tPF authenticator discussion

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I myself am on a break for that same reason.



People with no business authenticating come along and starting spouting their opinions with imcomplete and/or horrible photos and get TOTALLY *****Y when we ask them to be careful. And the mods or admins do nothing about it because 'they should be able to give an opinion' - Good Lord..........



Ain't got time fo dat.


I'm in a lot of Facebook groups in addition to tPF, and I slowly had to quit one by one, simply because of moderators and admins who don't dare infringe on freedom of speech.

One group where I remain active has a strict NO DRAMA policy. All drama is deleted immediately, and people who continuously try to stir **** up are removed. I've gotta be honest, it's the greatest group ever. It must be made clear that certain behavior will not be tolerated. Unfortunately normal social conventions have still not made it to the internet.

I hope there's still hope. It's a shame to have the bad apples spoil the bunch.
 
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I think a form would sort out the posts that don't have a link...I don't understand the posts where people write "I don't have a link or item number" or "I know you require a link but..." So they must know this information by reading the first post or seeing other posts but yet still post knowing it's a requirement to get an item authenticated...
 
I'm in a lot of Facebook groups in addition to tPF, and I slowly had to quit one by one, simply because of moderators and admins who don't dare infringe on freedom of speech.

One group where I remain active has a strict NO DRAMA policy. All drama is deleted immediately, and people who continuously try to stir **** up are removed. I've gotta be honest, it's the greatest group ever. It must be made clear that certain behavior will not be tolerated. Unfortunately normal social conventions have still not made it to the internet.

I hope there's still hope. It's a shame to have the bad apples spoil the bunch.


I would be VERY happy in that 'no drama' group :-)
There is enough cr*p to deal with in real life, TPF is supposed to be my safe, happy place...
 
(snip)

Bad apples do get their accounts deactivated :yes:. I said this above, but I am probably much more lenient than some would be, but I try to see if people are just having an off day or if that is more there style. If there is a member who is constantly combative, then yes, we do consider temporary or permanent banning. Some members simply just don't get along, and we don't ban for that but we do have the ignore feature which helps.

People that come into threads and are rude should be reported. That way we can be sure we see it and handle it. I still feel like a lot of the issues or problem posts are not being reported so we are not seeing it.

I expressed my opinion on this three pages back - right after a whole bunch of posts happened that were removed (coincidentally - or not - those are the ones that caused missbanff to leave):

http://forum.purseblog.com/ebay-forum/tpf-authenticator-discussion-899195-56.html#post28667297

Personally I think this "report when someone hurts your widdle feelings" policy is what contributes to the bad blood between members. You get some people who don't like each other and it's the internet after all. One person thinks they're right and they report the other person's posts. I was only involved in this "posts deleted for rudeness" thing twice but the first time honestly I was surprised. The threshold for "rude" seemed awfully low to me. I don't know if the other member actually reported me or not (I think not but I don't know) but the entire thing was deleted and THAT is what made me PO'ed more than anything about the incident.

The posts in this thread that missbanff left over were just her stating her experience here with another member and voicing her opinion strongly. I managed to save part of the exchange (wish I'd saved the whole thing now). I can see how things can quickly devolve to pissing wars but I also think - again just my opinion - that sanitizing the threads can create more frustration. You get the feeling that you're never heard, and it REALLY does not feel fair.

ETA: I'll say again that I understand the reasons for the policies here and I totally appreciate the INTENT for "no drama" - but I also believe that we're adults.

Or at least, most of us. :D

I just feel there could be some unintended consequences that come from how it's enforced and I especially don't care for the request for members to report on each other, so I don't.
 
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I think a form would sort out the posts that don't have a link...I don't understand the posts where people write "I don't have a link or item number" or "I know you require a link but..." So they must know this information by reading the first post or seeing other posts but yet still post knowing it's a requirement to get an item authenticated...

My concern, which I think I have posted somewhere in this thread, is how the form works. Would it be seeking a "valid" link in the blank for links? Otherwise someone can just fill in "I don't have a link" in that space and we are back to square one. I know Meg doesn't want to delete post but honestly I still think it is the most efficient way of cleaning things up for authenticators before they log on. Anyway, I probably have repeated my 2 cents one too many times.
 
LOL! Amateur opinions, indeed!
I never go on any AT threads but did out of curiosity...LV/Chanel. I was surprised at all the 1st time posters or low posters, all AT related. I wonder if that's why they have such a problem posting in the right format? They have not contributed to tPF in any other way. Kind of a slam bam...thank you ma'am attitude. (sorry...no sexism intended but I couldn't think of a better analogy).
I don't know what would be involved to set up an AT form but that sounds like a good idea, Ellie. If members don't follow the form they don't get this FREE, wonderful service!

A lot of authenticators don't authenticate for brand new members who haven't contributed much to the forum. I totally get that. Some authenticators do authenticate for them though :yes:

We are working on a form right now! It is in development. I still don't think it will fix it all, but I am extremely hopeful it will help.

I'm in a lot of Facebook groups in addition to tPF, and I slowly had to quit one by one, simply because of moderators and admins who don't dare infringe on freedom of speech.

One group where I remain active has a strict NO DRAMA policy. All drama is deleted immediately, and people who continuously try to stir **** up are removed. I've gotta be honest, it's the greatest group ever. It must be made clear that certain behavior will not be tolerated. Unfortunately normal social conventions have still not made it to the internet.

I hope there's still hope. It's a shame to have the bad apples spoil the bunch.

We are as low drama as possible here, which is why we delete a lot of posts that have drama going back and forth. Some people think we step in too much, some think we don't step in enough. I know we aren't perfect at all.

My goal is for tPF to be a place that is fun for people! We all have so much that goes on in our daily lives, this should be a fun escape. A place to come and chat with people who have similar interests. Not everyone will always get along, but I don't want this to be a place that people feel stressed about either!

I think a form would sort out the posts that don't have a link...I don't understand the posts where people write "I don't have a link or item number" or "I know you require a link but..." So they must know this information by reading the first post or seeing other posts but yet still post knowing it's a requirement to get an item authenticated...

We are working on this form and I am sure it will take a few renditions to find the right form. Then it will probably continue to be tweaked again and again until we get it right!

I would be VERY happy in that 'no drama' group :-)
There is enough cr*p to deal with in real life, TPF is supposed to be my safe, happy place...

TOTALLY agree and totally our goal!
 
I expressed my opinion on this three pages back - right after a whole bunch of posts happened that were removed (coincidentally - or not - those are the ones that caused missbanff to leave):

http://forum.purseblog.com/ebay-forum/tpf-authenticator-discussion-899195-56.html#post28667297

Personally I think this "report when someone hurts your widdle feelings" policy is what contributes to the bad blood between members. You get some people who don't like each other and it's the internet after all. One person thinks they're right and they report the other person's posts. I was only involved in this "posts deleted for rudeness" thing twice but the first time honestly I was surprised. The threshold for "rude" seemed awfully low to me. I don't know if the other member actually reported me or not (I think not but I don't know) but the entire thing was deleted and THAT is what made me PO'ed more than anything about the incident.

The posts in this thread that missbanff left over were just her stating her experience here with another member and voicing her opinion strongly. I managed to save part of the exchange (wish I'd saved the whole thing now). I can see how things can quickly devolve to pissing wars but I also think - again just my opinion - that sanitizing the threads can create more frustration. You get the feeling that you're never heard, and it REALLY does not feel fair.

ETA: I'll say again that I understand the reasons for the policies here and I totally appreciate the INTENT for "no drama" - but I also believe that we're adults.

Or at least, most of us. :D

I just feel there could be some unintended consequences that come from how it's enforced and I especially don't care for the request for members to report on each other, so I don't.

Just because someone reports a post doesn't mean we act on it. When I get a reported post about drama, I go to that post and then I try to catch up on what is going on. Many times we don't act on it, but when it is personal attacks going back and forth we may delete some posts. Sometimes we delete all the posts in the exchange. And many of these times, we are sending PMs behind the scenes to the people involved.

Each situation is different and we try to handle each situation as it presents. But I know I've made mistakes in how we've handled certain situations.

Truly, I just want this to be a place that people enjoy coming to! There is no perfect answer, but we try our best to enforce our rules while letting members handle themselves as well.

My concern, which I think I have posted somewhere in this thread, is how the form works. Would it be seeking a "valid" link in the blank for links? Otherwise someone can just fill in "I don't have a link" in that space and we are back to square one. I know Meg doesn't want to delete post but honestly I still think it is the most efficient way of cleaning things up for authenticators before they log on. Anyway, I probably have repeated my 2 cents one too many times.

The exact details aren't worked out, but even with a form people will still probably be ungrateful, not follow rules, etc. With that happening, the best we can offer is ignoring those requests or telling them why authenticators won't help. However, people do that now and it doesn't seem to stick with some newbies.
 
Hi,

So please don't kill me for saying this, I know it sounds like blaming the victim, but...I think being "too nice" and authenticating when the information is not completely consistent with the rules is also adding to the problem. That and the fact that authenticators can skip a post intentionally without letting a poster know can lead to some bad behavior by some otherwise normal people, especially newbies. It goes like this, " I read through the thread and I know I am supposed to link all the pictures listed at the beginning but I do not have one of the rivet and I don't have a lot of experience using photo bucket. I've seen that sometimes the authenticators have been able to give opinions without good rivet pictures in the thread so I'll give them what I have." Later when nothing happens the thinking turns to "Well I have not had a response, I see that others have been skipped and used the "Bump" feature, I think I will do that, that way they can tell me what's going on. Gee, I hope I hear from them soon, I am getting anxious to buy/return the item before it is too late". More time elapses and the poster gets more anxious and more pushy, asking for more and more bumps and pleading for a timely response. In the panic, they become the demanding ungrateful poster. If they are responded to with the request for pictures of the rivet at this point, they are unsettled because now in addition to trying to do something they have not done often enough to be comfortable doing, using photo bucket, they have the time pressure because they wasted all this time just to get to this place, so instead of complying with the request they try to convince the authenticators that THEIR item is like other items that did not need the additional pictures.

The authenticators rightfully are getting irritated that the person is not complying with the format and is being pushy in asking for them to authenticate without all the necessary information.

Neither party are "bad people" but the time pressure and lack of familiarity with how to comply with the requests for the required information lends itself to unfortunate interactions.

I think a form that does not let itself get forwarded to the authenticators until it is complete with valid links and pictures will allow requesters to receive timely feedback on whether what they have submitted is sufficient and if not having help buttons to instructions on how to get the missing info may go a LONG way in solving this problem. At least the requester will be frustrated at the form and not the authenticators.

Just my pennies worth of thought.
 
Hi,

So please don't kill me for saying this, I know it sounds like blaming the victim, but...I think being "too nice" and authenticating when the information is not completely consistent with the rules is also adding to the problem. That and the fact that authenticators can skip a post intentionally without letting a poster know can lead to some bad behavior by some otherwise normal people, especially newbies. It goes like this, " I read through the thread and I know I am supposed to link all the pictures listed at the beginning but I do not have one of the rivet and I don't have a lot of experience using photo bucket. I've seen that sometimes the authenticators have been able to give opinions without good rivet pictures in the thread so I'll give them what I have." Later when nothing happens the thinking turns to "Well I have not had a response, I see that others have been skipped and used the "Bump" feature, I think I will do that, that way they can tell me what's going on. Gee, I hope I hear from them soon, I am getting anxious to buy/return the item before it is too late". More time elapses and the poster gets more anxious and more pushy, asking for more and more bumps and pleading for a timely response. In the panic, they become the demanding ungrateful poster. If they are responded to with the request for pictures of the rivet at this point, they are unsettled because now in addition to trying to do something they have not done often enough to be comfortable doing, using photo bucket, they have the time pressure because they wasted all this time just to get to this place, so instead of complying with the request they try to convince the authenticators that THEIR item is like other items that did not need the additional pictures.

The authenticators rightfully are getting irritated that the person is not complying with the format and is being pushy in asking for them to authenticate without all the necessary information.

Neither party are "bad people" but the time pressure and lack of familiarity with how to comply with the requests for the required information lends itself to unfortunate interactions.

I think a form that does not let itself get forwarded to the authenticators until it is complete with valid links and pictures will allow requesters to receive timely feedback on whether what they have submitted is sufficient and if not having help buttons to instructions on how to get the missing info may go a LONG way in solving this problem. At least the requester will be frustrated at the form and not the authenticators.

Just my pennies worth of thought.
This is a great post explaining what authenticators ingoring requests without explanation looks like from a newbie poster's point of view.

If no explanation is forthcoming from authenticators, the poster doesn't understand whether the post was inadvertently skipped or ignored for missing information.

Personally, I tend to be more lenient toward newbies so help them rather than ignore. I know some of the busier ATs make that more difficult.
 
This is a great post explaining what authenticators ingoring requests without explanation looks like from a newbie poster's point of view.

If no explanation is forthcoming from authenticators, the poster doesn't understand whether the post was inadvertently skipped or ignored for missing information.

Personally, I tend to be more lenient toward newbies so help them rather than ignore. I know some of the busier ATs make that more difficult.

I agree I've been skipped and it felt like it was a certain authenticator doing that to me on more than one occasion but it could have been lack of pictures but I don't know and never will know which even as someone who isn't a newbie isn't nice.
 
Hi,

So please don't kill me for saying this, I know it sounds like blaming the victim, but...I think being "too nice" and authenticating when the information is not completely consistent with the rules is also adding to the problem. That and the fact that authenticators can skip a post intentionally without letting a poster know can lead to some bad behavior by some otherwise normal people, especially newbies. It goes like this, " I read through the thread and I know I am supposed to link all the pictures listed at the beginning but I do not have one of the rivet and I don't have a lot of experience using photo bucket. I've seen that sometimes the authenticators have been able to give opinions without good rivet pictures in the thread so I'll give them what I have." Later when nothing happens the thinking turns to "Well I have not had a response, I see that others have been skipped and used the "Bump" feature, I think I will do that, that way they can tell me what's going on. Gee, I hope I hear from them soon, I am getting anxious to buy/return the item before it is too late". More time elapses and the poster gets more anxious and more pushy, asking for more and more bumps and pleading for a timely response. In the panic, they become the demanding ungrateful poster. If they are responded to with the request for pictures of the rivet at this point, they are unsettled because now in addition to trying to do something they have not done often enough to be comfortable doing, using photo bucket, they have the time pressure because they wasted all this time just to get to this place, so instead of complying with the request they try to convince the authenticators that THEIR item is like other items that did not need the additional pictures.

The authenticators rightfully are getting irritated that the person is not complying with the format and is being pushy in asking for them to authenticate without all the necessary information.

Neither party are "bad people" but the time pressure and lack of familiarity with how to comply with the requests for the required information lends itself to unfortunate interactions.

I think a form that does not let itself get forwarded to the authenticators until it is complete with valid links and pictures will allow requesters to receive timely feedback on whether what they have submitted is sufficient and if not having help buttons to instructions on how to get the missing info may go a LONG way in solving this problem. At least the requester will be frustrated at the form and not the authenticators.

Just my pennies worth of thought.

This is a great post that helps to explain what that perspective is like for new posters. However, the person requesting authentication is still making a choice to be pushy and demanding. Getting frustrated is understandable; being rude and acting entitled to a free service is not.
 
This is a great post that helps to explain what that perspective is like for new posters. However, the person requesting authentication is still making a choice to be pushy and demanding. Getting frustrated is understandable; being rude and acting entitled to a free service is not.

Agreed. The more common thing in my experience is that when people are told what the request guidelines are, they come back with "Oh, just do it for me this one time," and can get rather upset when they are denied.

I am very hopeful that the form will help newcomers understand the guidelines for an authentication request, because even in filling it out, they will be guided as to the needed information. If they choose to skip or ignore portions, at least they will have seen it.
 
Yes, but ideally the form will prevent the requester from submitting an incomplete or inaccurate request. That way they get immediate feedback that the obligation is on them and there is no opportunity for them to think it is the authenticators who are picking and choosing what is needed. It is this feeling that I think leads to the pushy behavior. They are trying to "influence" the authenticators into breaking the rules for them. If deprived of this opportunity I think much of the unpleasant interactions will be eliminated.

However, this "smart form" could be difficult to develop. I can barely post attachments so I am clearly not qualified to opine on the technical aspects of this solution but I think it is an important feature for the powers that be to consider.
 
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