Coach wants to be the American Louis Vuitton...

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#196
shminbabe said:
But honestly, should the outlet offerings feel like 'high quality'? It's an outlet. Lower price point. You get what you pay for.
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Why shouldn't they offer good quality in the outlet. The crappy outlet quality is what drug the brand name down. Gucci has outlets as do many other high end designers. There is a Gucci outlet nearby and their offerings are superb quality because they don't make items for the outlet. The offer out-of-season boutique items for a discount. Last spring, I purchased a Gucci Soho Double Chain bag in patent leather. The color was Blush. Gucci still made tha style bag but it had been a color from the 2014 Spring/Summer line which was offered in their outlets the following year Spring 2015. So Gucci doesn't cheapen their brand by offering crappy quality outlet items. Their outlet items are simply items that did not sell out at the boutiques. And because of this, there are way fewer Gucci outlets. There are only a handful throughout the US (same with other high end outlets).

If Coach truly wants to increase their brand 'status', one option is to close the vast majority of their outlets leaving only a handful that carry only stock that did not sell at their boutiques...so sell well-made bags only at the outlets as well. However, I don't see this happening as the vast numbers of Coach outlets are what truly keep Coach in business now. I do agree with someone that I don't understand why they don't have different levels of handbags like other designers...Marc Jacobs, Michael Kors, etc. 'Michael Kors Collection' is a higher quality and more expensive line sold at stores like Neiman MArcus, Saks, etc whereas the 'Michael by Michael Kors' line found at most department stores like Macys. Why doesn't Coach have a lesser quality 'C by Coach' line that is sold at the outlets and the higher quality 'Coach' bags be sold only at boutiques? Or keep 'Coach' bags at the outlet and rename the brand that sell at the boutiques to something else.
 
#197
Cloudburst2000 said:
Why shouldn't they offer good quality in the outlet. The crappy outlet quality is what drug the brand name down. Gucci has outlets as do many other high end designers. There is a Gucci outlet nearby and their offerings are superb quality because they don't make items for the outlet. The offer out-of-season boutique items for a discount. Last spring, I purchased a Gucci Soho Double Chain bag in patent leather. The color was Blush. Gucci still made tha style bag but it had been a color from the 2014 Spring/Summer line which was offered in their outlets the following year Spring 2015. So Gucci doesn't cheapen their brand by offering crappy quality outlet items. Their outlet items are simply items that did not sell out at the boutiques. And because of this, there are way fewer Gucci outlets. There are only a handful throughout the US (same with other high end outlets).

If Coach truly wants to increase their brand 'status', one option is to close the vast majority of their outlets leaving only a handful that carry only stock that did not sell at their boutiques...so sell well-made bags only at the outlets as well. However, I don't see this happening as the vast numbers of Coach outlets are what truly keep Coach in business now. I do agree with someone that I don't understand why they don't have different levels of handbags like other designers...Marc Jacobs, Michael Kors, etc. 'Michael Kors Collection' is a higher quality and more expensive line sold at stores like Neiman MArcus, Saks, etc whereas the 'Michael by Michael Kors' line found at most department stores like Macys. Why doesn't Coach have a lesser quality 'C by Coach' line that is sold at the outlets and the higher quality 'Coach' bags be sold only at boutiques? Or keep 'Coach' bags at the outlet and rename the brand that sell at the boutiques to something else.
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I totally agree with you. That's actually how the whole outlet thing got started here on the East Coast at least. Back in the 80's and 90's you got last seasons leftovers, or items that didn't pass quality control. I don't remember when they switched over to merchandise especially made for the outlet stores, but that was their downfall. And back in the 70's-90's you did not find their merchandise on sale in dept stores. Now it seems every weekend there is a sale.
 
#198
Cloudburst2000 said:
Why shouldn't they offer good quality in the outlet. The crappy outlet quality is what drug the brand name down. Gucci has outlets as do many other high end designers. There is a Gucci outlet nearby and their offerings are superb quality because they don't make items for the outlet. The offer out-of-season boutique items for a discount. Last spring, I purchased a Gucci Soho Double Chain bag in patent leather. The color was Blush. Gucci still made tha style bag but it had been a color from the 2014 Spring/Summer line which was offered in their outlets the following year Spring 2015. So Gucci doesn't cheapen their brand by offering crappy quality outlet items. Their outlet items are simply items that did not sell out at the boutiques. And because of this, there are way fewer Gucci outlets. There are only a handful throughout the US (same with other high end outlets).

If Coach truly wants to increase their brand 'status', one option is to close the vast majority of their outlets leaving only a handful that carry only stock that did not sell at their boutiques...so sell well-made bags only at the outlets as well. However, I don't see this happening as the vast numbers of Coach outlets are what truly keep Coach in business now. I do agree with someone that I don't understand why they don't have different levels of handbags like other designers...Marc Jacobs, Michael Kors, etc. 'Michael Kors Collection' is a higher quality and more expensive line sold at stores like Neiman MArcus, Saks, etc whereas the 'Michael by Michael Kors' line found at most department stores like Macys. Why doesn't Coach have a lesser quality 'C by Coach' line that is sold at the outlets and the higher quality 'Coach' bags be sold only at boutiques? Or keep 'Coach' bags at the outlet and rename the brand that sell at the boutiques to something else.
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This is not entirely true. gucci does make made for factory items. They are marked with a bright neon orange tab inside items. And let me tell you, the quality is that of something youd get free with a fragrance purchase.
 
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#200
keishapie1973 said:
This is hilarious. LOL :D
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:laugh: oh yes!
I am not a fan to go to outlets anymore. It is because of crappy things and cheap replicas they sell under their names. I have no desire to spend my time studying color and codes on the labels to define which one is which. I would rather hunt for sales in fp stores, I may pay a few extrabucks more but I know what I am getting. Good fp sale prices might be even lower then an outlet sales. It all depends. I remember I bought very very nice wool sweater at BR fp store for $17 , when I tried to shop at their outlet I couldn't find a thing I liked and everything was above $20 range. It looked like a second hand store. Same thing with Ann Taylor, Calvin Klein, Ralph Lauren( they are a bit better then others) , or Tommy Hilfiger. Prices are very high and the quality is from decent to poor. Why even bother?
Anyway, the whole idea of outlets as stores selling unsold collections of the previous/past season is gone. It is now a joke...
 
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#201
Marisaa said:
:laugh: oh yes!
I am not a fan to go to outlets anymore. It is because of crappy things and cheap replicas they sell under their names. I have no desire to spend my time studying color and codes on the labels to define which one is which. I would rather hunt for sales in fp stores, I may pay a few extrabucks more but I know what I am getting. Good fp sale prices might be even lower then an outlet sales. It all depends. I remember I bought very very nice wool sweater at BR fp store for $17 , when I tried to shop at their outlet I couldn't find a thing I liked and everything was above $20 range. It looked like a second hand store. Same thing with Ann Taylor, Calvin Klein, Ralph Lauren( they are a bit better then others) , or Tommy Hilfiger. Prices are very high and the quality is from decent to poor. Why even bother?
Anyway, the whole idea of outlets as stores selling unsold collections of the previous/past season is gone. It is now a joke...
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I agree, I have never liked outlets, the prices aren't that great and if you shop a sale at any department store you find better deals

As for Coach it would be beneficial if they stop making a copy of the FP line for outlet, but we all know the Outlets for Coach is where they make their money, they just can't stop cold turkey Coach needs a 12 step program to rehab them out of some many outlets.

I remember about 2 years ago a friend stopped in a store and told me she liked my purse, she noticed it was Coach and then commented that she hoped to find it at the outlet. Her wish came true because a year later Coach made an outlet version.
 
#202
Marisaa said:
:laugh: oh yes!
I am not a fan to go to outlets anymore. It is because of crappy things and cheap replicas they sell under their names. I have no desire to spend my time studying color and codes on the labels to define which one is which. I would rather hunt for sales in fp stores, I may pay a few extra bucks more but I know what I am getting. Good fp sale prices might be even lower then an outlet sales. It all depends. I remember I bought very very nice wool sweater at BR fp store for $17 , when I tried to shop at their outlet I couldn't find a thing I liked and everything was above $20 range. It looked like a second hand store. Same thing with Ann Taylor, Calvin Klein, Ralph Lauren( they are a bit better then others) , or Tommy Hilfiger. Prices are very high and the quality is from decent to poor. Why even bother?
Anyway, the whole idea of outlets as stores selling unsold collections of the previous/past season is gone. It is now a joke...
Click to expand...

+1 with everything you said!! The only outlet stores I like to go to are Off 5th and Bloomingdales (for bags and shoes only). The rest of the stores bore me to tears. :laugh:
 
#203
Antonia said:
+1 with everything you said!! The only outlet stores I like to go to are Off 5th and Bloomingdales (for bags and shoes only). The rest of the stores bore me to tears. :laugh:
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Agree. We have no Bloomies around but Off 5th are still worth hunting. Last time they had a dozen of beautiful fp coach handbags, from the previous collection( like it suppose to be!) The only thing that their online and in store inventory are different and pricing is higher in the store. I usually choose smth online and buy it, returns are pretty easy. Or the other way around-look at thing in the store and buy it online after that. Depend on the price and inventory. Coach bags, for example, are not shown on their website.
 
#204
Bumping this to post this very interesting article about creating exclusivity for designer bags.


"....Part of the explanation for the bag’s exorbitant price – and the one that Hermès likes to emphasise – is the exquisite workmanship. Each Birkin is the handiwork of a single craftsman, who takes up to 18 hours to complete the job, more if the hide is a delicate crocodile skin. Hermès says its prices are based on its costs, which are necessarily high. Yet the many man-hours and fine materials that go into the making of the bag may not account for much of its price: Luca Solca, an equity analyst at Exane BNP Paribas, estimates that the production cost of a basic Birkin is around $800...."

"....So why does Hermès starve the market for Birkins, when it could sell many more, and so make much more money? Hermès says that the constraint is the availability of high-quality skins and people qualified to work with them. Hermès’s leather-goods division (métier, in company parlance) hires 200 craftspeople a year and takes two years to train them. The limit on the number of bags that can be made is therefore a natural one. Like gold and Bitcoins, Hermès suggests, Birkins are mined, not simply made.

But as Solca observes, there are good commercial reasons why rationing by queue rather than price can make sense. First, it gives Hermès a buffer: even if demand drops, sales will not. Second, it creates surplus demand for the bags, which overflows into demand for other Hermès products. Much of the firm’s business consists of selling consolation prizes: wallets, belts, beach towels and so on. As J.N. Kapferer of the Inseec Luxury Institute in Paris observes, the wait induces “impatient buyers to switch to other products of the brand, to calm their hunger until the much-awaited object of desire is achieved.” Third, although market-clearing prices might raise profitability in the short term, in the long run they would drive French women away, leaving nouveaux riches from the developing world as the bags’ main buyers. If elegant Parisiennes lose interest, so, eventually, will women who aspire to be like them...."

"....But the trouble with serendipity is that it cannot be manufactured. Hermès was “not able to launch another iconic bag in 32 years”, points out Mario Ortelli of Bernstein, an equity-research company. At best, the company can tend to the flickering aura that surrounds the two it has. That may be getting harder. Sophisticated buyers do not identify with starlets like Kim Kardashian and Tamara Ecclestone, who flaunt their large Birkin collections. “When you see some celebrity stepping out of an suv with a bag, it takes away from the mystique,” says Le Blanc. She fears the Birkin is becoming “too exposed”. All big luxury brands fret about that risk, but even here the Birkin stands apart. The danger of over-exposure comes not from the zeal of its marketing but from the ardour of its fans."

Entire article here: https://www.1843magazine.com/style/demand-curve
 
#206
TejasMama said:
I don't see how they are going to elevate themselves to a higher luxury status while keeping the outlets, which still provide the vast majority of their annual sales . They simply depend on that cash too much to let go of it.

I think there is room for them to regain some of their status as an affordable luxury brand, and I think that is a better place for them to be than trying to scale that mountain that is premier luxury. They would probably have better luck overseas than here in the US.

Mulberry tried this same strategy and had their strategy handed right back to them with plummeting sales and loyal customers leaving in droves. I would hate for Coach to fall victim to the same thinking.
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I am from the UK and used to buy Mulberry alot but all of a sudden the prices sky rocketed and it did backfire as I've not bought a single item since. The Bayswater tote is a fine example - when I purchased it it was £450, today it is listed on their website for £895.....for the same bag!!
I love Coach and have a mixture of store and outlet bags and feel that whilst there is a need for both they need to continue with both of they will loose customers.
 
#207
The thing is, if the outlets were real outlets --- selling past season bags --- we would not have any issues. And yes, outlet stores generate a lot of money, which is why the company is extremely careful with its business plan.

Also, Coach is struggling with stocks owned by department stores who have the power to discount the items, which damages Coach's brand appeal in the long run. I have seen at my local Macy's that the Coach bags have been removed from the store, probably an effort from Coach to extract its merchandise from Macy's perpetual sales.

It's basic marketing psychology: it's not special anymore if you can find it for cheap all the time and everywhere. Why would anyone buy a bag full price if they know they can get it discounted elsewhere? This is Coach's challenge: find a way to grow its most desirable customers, those who buy items full price.

Ideally, Coach should reduce the number of outlets dramatically (already online outlets have been discontinued), and make past season products a larger part of the outlets' stocks (right now it's 95% "made for outlet" merchandise). A lot of people think they make "good deals" at outlet stores, but the MSRP price is just an illusion, a gimmick to inflate savings.

I buy Louis Vuitton for bags and Gucci for shoes. These are my two fetish brands when it comes to leather goods. But I have bought several items from Coach over the years and I see a great potential for this company to follow the Longchamp model (aspirational luxury with some very fine higher end products, nice mid-range products, quality, service, and a good grip on pricing).
 
#208
fabuleux said:
The thing is, if the outlets were real outlets --- selling past season bags --- we would not have any issues. And yes, outlet stores generate a lot of money, which is why the company is extremely careful with its business plan.

Also, Coach is struggling with stocks owned by department stores who have the power to discount the items, which damages Coach's brand appeal in the long run. I have seen at my local Macy's that the Coach bags have been removed from the store, probably an effort from Coach to extract its merchandise from Macy's perpetual sales.

It's basic marketing psychology: it's not special anymore if you can find it for cheap all the time and everywhere. Why would anyone buy a bag full price if they know they can get it discounted elsewhere? This is Coach's challenge: find a way to grow its most desirable customers, those who buy items full price.

Ideally, Coach should reduce the number of outlets dramatically (already online outlets have been discontinued), and make past season products a larger part of the outlets' stocks (right now it's 95% "made for outlet" merchandise). A lot of people think they make "good deals" at outlet stores, but the MSRP price is just an illusion, a gimmick to inflate savings.

I buy Louis Vuitton for bags and Gucci for shoes. These are my two fetish brands when it comes to leather goods. But I have bought several items from Coach over the years and I see a great potential for this company to follow the Longchamp model (aspirational luxury with some very fine higher end products, nice mid-range products, quality, service, and a good grip on pricing).
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The online factory sales haven't gone anywhere. One sale ended this past weekend and the next sale is next week.
 
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