Maintaining an H relationship

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While talking with my SA, he told me that in our store in Singapore, bag distribution is centralized in the store, available for all SAs to choose from ( l think it’s a first come first serve basis, all things being equal). Whereas in a neighbouring country, bags are specifically allocated to SAs who then decides which client they want to sell it to.
 
Last September, my SA told me that I was one of his only clients who did not have a wish list and ask for or hint about a QB for the opening of the new boutique.* Instead, at the opening appt, he presented RTW that I had requested. He also asked if I would try on some dainty fine jewelry pieces. The request was extremely unusual for him bc the jewelry I normally wear is a totally different aesthetic. I tried it on to humor him. There is always the chance you could surprisingly fall in love with something different, and I like to keep an open mind. I did get the distinct impression, without him spelling it out, that if I had fallen in love with any fine jewelry, a bag could be found. But, I had just gotten my 28K quadrille at FSH the week before, with zero prespend, and the H jewelry was nothing special. So, I declined. I feel that it’s the SAs job to show you different items, but no SA in any premier brand has ever had a problem if I tell them that something is not to my taste. The ability to say no thank you actually takes the pressure off of both the SA and the client. I don’t think it has ever been held against me, and I wouldn’t buy anything I didn’t love to get a bag.

*ETA: I specifically told him before the opening that I wasn’t looking for a bag. And, he knows about my FSH appts and I get his opinion about my bag purchases.
 
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I feel that it’s the SAs job to show you different items, but no SA in any premier brand has ever had a problem if I tell them that something is not to my taste. The ability to say no thank you actually takes the pressure off of both the SA and the client.
Exactly! It is the SA's job to sell stuff and until they know your taste (because you tell them what you like and don't like), they'll show you different items. Declining to purchase something provides as much information about one's taste as buying something and helps the SA be more selective about what to show you in the future.
 
Exactly! It is the SA's job to sell stuff and until they know your taste (because you tell them what you like and don't like), they'll show you different items. Declining to purchase something provides as much information about one's taste as buying something and helps the SA be more selective about what to show you in the future.
Right! I’d find it odd if a sales associate never tried to sell me something! I don’t take it personally, it is the job they were hired for. I simply say no if I’m not interested and move on!
 
Catching up on a couple topics in the past couple pages, sorry this got into a looong wall of text :sweatdrop:

I’m sure different pay structures in different countries cause differences in SA sales techniques. And then cultural differences. Then on top of all that an SA’s personal preferences.
I and one of my friends shop the same store but different SAs, and have different experiences. My SA would tell me about bags that I may be interested in then try to get it for me, and can end up not being able to. They know by now that I don’t get upset when that happens (which now that I think about it, probably isn't something they feel comfortable doing with all their clients; so even with the same SA one's experience can vary). My friend’s SA, on the other hand, never says a word till the bag has been approved by the SM and ready to be sold to them. My friend has had “surprises” that she didn't know beforehand when she goes to the store, while I always knew the specific bag that’s ready for me if there is one.
Our SAs also have slightly different opinions re: ordering stuff online, both though advise to avoid it if possible because my SM prefers clients who concentrate on in store shopping (of course there’s difference between getting something small vs big ticket, something impossible to get at our store vs something they have in stock or can easily order etc.). Similarly, getting things in another store within the same country (which means they show up on your profile), versus getting stuff overseas (not linked to your profile; although there's been mumbling re: global linking for a bit now esp. for Paris), would be treated different by our SM.

Generally speaking, I too get the sense that the straight-up numbers approach (more commonly seen in Asia) is slowly spreading - in this day and age, with global mobility and the Internet, it feels kinda inevitable. Whether that's good or bad probably depends on one's own preference.

Tangent on complaints - at least officially, the upper (corporate) level H adamantly denies the existence of “pre-spend”, “ratio”, “points” etc. So if an SA is very open, and their client is unhappy for whatever reason, they can (and apparently many, many do) write complaints to accuse the SA of doing something wrong. It’s why SAs (even in Asia) may avoid writing certain things down, which can be used as “evidence”. So discussions surrounding quota bags are best had in person. Also yet another reason why SAs may seem distant in the beginning when you are new / take some time to warm up to you.

On how things (bags or otherwise) can be decided differently for different countries / stores: definitely! I know that once in the past my store SAs played rock paper scissors to decide who got a couple rodeos that just came in haha. My understanding is how a store works can have parts set by a higher level (e.g. some policies will apply to all stores in a country) but also parts that are more individual, up to and decided by the SM. Like any other workplace with org charts basically.
Things also change from time to time. For example, back when the to go wallets first came out, my SM apparently underestimated their popularity and didn’t require SAs getting approvals; my SA snatched one for me without needing to ask. Quite immediately afterwards SM realized the supply (they did not order a lot) vs demand and changed it so SM sign-off was needed (no idea if things have changed again later on).

I feel very comfortable saying no to things my SA suggests (sometimes I accidentally leave them on read for a bit because I get busy / miss getting back to their text), it really should be a totally fine thing to do, any reasonable SA will understand. Please don't ever feel bad or worse get pressured into buying something you don't want!
 
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Yes, @1CC, please tell us the story!
Not much on the story. Long time H client with good SA relationship and QBs along my shopping experiences. Prespend spread between bags continued to expand because of how the H market has evolved. However, I began to sense a shift in SAs selling pov when they began quoting prespend ratios in Asia and the US. Reading tPF much? Hmmm? This time it was very transactional and manipulative so I declined and said none of the jewelry peaked my interest. For now I am walking away from H.

Side note - all the posts quoting 3-5x as being normal, which is NOT, is pushing the mindset of clients, SAs and SMs to raise prespend. Clients are spending over 2x and 3x before asking for a bag resulting in SAs/SMs raising the scales.

Asia, surely
at least you know where you stand
It was not in Asia. I actually prefer Asia business model where spend and wait time is known upfront. No games. Clients stick to their 1-1.5x and ask for their bags.

I actually prefer this straight forward honesty. I am a no-nonsense type of person and I'd rather someone be a straightshooter.

At least with this approach you know exactly where you stand and you don't have to "play the game", or wonder when/if you'll get the bag or make up stories in your head based on assumptions or misguidance. You will have complete control over whether you want to cave in, or walk...:tup:
I should have already received a bag from where I was standing but they wanted me to climb higher. So what then? Next time will be even higher? So walk I did
 
Side note - all the posts quoting 3-5x as being normal, which is NOT, is pushing the mindset of clients, SAs and SMs to raise prespend. Clients are spending over 2x and 3x before asking for a bag resulting in SAs/SMs raising the scales.
Definitely! If they know that people will take that as gospel truth and wait until later in the process to ask for bags, there's no reason to push people to spend less.
 
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It's pretty well known that Hermes SAs do read this forum (and other social media).

That being said, I think the ratio rising comes from a much easier to see and obvious place - reseller market prices, which have definitely risen, indicating how much some people are willing to pay for these bags (and yeah they are aware of the reseller market prices). Say if a bag is being sold at 3x retail price on the reseller market, they know that the store ratio can be raised at least to 2 (but realistically more). And it becomes a cycle: if people know these bags flip for a higher price, they are happy to spend more to get them. I do think the prices are falling a bit recently, maybe??, so here's hoping things are actually calming down.
 
Definitely! If they know that people will take that as gospel truth and wait until later in the process to ask for bags, there's no reason to push people to spend less.
People should spend whatever they feel comfortable but I think it’s silly to pretend that 2-5x prespend for new clients isn’t the going rate. Many new people to the brand who haven’t kept up to date with Hermes shopping circa 2023 feel entitled to a coveted bag offer by the time they first spend $10k at Hermes. Then we get endless posts about these clients feelings of disappointment and frustration and asking what’s wrong with their relationship when it’s truly just that the competition is more fierce these days. Burying one’s head in the sand and pretending this isn’t the reality (for new clients) wont magically change the facts.
 
It's pretty well known that Hermes SAs do read this forum (and other social media).

That being said, I think the ratio rising comes from a much easier to see and obvious place - reseller market prices, which have definitely risen, indicating how much some people are willing to pay for these bags (and yeah they are aware of the reseller market prices). Say if a bag is being sold at 3x retail price on the reseller market, they know that the store ratio can be raised at least to 2 (but realistically more). And it becomes a cycle: if people know these bags flip for a higher price, they are happy to spend more to get them.
Honestly, I think this take makes the situation seem more malicious than it actually is. Yes, resellers are a large part of the problem, but that’s only because they are the ones most willing to “overspend” for the bag, knowing they will profit in the end. I don’t believe any SAs are out there thinking “wow this goes for 3x on FB, I can totally get another finesse bracelet out of Susie before offering it to her”. It’s more “wow I have this awesome bag to sell. I like Susie and she shops every few months but KarentheReseller just bought 37 pairs of Orans from me yesterday so there’s no way BobTheSM lets me offer this bag to Susie first. But maybe if Susie comes in tomorrow and finally buys that bracelet she’s been eying, I’ll be able to convince Bob…”
 
People should spend whatever they feel comfortable but I think it’s silly to pretend that 2-5x prespend for new clients isn’t the going rate. Many new people to the brand who haven’t kept up to date with Hermes shopping circa 2023 feel entitled to a coveted bag offer by the time they first spend $10k at Hermes. Then we get endless posts about these clients feelings of disappointment and frustration and asking what’s wrong with their relationship when it’s truly just that the competition is more fierce these days. Burying one’s head in the sand and pretending this isn’t the reality (for new clients) wont magically change the facts.
Oh, yeah, that's true. But prices are up in general; I would never have assumed $10k was sufficient to get a first QB. Maybe I'm just over-estimating people's spend expectations?
 
Oh, yeah, that's true. But prices are up in general; I would never have assumed $10k was sufficient to get a first QB. Maybe I'm just over-estimating people's spend expectations?
For yeeeaaaarrrrs the understanding was 1:1 spend should nearly guarantee a bag of one’s choosing. Times have changed but we still get folks everyday coming here with “I’ve spent $8k in six months and still nothing from my SA!” The reality is expectations should really be somewhere in the 2.5-5x range. Sometimes it happens sooner and that’s awesome, but don’t get upset if it doesn’t. :)
 
It's pretty well known that Hermes SAs do read this forum (and other social media).

That being said, I think the ratio rising comes from a much easier to see and obvious place - reseller market prices, which have definitely risen, indicating how much some people are willing to pay for these bags (and yeah they are aware of the reseller market prices). Say if a bag is being sold at 3x retail price on the reseller market, they know that the store ratio can be raised at least to 2 (but realistically more). And it becomes a cycle: if people know these bags flip for a higher price, they are happy to spend more to get them. I do think the prices are falling a bit recently, maybe??, so here's hoping things are actually calming down.
I’m also sure some people take these threads to their SAs and say “see they only spent x why can’t I?”

At the bolded. Definitely. I’ve been watching a craie b30 for a little over a year now and you can get them for 21-24k whereas last year the lowest price was 27-28k in the same condition!
 
Honestly, I think this take makes the situation seem more malicious than it actually is. Yes, resellers are a large part of the problem, but that’s only because they are the ones most willing to “overspend” for the bag, knowing they will profit in the end. I don’t believe any SAs are out there thinking “wow this goes for 3x on FB, I can totally get another finesse bracelet out of Susie before offering it to her”. It’s more “wow I have this awesome bag to sell. I like Susie and she shops every few months but KarentheReseller just bought 37 pairs of Orans from me yesterday so there’s no way BobTheSM lets me offer this bag to Susie first. But maybe if Susie comes in tomorrow and finally buys that bracelet she’s been eying, I’ll be able to convince Bob…”

That definitely does happen! I know my SA tries to convince my SM sometimes by pointing out certain things in my profile (the one specific time I heard was mentioning a watch I have on order).

This goes back to how different stores can be ran but at my store the proposals go in from all the SAs who want a bag (for one of their clients) at a certain due date, then my SM decides by looking at them. The smartest thing H has ever done is making these bags somehow “prizes” of a competition amongst clients.

I’m also sure some people take these threads to their SAs and say “see they only spent x why can’t I?”

At the bolded. Definitely. I’ve been watching a craie b30 for a little over a year now and you can get them for 21-24k whereas last year the lowest price was 27-28k in the same condition!

Resellers (and influencers) also like to push and hype colors in waves (normally in sync with how many of those colors they have in stock, curious heh?) - Craie was being hyped so, so much for a bit and they seem to have now moved on to new colors. One of my friends who would never get a light colored bag was even swayed because when she did the “research” on social media there were so many beautiful posts of Craie enticing her (I firmly reminded her that she’d never use it and dragged her to decline). They like to do it on the seasonal colors too - man I’m getting fed so many RED posts about how beautiful Bleu Jean is right now.
 
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For yeeeaaaarrrrs the understanding was 1:1 spend should nearly guarantee a bag of one’s choosing. Times have changed but we still get folks everyday coming here with “I’ve spent $8k in six months and still nothing from my SA!” The reality is expectations should really be somewhere in the 2.5-5x range. Sometimes it happens sooner and that’s awesome, but don’t get upset if it doesn’t. :smile:
Wow, no, I definitely wasn't asking for a bag after just $8k in spend! I don't even think I would've felt comfortable asking at 1:1. I was at about 1.5:1 when I asked and that visit pushed me to about 1.75:1. I have some other items in mind to buy, so it wouldn't surprise me if I was at about 2.5:1 by the time I actually get my first bag.
 
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