Quality getting worse.. Probably no more chanel :(

[Yhte123]

‘Eventually’ - um. Bag is new as the person who was asking said.

A few responses went with it isn’t new or used before.

No one didn’t said anything about sweatshops in EU except you. Only mass production factories.

I only mentioned sweatshops in the developing countries and also said that “So we can’t compare the likes of Chanel or Hermes to the cost of bags mass-manufactured elsewhere in the factories of some developing nation.” - let me make it clear “both brands DO NOT take part in developing nations’ sweatshops“.

Your point?


Then Chanel should be transparent about their processes and materials, like the other luxury houses. We have some houses crowing about their leathers and how they make em.

Most of all, Chanel shouldn’t shut a customer up with a refund when the bag comes off as really really odd (in terms of smell or even damage) in some of the posts or even triggering a reaction. That invokes suspicion.

Eventually as in when you eventually open the flap, not eventually as the bag ages. To assume the bag should have minimal creases because it’s fresh from boutique is just ridiculous.

You’re the one that brought up labor and costs and higher standards in a response to cerulean blue. You were the one that talked about China. I was arguing against your false ideas about MII vs MIC stuffs.

And what’s your point for those brands bringing up as if they are related to Chanel’s manufacturing process?

Then that’s their choice. I don’t like Chanel’s lack of transparency either, but I really don’t see what point is there hold them up to the standards of other luxury brands? I don’t see any major luxury brand giving you an entire rundown of their supply chain and process so I don’t know where your standard is coming from. Not LV, Not Hermes, not Gucci, not Balenciaga, not Prada, not Chloe.

Most of all, Chanel shouldn’t shut a customer up with a refund when the bag comes off as really really odd (in terms of smell or even damage) in some of the posts or even triggering a reaction. That invokes suspicion.

And your point? I doubt Gucci/Hermes/LV et al would do the same in regards to giving you specific material info in response to an allergic reaction either.

 

[redwings]

Eventually as in when you eventually open the flap, not eventually as the bag ages. To assume the bag should have minimal creases because it’s fresh from boutique is just ridiculous.

There are allegations that both black and beige caviar have thicker leathers. Caviar is a caviar - why the difference if the allegations are true? Cost cutting?

You’re the one that brought up labor and costs and higher standards in a response to cerulean blue. You were the one that talked about China. I was arguing against your false ideas about MII vs MIC stuffs.

She said prices are due to the brand. I am talking cost and a lot of cheaper bag manufacturers are in China or other developing nations.

False ideas? Like wages in relation to overhead costs? So are the workers paid in Italy equal to the amount of wages which the workers in China get? Entry level: 1200 Euros (Veneto data) vs 4000 RMB /575 Euros ( average factory worker in a Chinese city).

Remember we are talking about overhead costs in reference to why bags are costlier when manufactured in the EU. Do let me know how false this is because you went off tangent.

And what’s your point for those brands bringing up as if they are related to Chanel’s manufacturing process?

Then that’s their choice. I don’t like Chanel’s lack of transparency either, but I really don’t see what point is there hold them up to the standards of other luxury brands? I don’t see any major luxury brand giving you an entire rundown of their supply chain and process so I don’t know where your standard is coming from. Not LV, Not Hermes, not Gucci, not Balenciaga, not Prada, not Chloe.

No one is asking for their entire supply chain.

If Chanel wants to charge Hermes level prices - then they are held up to the standards in that tier.

Oh do you want me to compare them to Coach on the contemporary level instead of premium level? Coach actually may have better leather bags than them now.

And your point? I doubt Gucci/Hermes/LV et al would do the same in regards to giving you specific material info in response to an allergic reaction either.

As an example:
LV monogram canvas - coating is PVC last I heard about my wallet. Funny how they let ppl know.
LV leather - Vegetal tanned (plant dyed) calf leather. Funny how they let ppl know.
LV vachetta trims - unfinished cow hide. Again funny how they let ppl know.
So pretty much plant-based tanning for leathers and canvas is pvc coated.

Never been allergic to LV or the rest. Weird.

If I am not allergic to them but to that peculiar leather, easy for Chanel to guess the make up. It isn’t like I didn’t provide info. I did - listed the leathers I owned from Chanel including those of their SLGs, with the note that there was no reactions to those types of leather. Process of elimination if one wishes to cross-reference. I am not asking for EVERY material but to which possible type of chemical is used for a list to do allergy testing.

"Many companies are using inexpensive immigrant labor to manufacture handbags that bear the coveted “Made in Italy” label"

The Chinese Workers Who Assemble Designer Bags in Tuscany

Many companies are using inexpensive immigrant labor to manufacture handbags that bear the coveted “Made in Italy” label.

www.newyorker.com

I think that may have changed now. They started the story from the mid 90s.

 

[Yhte123]

There are allegations that both black and beige caviar have thicker leathers. Caviar is a caviar - why the difference if the allegations are true? Cost cutting?

What exactly are you arguing with me against? All I said is how the leather creases is not an effective metric of quality, nor is thickness.

She said prices are due to the brand. I am talking cost and a lot of cheaper bag manufacturers are in China or other developing nations.

False ideas? Like wages in relation to overhead costs? So are the workers paid in Italy equal to the amount of wages which the workers in China get? Entry level: 1200 Euros (Veneto data) vs 4000 RMB /575 Euros ( average factory worker in a Chinese city).

Remember we are talking about overhead costs in reference to why bags are costlier when manufactured in the EU. Do let me know how false this is because you went off tangent.

You went off on the tangent here with your initial reply steeped in snarkiness. Citing average prices isn't going to undermine practices in the industry like subcontracting where people can be and are paid significantly less in Italy? Location of manufacturing doesn't matter, yes cost is cheaper in China but can be just almost cheap for made in Italy and a lot of brands are more than willing to looking that other way for cheap made in Italy labor.

Also when has a luxury bag been cheaper because it was made in the China vs Italy? Why Balenciaga bags and shoes made in China have comparable prices to the ones made in Italy, or Prada's made in China/Vietnam bags being the same price-wise with their Made in Italy bags (before they quietly moved the majority of their production back to Italy.)

No one is asking for their entire supply chain.

If Chanel wants to charge Hermes level prices - then they are held up to the standards in that tier.

Oh do you want me to compare them to Coach on the contemporary level instead of premium level? Coach actually may have better leather bags than them now.

Why are we comparing Chanel to Hermes? That's like comparing an apple to a pineapple. To compare their bags' qualities (the quality) based on the fact they're priced similarly is faulty IMO.

Look to music: Comparing Chanel to Hermes is like comparing a musician who doesn't have a good singing voice but great songwriting skills to a musician that has the best voice in the industry but mediocre lyrics. And both musicians are extremely popular, both musicians' prices for their music and albums are the same on iTunes, both have won prestigious awards (Grammys etc), both have been critically acclaimed. Because like how people prioritize different aspects to which music they enjoy and which musicians they like, people are going to do the same with fashion houses!

We all care about quality and longevity, but some people prioritize design and aesthetics over quality. The style between the two brands are so drastically different.

Then you should've been specific about the level of transparency you would've preferred given the fact that people have different ideas of "transparent about their processes and materials". The level of transparency "LV monogram canvas - coating is PVC last I heard about my wallet" is not my definition.

Because to some transparency can be being publicly and thoroughly disclosing their efforts into handling textile/manufacturing waste, greenhouse emissions, and hazardous chemicals. Transparency can be disclosing the factories they produce in and the suppliers they source materials from.

Please point to me was I disputing the low quality of Chanel? My point is comparing is pointless period (especially on the basis of them being priced similarly) and I've already said why. But I've attached what I've said since you didn't catch it.

Also, Chanel through and through is a couture house, not a leather goods house.

As an example:
LV monogram canvas - coating is PVC last I heard about my wallet. Funny how they let ppl know.
LV leather - Vegetal tanned (plant dyed) calf leather. Funny how they let ppl know.
LV vachetta trims - unfinished cow hide. Again funny how they let ppl know.
So pretty much plant-based tanning for leathers and canvas is pvc coated.

Never been allergic to LV or the rest. Weird.

If I am not allergic to them but to that peculiar leather, easy for Chanel to guess the make up. It isn’t like I didn’t provide info. I did - listed the leathers I owned from Chanel including those of their SLGs, with the note that there was no reactions to those types of leather. Process of elimination if one wishes to cross-reference. I am not asking for EVERY material but to which possible type of chemical is used for a list to do allergy testing.

I mean you won't catch them telling disclosing the chemical composition of the PVC of their coated canvas, nor the specific chemicals going into dyeing/coating their leathers to a client. Which I have not seen from any luxury brand. Hence : "specific material info" coating canvas in PVC to me is literally almost as vague as Chanel's "Shiny Calfskin".


Congrats for not being allergic to brand that's also significantly declining in quality. You not being allergic to LV etc doesn't mean other people couldnt be though given how LV and other's entire clientele aren't on purseforum. But hey.

 

[redwings]

What exactly are you arguing with me against? All I said is how the leather creases is not an effective metric of quality, nor is thickness.

Ummm… Consistency is a metric of quality.

You went off on the tangent here with your initial reply steeped in snarkiness. Citing average prices isn't going to undermine practices in the industry like subcontracting where people can be and are paid significantly less in Italy? Location of manufacturing doesn't matter, yes cost is cheaper in China but can be just almost cheap for made in Italy and a lot of brands are more than willing to looking that other way for cheap made in Italy labor.

Annnnd that’s why I buy Hermes now. One bag per craftsman. Made in France.

Also when has a luxury bag been cheaper because it was made in the EU vs Italy? Why Balenciaga bags and shoes made in China have comparable prices to the ones made in Italy, or Prada's made in China/Vietnam bags being the same price-wise with their Made in Italy bags (before they quietly moved the majority of their production back to Italy.)

Italy, last I checked is in the EU. Did they just get out of the EU?

Then you should've been specific about the level of transparency you would've preferred given the fact that people have different ideas of "transparent about their processes and materials". The level of transparency "LV monogram canvas - coating is PVC last I heard about my wallet" is not my definition.

Well, the example is given for clarity.

Because to some transparency can be being publicly and thoroughly disclosing their efforts into handling textile/manufacturing waste, greenhouse emissions, and hazardous chemicals. Transparency can be disclosing the factories they produce in and the suppliers they source materials from.

Read some of their sustainability reports. Of course, no one is going to expose their entire operations but there’s always some rating by independent sources auditing them. Just Google sustainability report of the respective company.

Please point to me was I disputing the low quality of Chanel? My point is comparing is pointless period (especially on the basis of them being priced similarly) and I've already said why. But I've attached what I've said since you didn't catch it.

Did I say low quality? Coach is definitely NOT low quality, merely stated that they may well produce better bags than Chanel. I would put Coach into the Better Quality zone.

Also, Chanel through and through is a couture house, not a leather goods house.

Chanel is a couture house. No one ever disputed that. However Chanel used to place emphasis on quality which also includes their leather goods. It’s kind of flogging the dead horse here.

I mean you won't catch them telling disclosing the chemical composition of the PVC of their coated canvas, nor the specific chemicals going into dyeing/coating their leathers to a client. Which I have not seen from any luxury brand. Hence : "specific material info" coating canvas in PVC to me is literally almost as vague as Chanel's "Shiny Calfskin".

PVC = Polyvinyl chloride - there you go, the name for a polymer of plastic. That’s the chemical composition (image attached). Got a chemical compound for ‘shiny calfskin’?

Congrats for not being allergic to brand that's also significantly declining in quality. You not being allergic to LV etc doesn't mean other people couldnt be though given how LV and other's entire clientele aren't on purseforum. But hey.

There are people who have leather allergies and I doubt that they will be in a boutique filled with leather. I cannot speak for others who may have allergies to certain components of LV bags but I do encourage them to speak up.

I own Chanel bags and I am not a first time buyer to be exposed to a first time bag. Never had issues with those items until that particular bag entered my collection. Suddenly getting hives which develop into itchiness is new to me. I cited other bags as an example for clarity’s sake before anyone assumes it is the good ole leather allergy.

 

[Yhte123]

Ummm… Consistency is a metric of quality.

And leather, being a natural product will not be always 100% consistent, especially with an area that is high stress E.G. the center of the flap. And a possible likelihood of one of the largest luxury brands sourcing from multiple suppliers.

Annnnd that’s why I buy Hermes now. One bag per craftsman. Made in France.

You should stick to them then instead of going on an unprovoked tirade in this thread in addition to casting aspersions onto Chanel’s clients as not caring of their money and "grouching".

Read some of their sustainability reports. Of course, no one is going to expose their entire operations but there’s always some rating by independent sources auditing them. Just Google sustainability report of the respective company.

I was giving an example dear.

Italy, last I checked is in the EU. Did they just get out of the EU?

I meant China vs EU/Italy which you have no point to argue so you resort to condescendingly misinterpreting my error. Especially given I clarified my point by providing examples of Balenciaga and Prada producing stuff in Italy and China..

Did I say low quality? Coach is definitely NOT low quality, merely stated that they may well produce better bags than Chanel. I would put Coach into the Better Quality zone.

Where did I say Coach was low quality? Like literally where? I said comparing brands is pointless.

Chanel is a couture house. No one ever disputed that. However Chanel used to place emphasis on quality which also includes their leather goods. It’s kind of flogging the dead horse here.

So do other brands like LV with questionable quality. Your point?

Ironic of you of all people talking about flogging dead horses.

PVC = Polyvinyl chloride - there you go, the name for a polymer of plastic. That’s the chemical composition (image attached). Got a chemical compound for ‘shiny calfskin’?

If you were able to get past your ego and need to be condescending , you would know there are different grades, classifications of PVC, got one for the one LV uses or the one you just pulled out of Google Images?

There are people who have leather allergies and I doubt that they will be in a boutique filled with leather. I cannot speak for others who may have allergies to certain components of LV bags but I do encourage them to speak up.

I own Chanel bags and I am not a first time buyer to be exposed to a first time bag. Never had issues with those items until that particular bag entered my collection. Suddenly getting hives which develop into itchiness is new to me. I cited other bags as an example for clarity’s sake before anyone assumes it is the good ole leather allergy.

Maybe it's a sign to stick with Hermes. I've heard they're so great they cause people to make misplaced and faulty comparisons with other luxury houses.

 

[redwings]

And leather, being a natural product will not be always 100% consistent, especially with an area that is high stress E.G. the center of the flap. And a possible likelihood of one of the largest luxury brands sourcing from multiple suppliers.

Leather, being a natural product, can be consistent. Not 100% exact but consistent in terms of thickness and any difference shouldn’t be discernible.

You should stick to them then instead of going on an unprovoked tirade in this thread in addition to casting aspersions onto Chanel’s clients as not caring of their money and "grouching".

See the thread topic: quality getting worse...this is a thread for quality issues. Well, that’s your opinion of my opinion. I have a different opinion of what I mean. Never the Twain shall meet. So we shall agree to disagree.

I was giving an example dear.

I meant China vs EU/Italy which you have no point to argue so you resort to condescendingly misinterpreting my error. Especially given I clarified my point by providing examples of Balenciaga and Prada producing stuff in Italy and China..

You assume too much, my dear on my intentions of ‘resorting’ to something.

However I do know of a certain perception in Asia (having lived in certain Asian countries for a long time) if people flip the tag and see made in China. A lot may well be flipping tags to check. Would be interesting to see whether the MII sells more than the MIC products but I doubt those companies will give us the info.

Where did I say Coach was low quality? Like literally where? I said comparing brands is pointless.

So do other brands like LV with questionable quality. Your point?

Let me quote you “ Please point to me was I disputing the low quality of Chanel?”
That‘s after I mentioned Coach as perhaps having better bags.

LV isn’t what I usually buy and usually if I buy an LV, I have to like it and with that comes intense inspection.

Ironic of you of all people talking about flogging dead horses.

If you were able to get past your ego and need to be condescending , you would know there are different grades, classifications of PVC, got one for the one LV uses or the one you just pulled out of Google Images?

Perhaps you should follow your own advice.

PVC has different additives but most of it will be regulated if manufactured in the EU. Vinyl allergies exist. If there is an allergy to a pvc coating - the doctor at least have an idea of some of the components to test for. Versus ‘shiny calfskin’.

Maybe it's a sign to stick with Hermes. I've heard they're so great they cause people to make misplaced and faulty comparisons with other luxury houses.

Really? I still think the world of JD, Goyard, Loewe and Dior. JD is priced nicely on par with Hermes yet their quality are matchable. Goyard is pretty cool in my books. Think of it : I did compliment Kwanpen yesterday. Guess I haven’t met those people yet. Definitely not in TPF.

This is a dead end. You are entitled to your view, as I am to mine. JD does have cooler hardware than Hermes but this is thread about Chanel’s lack of quality control.

 

[Swanky]

Hello! This thread is getting a little off topic and I want to remind everyone to be respectful to other members in all posts.
Let's stick to topic, respectfully please

 

[plpc]

arg, did they at least say they'll fix/replace the leather strap for free since it's under warranty?

Nope I was charged roughly 160 usd for the leather strap replacement and the strap on the zipper pull as well

 

[AdoreChanel007]

I have to say.. I just purchased a silver medium classic flap that I had seen online. I could not believe my eyes when I saw it at home. For almost $10,000 the quality is terrible! It looks so cheap! Looks like a fake! How are they raising their prices and producing these terrible quality bags? I am returning this bag and looking for older pre loved Chanel bags that actually have good quality. So upsetting!