimate question: would barenia exotic (croc or gator what not) be somewhat “waterproof” like regular barenia? I think maybe a craft-person would be more knowledgeable than the sales person though?

I am overseas right now, and wish I could speak the local language here, as their craft lady seems to be very knowledgeable, except her English is poor. *if* matte fauve barenia gator (or croc) indeed has the same water resistance quality as normal barenia, I would have to say the hunt is officially on... this would be my ultimate perfect bag!!! :nuts:

Can’t wait to learn more about it. :yes:
 
#94
xiaoxiao said:
That is the ultimate question: would barenia exotic (croc or gator what not) be somewhat “waterproof” like regular barenia? I think maybe a craft-person would be more knowledgeable than the sales person though?

I am overseas right now, and wish I could speak the local language here, as their craft lady seems to be very knowledgeable, except her English is poor. *if* matte fauve barenia gator (or croc) indeed has the same water resistance quality as normal barenia, I would have to say the hunt is officially on... this would be my ultimate perfect bag!!! :nuts:

Can’t wait to learn more about it. :yes:
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I agree, I'd trust craftsperson over sales every day, especially a salesperson who says Barenia is not a leather type. It absolutely is. Can you call croc and gator "Barenia" because it's tanned the same way as Barenia leather? Sure, but that does not mean there is not a leather type called Barenia. Barenia is actually a Tanneries Haas trademark (owned by Hermès).
 
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#95
QuelleFromage said:
I agree, I'd trust craftsperson over sales every day, especially a salesperson who says Barenia is not a leather type. It absolutely is. Can you call croc and gator "Barenia" because it's tanned the same way as Barenia leather? Sure, but that does not mean there is not a leather type called Barenia. Barenia is actually a Tanneries Haas trademark (owned by Hermès).
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QF I wonder, if you happen to be at Madison would you mind asking Pierre? Sorry if I’m imposing... He’s the only craft person I know who’s still there. :flowers: :ty:
 
#96
xiaoxiao said:
QF I wonder, if you happen to be at Madison would you mind asking Pierre? Sorry if I’m imposing... He’s the only craft person I know who’s still there. :flowers: :ty:
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Not imposing at all! Edouard, the newer craftsman there, is a friend of mine and as a matter of fact I need to bring a bag in for him to check on...I will ask one of them. I will be in Paris soon too and can ask there.
I want it to be true yet doubt any exotic is waterproof.....maybe just a little less delicate?
 
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#97
QuelleFromage said:
Not imposing at all! Edouard, the newer craftsman there, is a friend of mine and as a matter of fact I need to bring a bag in for him to check on...I will ask one of them. I will be in Paris soon too and can ask there.
I want it to be true yet doubt any exotic is waterproof.....maybe just a little less delicate?
Click to expand...

That’s great!!! Thanks so much. From my (limited) understanding, the tanning process is what makes barenia “water proof” sort of speak. That’s why I’m fascinated, and would really want to know once and for all. I noticed fauve barenia matte gator CDC is somewhat less water sensitive. Maybe it’s worth trying? (Although the thought of running anything croc under the water really makes me cringe....) :sad:
 
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#99
This is an interesting thread. About 10 years ago I special ordered a Fauve Croc 35 Birkin. When it it finally came, it was a 30 cm in Alligator. I did not want it, but a friend did and took it. Now I am realizing it was Barenia and not just matte like the Fauve crocodile I had seen. I had seen Fauve in niloticus matte and prorosus shiny.
Now I feel much more knowledgeable. When I have time I am going to look through some old Le Mondes for that article.
Have never had problem with water spots on matte niloticus.
 
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#100
birkel said:
I have been given a very serious confirmation darling!!!!!!!!!!! it's alligator tanned and crafted the way barenia leather is done. it's alligator because its the only skin that can resist the treatment and oils and well the barenia process,I'm told it will age and generate patina like barenia does including sense and even prone to scratches but its beautiful !!!!!!
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Do you have a photo of it? Thx
 
#104
Reviving this thread as a reseller offered me this bag (Birkin 30 2015) in alligator PHW, with a foil stamp. I checked it with an Hermès expert I know, a former craftsman with over 25 years experience with a focus on exotics, and he told me that only fauve alligator bags with a blind stamp (same as non-exotic Barenia) are Barenia alligator; foil-stamped bags are not Barenia-tanned but fauve Missisippiensis matte alligator; and the Barenia form does not exist in croc (again, just the fauve matte color). This is contrary to much of what I've seen on the forum. Can anyone corroborate or deny? merci mille fois! :flowers:
 
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