Do you think LV resale is affected by new Micro chip authentication

[Designer Patroit]

Fast fashion is even worse for the environment to be honest. And for those that are saying that they prefer date codes because they only buy preloved - well then you're not LV's customer at all so they really won't care about you and your preference for date codes. Don't get me wrong, I also buy pre-owned at times but I'm also cognizant that these purchases require due diligence beyond just looking at date codes, so an item not having one isn't a deal breaker for me.

LV cares about sales at their $$$$$ glamorous stores, I understand that, I would too.

 

[blossomette]

I visited LV this past weekend; a mess but it is what it is. The line was long, the wait even longer and it was appointment only so if you wanted to look around, you had to have an appointment. By the time DH and I went in, it was more than an hour after my appointment time, my assigned SA was who knows where and so, I looked around. A lot. As was just about every person there. Imagine a store with many people and they're looking and looking and trying on but not buying. That was what we experienced. They had NOTHING I was looking for in stock. Lots of the leather, little canvas (no slgs save a few card holders and wallets), no they couldn't get XYZ because it's OOS everywhere. No, we can't get ABC because it's HOT and therefore, OOS everywhere. Ready to wear and jewelry, scarves....no problem. In the end, I bought nothing. I DID ask about the chip; can I bring in a item to have it checked for the chip? No, was the answer. Will you show me where the chip is on the item I've purchased? No, was the answer. Can you always find the chip should a person return the bag? No, because they're not placed in the same place each time. Ok. Thank you. Good bye.

I'm thinking anyone could purchase a bag and then return a fake in it's place with all the real paperwork, box, etc based on what I was told. I've spoken with a few others (different forums and friends) and they're starting to wonder if LV gives a poot about them and their money possibly being spent on a fake? Look, I don't know anyone except a fool who is going to spend money on something and NOT care if it's the real deal especially if they spent top dollar. I can see this being a way to really slow down resellers but I'll be honest, hearing those SA's tell me all those "No's" did NOT give me warm fuzzies about purchasing the new items from LV either. Maybe it's just me.

when I return bags with a microchip, they won’t accept the exchange or return until after they find and scan the chip

 

[cjj]

when I return bags with a microchip, they won’t accept the exchange or return until after they find and scan the chip

Which makes sense. That said, I asked them if they can find the chip without issue and the reply I received was hemming and hawing and then a "kinda but not really" answer. So I can have ALL my orginal everything, go back to the same store and they can refuse the return with the procedure you mentioned. Do you know how ticked off I would be in the situation? Again, based on what I have been told (and friends who have asked SA's directly), the customer is NOT what LV appears to be concerned with (though we are the REASON they make a profit). Your example just reinforced why I and many others don't have faith in their new system. Which, I'm sure someone will point out, leaves more LV's for those who do. It leaves a bad taste in my mouth, as they say.

 

[Kevinh73]

Which makes sense. That said, I asked them if they can find the chip without issue and the reply I received was hemming and hawing and then a "kinda but not really" answer. So I can have ALL my orginal everything, go back to the same store and they can refuse the return with the procedure you mentioned. Do you know how ticked off I would be in the situation? Again, based on what I have been told (and friends who have asked SA's directly), the customer is NOT what LV appears to be concerned with (though we are the REASON they make a profit). Your example just reinforced why I and many others don't have faith in their new system. Which, I'm sure someone will point out, leaves more LV's for those who do. It leaves a bad taste in my mouth, as they say.

If a person is a known customer at her/his local store. I doubt they will wand the bag in front of her/ him to try to find the chip. If they dont recognize this person because she/he rarely go in/ buy from the store or just generally buy second hand LV bags and want sa to verify the authenticity of her/his bags, then obviously LV stores aren’t missing much. It really goes both ways. If this person buys multiple bags quarterly or minimally go visit her/his sa to chitchat (ie buy nothing but just want to be friendly and build a relationship), I‘m sure her/his sa will be more than happy to wand the bag this person got from a reseller. LV store is there to make money for LVMH shareholders. SA have quotas they have to meet (My understanding talking to several SA, it’s very stressful). They don’t have time to wand bags for random people.

 

[cjj]

Which means you can't be sure if your bag has a chip or not meaning you can't tell if it's a fake or not. Yes, it's just one way but it's the most important else, they wouldn't be looking for the chip to verify, now would they.

 

[lalame]

With all due respect: it is not a matter of opinion. The basic formula of the old date codes are freely available online to everytone. A sweatshop can look it up in seconds and start pushing out products with perfectly reasonable date codes. They want to make a Speedy B 25 in Damier Azur? They go to eBay, check the date codes on a few recent listings and start to vomit out bags with — again — perfectly accurate date codes. It is so easy that even you and I could do it. Looking up a date code and getting a metal stamp manufactured for it is done in a day for less than $30. This is nowhere near safe. And the date codes are not serial numbers, they are not for authentication. People here made a false religion, since they wanted to have faith in something, and they chose the date codes as the most important factor of authenticity. Not the materials, not the thread, not the leather, not the glazing, not the overall feel, but that basic industrial marking. The code, that is not just not unique at all, but by nature appears on thousands of items a week. For example: most canvas Keepalls and Bandoliere Speedys are made in Ducey, Normandy. Those products sell like hot cakes. It means that there are thousands and thousands of items with the exact same code of DU0211. How does that prove authenticity?
As @MissV absolutely accurately pointed out, these codes are not just simple serial numbers wth a formula that can be guessed. Reading them requires an LV owned iOS device and a secure connection to the LV server, that can decode it. If mere mortals decode the RFID chip's data, they only get a very long gibberish.
But imagine if some magician could find out the sercet formula and create a code. The code in itself would mean nothing, since it should be on the LV blockchain. Which means that LV product data is practically working like BitCoin. It is called a chain, because all of the elements are tied onto an indestructible chain. So basically:
- they produce a Speedy, they generate a unique code for it, and link that code to the end of the blockchain
- they make another Speedy, and they link its code after the previous code
- and so on, and so on...
This blockchain technology has 2 major benefits:
- no elements can be removed, since once 1 is removed, the whole chain collapsed, all data is broken
- no elements can be added in secret, if the server adds a new link to the chain, all the other 'chain pieces' will know about this, and it will be transparently visible for every user. So if a hacker would want to add a new link from the outside to the secure Louis Vuitton chain on the company server, LV would know in a split second.
So to sum it up, the blockchain based chips are insanely secure, the serial number and the chips that other brands used in the past are toys compared to this.

The whole problem derives from people's instincitive need for a 100%-sure sign of authenticity. And in reality, Louis Vuitton never provided any. Ever. They have one 100%-sure formula, and they want us to use that only: buying from them from their boutiques.
The date codes were never meant for this, the Internet people came up with this idea, that "if a code matches this, then it is probably maybe authentic". It is bs, but it was a very handy belief for everyone: people got a piece of mind, resellers got less suspicious buyers, and the so-called "authenticators" got work. Win-win-win. Or at least people loved to feel like that.

This new code, no matter how secure and accurate, only does its magic for Louis Vuitton. We mortals won't be able to check them, unless an SA is kind enough to do so.
But this was the case in the classic datecode era too. No one else besides Louis Vuitton could tell if an item is authentic or not. And they could check authenticity in the past too, they used many (many many) small variances during production, they documented them, and when an item needed to be checked, the original workshop that made that item could check it easily, since they knew exactly that on that week of that year, how they made the Speedys. But it only worked with the know-how of the ateliers, the date code only told Vuitton which atelier they should go to for a check. So the old codes were not a sign of authentictity, but merely an address of the place Vuitton (and no one else) can go to for authentication.

Sorry for the long post.

Thank you for the long explanation. I agree the blockchain technology is miles and away more secure than a date code system. If a buyer can decipher the date codes, it's not secure at all, and you make a great point that it wasn't intended to be security for the buyer anyway. Personally, I'm supportive of LV's new turn. They do have a responsibility to protect their product and if they felt the need to bring in bigger guns to prevent counterfeiting, good for them. Blockchain might not be 100% secure or infallible, but that's the wrong question... the right question is, "What's the most secure method at the moment?" That's about as secure as it gets for the moment, and I think this is a great, creative use of it.

 

[lemondln]

I really miss the date code, am I the only one?

 

[nannch]

when I return bags with a microchip, they won’t accept the exchange or return until after they find and scan the chip

I exchanged my Neverfull, they did not even try to check if it has chip or not..

 

[chaojixyy]

Each of the above responses I have carefully read, there is a lot of inspiration, but also a lot of learning to do, thank each friend selflessly share their views and understanding. I have been in the habit of collecting and organizing date codes, whether from myself, or from friends, and I have to say that for date codes different countries, different origins, different factories and different numbers are indeed subtle changes and differences, so if the date code anti-counterfeiting role is there, but of course it is not recommended to determine whether it is true or false just by virtue of the date code. The new chip I guess will store more customer information, such as when to buy, in what area to buy the most number and amount, how much the repair ratio, how much the return ratio can be recorded to the LV server through the chip. This way when it is found that you spend the most in a particular store, you are traveling when or other stores maybe some popular models SA is not willing to sell to you, more willing to leave to the local well-known customers. Of course, this is just my personal speculation, in short, I think in the future, all guests' consumption habits will be controlled by LV, and determine the corresponding sales policy and return policy, and even SA's attitude towards you. The above is just my personal speculation, not necessarily correct, but also hope to hear more voices.

 

[Kevinh73]

Each of the above responses I have carefully read, there is a lot of inspiration, but also a lot of learning to do, thank each friend selflessly share their views and understanding. I have been in the habit of collecting and organizing date codes, whether from myself, or from friends, and I have to say that for date codes different countries, different origins, different factories and different numbers are indeed subtle changes and differences, so if the date code anti-counterfeiting role is there, but of course it is not recommended to determine whether it is true or false just by virtue of the date code. The new chip I guess will store more customer information, such as when to buy, in what area to buy the most number and amount, how much the repair ratio, how much the return ratio can be recorded to the LV server through the chip. This way when it is found that you spend the most in a particular store, you are traveling when or other stores maybe some popular models SA is not willing to sell to you, more willing to leave to the local well-known customers. Of course, this is just my personal speculation, in short, I think in the future, all guests' consumption habits will be controlled by LV, and determine the corresponding sales policy and return policy, and even SA's attitude towards you. The above is just my personal speculation, not necessarily correct, but also hope to hear more voices.

The chip doesn’t attach customer info. When sa scan the chip, it’ll only tell it date code and which factory made it. A sa can look you up in their company phone what level of spender you are. I’m guessing it also tells them how much you return. If you are a VIC, it will appear on the phone when they pull up your profile. SA will more likely to treat you well even if you don’t normally shop at their store since he or she will know there is a high likelihood that you will actually spend money than waste their time. Bags you purchase with chips do not link your profile to the bags you bought in store.

 

[chaojixyy]

Thank you for your reply, it makes me feel very warm. I think you're right, but the chip, if it corresponds to blockchain technology and has traceability, then adding some sales-friendly information to organize I think is normal. It is also in line with the point of selling more diligently to customers with more consumer potential. Of course, accurate sales and accurate product recommendations are not uncommon in the Internet era. Again, this is just my personal opinion and speculation.

The chip doesn’t attach customer info. When sa scan the chip, it’ll only tell it date code and which factory made it. A sa can look you up in their company phone what level of spender you are. I’m guessing it also tells them how much you return. If you are a VIC, it will appear on the phone when they pull up your profile. SA will more likely to treat you well even if you don’t normally shop at their store since he or she will know there is a high likelihood that you will actually spend money than waste their time. Bags you purchase with chips do not link your profile to the bags you bought in store.

 

[Kevinh73]

Thank you for your reply, it makes me feel very warm. I think you're right, but the chip, if it corresponds to blockchain technology and has traceability, then adding some sales-friendly information to organize I think is normal. It is also in line with the point of selling more diligently to customers with more consumer potential. Of course, accurate sales and accurate product recommendations are not uncommon in the Internet era. Again, this is just my personal opinion and speculation.

I understand your speculation. I don’t think lv will link the chip with purchaser regardless how tempting it would be as word will inevitably get out and LVMH will have a hot potato on its hands. People do care about their privacy and this will inevitably be a fairly big intrusion into people’s privacy. It’s one thing Facebook is mining our info since we didn’t “pay” for the service. Of course now we know we didn’t directly pay for it but they are selling data we put on Facebook so in the end we are paying for it. But it’s another whole thing when someone goes into LV and pay through the roof for their product and LVMH is still violating their customers privacy. I just don’t think lv needs to go there. In fact, most of the sa will ask you if you have a profile with them and they can pull that info up in few seconds with their phone. There is no need to embed anything else onto that chip as they rather have SA type in your phone number that you volunteer to give them than invade your privacy. It’s not worth it for LVMH imo.

 

[chaojixyy]

I understand your speculation. I don’t think lv will link the chip with purchaser regardless how tempting it would be as word will inevitably get out and LVMH will have a hot potato on its hands. People do care about their privacy and this will inevitably be a fairly big intrusion into people’s privacy. It’s one thing Facebook is mining our info since we didn’t “pay” for the service. Of course now we know we didn’t directly pay for it but they are selling data we put on Facebook so in the end we are paying for it. But it’s another whole thing when someone goes into LV and pay through the roof for their product and LVMH is still violating their customers privacy. I just don’t think lv needs to go there. In fact, most of the sa will ask you if you have a profile with them and they can pull that info up in few seconds with their phone. There is no need to embed anything else onto that chip as they rather have SA type in your phone number that you volunteer to give them than invade your privacy. It’s not worth it for LVMH imo.

Thank you for your reply, in fact my guess was not only about "invasion of privacy". It also comes with more accurate sales and more personalized service for the guest. After all, data can bring the bad, but it can also bring the good. It's just a matter of how the people with the data in their hands use it. Thank you for your response, it was a very pleasant day.

 

[philirina45]

This is an antiwaxx-level ‘argument’.
The point is that even if somehow someone could do that, LV would know about it immediately.
And security of banks and govertments are way different that cryptocurrency and blockchain. But I give up, I am not here for this. So sad.

Don’t t be discouraged! Thank you for your time explaining how a blockchain works!

 

[BULL]

I agree with @Kevinh73 . Vuitton already has extensive user profiles, that we signed up for. They use that for sales strategies indeed, but the chip has nothing to do with it. To have any more power, the chips would need to be active, but these RFID chips are completely passive. And that would — just as linking the buyer to the chip, on the chip — would require a very long GDPR agreement to be signed. But it is not really needed at the end of the day. Almost all locals have a registered user profile, they know everything we bought. And when we travel, we are either register a local profile or count as a "tourist" in their database, which is more than enough for them to do the strategies.