Joseph Duclos Thread
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Happy for you! And happy birthday in advance!
Have you decided on the size or are you going to decide when you both see them in person?
Leaning towards the 26, but want to see it on me since I am on the shorter side.
If this has already been explained, please forgive me, but I'm genuinely curious: how did this brand get a forum under the "Premier Designers" forum before others like Delvaux or Moynat (just to name two)?
The Joseph Duclos team reached out to the Purse Forum owners for a partnership. This is also the reason why, if you look back a few pages, Megs offered to relay any questions we may have. And luckily for us, Ramesh Nair himself answered the questions.
Oh so it's just a paid promotion for Joseph Duclos? That explains everything.
They seem to follow a pretty aggressive advertising strategy. Those Instagram adds were everywhere, that's how I found out about the brand by the way.
I think they are too aggressive in their advertising too (IG ads multiple times a day). Feel it takes away from the specialness of the brand. But after thinking about it more, I am sure the only way they can survive and continue manufacturing bags at the standards they currently do, is very strong sales. Otherwise they might go the way of Moynat....
Thought i was the only one noticing this. I thought i needed to clear the cookies on all my smart devices coz i also see their ads literally each time i scroll on the stories of those who i follow on IG. It was effective coz i usually end up going to their IG acct to check if they posted anything new lol
I wouldn't compare Joseph Duclos to Moynat though. Moynat is an old heritage brand with rich history in a lot of ways similar to Hermes, but yes, it was dormant for a couple of decades while still remaining within a luxury brand portfolio.
Sure, 1754 is the first thing which jumps in Joseph Duclos ads, but from what I briefly read on Wikipedia, here is the history:
1. Founded in 1754 as a tannery with Royal patent
2. Closed in 1850 due to lack of successors
...171 years gap...
3. "Resurrected" in 2021 in form of a fine leather goods manufacturer (not tannery, that tannery in Lectoure is a hotel now)
I am not even sure what should be the process of buying the name of a brand extinct without successors in the middle of XIX century and who it can possibly be bought from.
Actually, I don't think the goal is "to survive", but rather to hype the brand to the max and then sell to one of the large luxury groups for profit in near future. That's why they are so heavy on the marketing and so untypically "Instagram-y" for a niche high-end brand. But that's just my take. The owner is literally an investment banker.
My post referenced Moynat because "going the way of Moynat" meant being sold to someone like LVMH. And I think both brands have many similarities, especially similar customer bases and quality, both due to Ramesh. So I do think they can be compared to one another, only not the current Moynat, the pre-LVMH Moynat. That all said, I hope they don't get sold to a big luxury brand. Will be a total turn off for me. I am trying to stay away from big brands and keep buying from smaller more bespoke brands.
I also largely prefer smaller artisanal niche brands to big companies.
However, Joseph Duclos started selling bags only in 2021, they had no artisanal expertise and no craftsmen who grew and learned with the brand. People who make their bags actually learned it somewhere else.
I mean at the very best these bags were made by the same craftsmen who previously worked for brands like Hermes, Moynat etc.
Another point is raw materials. I don't think Joseph Duclos was able to access the same top tanneries like Hermes and Moynat can, as they are not transparent about their leather sources. I couldn't find any info on their website.
By which means can Joseph Duclos achieve better quality than these big ultra high-end brands still using manual stitching? I don't really get how, behind all the marketing it's the same level (at best) and quite likely it´s inferior.
The thing is it’s actually incredibly easy to undercut large brands because costs of production are low compared to the massively inflated MSRPs of bags.
Their brick and mortar “network” also consists of a single store so their fixed costs are also more manageable.
You can get a fully saddle stitched box leather bag in the same Du Puy box leather tannery as H for only a few thousand from independents.
There’s also the misconception that there’s no new labour available to hire because there’s a massive amount of interest in crafts in France mainly via their program called “Les Compagnons du Devoir” https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compagnons_du_Devoir through which trainees perform a “Tour de France” interning at various brands who might have acquired skills from the large brands you mentioned but also the sizeable network of independent ateliers (bespoke).
Fashion has a lot of smoke and mirrors and unfortunately the mainstay luxury brands are mostly premium factory made items churned out by the thousand.
I am only focusing on the brands which do not "churn out", but still saddle stitch their bags. It's a labour intensive and niche craft, even among large luxury brands only a very few still do so. Of course, there are independent artisans who offer this service, however the bespoke market of high-end saddle stitched bags is orders of magnitude smaller and much more niche-y.
This is an industry where costs in general are just a fraction of the "MSRP" (although that's a term for goods sold at different retailers, it doesn't apply for Hermes, for example) and larger brands do naturally have lower costs due to the volume effect (purely arithmetically, fixed costs per bag are lower the more bags are made).
My the point was not about whether there is a new labour available or not, Joseph Duclos began manufacturing bags 2 years ago, so their talent was acquired from other brands (big or small) or did you mean that they directly hired trainees from Les Compagnons du Devoir with no other experience?
And I am really not a fan of Hermes, but it's because of other reasons (customer treatment, their styles and that the bags are now way too recognisable). I have zero questions to quality and craftsmanship, knowing that no other brand has access to better raw materials or about the tough selection and lengthy training of craftsmen before they get to work on their first bag and who master this craft ever since on a 9-5 basis. So how a brand 2 years in the handbag business can not only be on par but even better like some claim?
MSRP should still count because what doesn’t sell at MSRP gets sold below once they reach the yearly H sales. As for the cost of materials, of course those will be lower to purchase at H’s scale especially since they own many of their tanneries.
I don’t know specifically about Duclos but when it comes to France’s shoemaking industry there’s a saying that nearly everyone will one day pass through Lobb Paris / Berluti.
Based on what I’ve seen lately in store re:stitching, edge coat work and other small details I think it’s very possible. Especially since H cut down the amount of time allowed in creating each bag to sate worldwide demand.
Also I guess it’s because I see Duclos as a niche brand because it wouldn’t be that hard to find a handful of craftspeople to start a small volume store.
What H is able to do at the scale they do is certainly commendable but it’s also important to realize that they aren’t the pinnacle of craftsmanship nor of materials. On modern bags, they started using cheaper tail cuts on the bottom of their exotics rather than belly cuts on all sides of the bags.
The launch of the "brand" doesn't line up at all with the timing of the foundational work - like with Moynat's relaunch there was a lot beforehand - 1) hiring Ramesh 2) acquiring/formulating a design backstory to guide the product strategy 3) locating and training artisans (in the case of Duclos perhaps these were already Ramesh-trained folks from Moynat) 4) building/expanding tannery relationships and 5) designing and creating bags and all of their components/accessories (hardware, straps, etc.).
Ramesh is a true creative visionary and operational mastermind. His attention to detail in every single one of these areas is remarkable (and one only has to be a casual follower of the Knightly story to see the huge difference in talent and approach).