Has Hermes moved production to different countries?

[Luvbolide]

Good try on the asbestos story, but you cannot get asbestos cloth legally anywhere except China these days. You certainly cannot get it in the US, Canada or EU countries. (No, I am not kidding.)

These types of "not made in France" rumors are recurring and frankly, I choose not to believe them for a variety of reasons, not the least of which is that Hermes just put on a huge dog and pony show across the US (and perhaps other countries, I don't know) where they show and describe the process of making the scarves. As others who were lucky enough to see the demonstrations noted, the scarves are done in Lyon - except for some of the hemming apparently. Why would they bother with such a massive ploy to cover up a Made in China connection?!?

Like many here, I am a long time collector of Hermes scarves and number fellow collectors among my friends. No one better to talk scarves with!! Many of us have collected for well over 10 years but I don't know of any of us who feels we are or have Hermes connections, which I usually consider to be someone with the kind of inside knowledge that a high-level employee would have.

 

[Bienchen]

OP - donning the asbestos BDG is perfect if you think you may be "shot down in flames"; I'm afraid not all posters' first language is English nor do they understand a particular brand of humour.

I found your post very entertaining albeit taken with a huge pinch of salt.

 

[Balto Bag Lady]

Of course! You may perhaps not be aware that Hermès, out of its typical concern and consideration of its clientele, has an especial line of scarves, made at a secret factory just outsides of Lyons in an underground facility.

Here they produce an exceptional collection of scarves using a very secret process which bonds their famous silk twill with 36" sheets of the finest asbestos tissue lawn. From this specially treated fireproof fabric they screen on their magnificent scarf designs.

Once the printing is completed the scarves are sent to Mauritania, where they are hemmed, by hand, using kryptonite thread with kevlar needles. (ordinary needles would not be strong enough to handle the kryptonite thread of course!)

Once completed they are returned to Lyons, labeled, and then emailed all over the world to those clientele foolish enough to risk public censure on internet forums.

The asbestos lining in the scarves, if donned in time, protect the poster, to some small extent at least, from the heated fallout of their rash words online. Mine came in the classic Brides de Gala design...

And I checked for you... the CW is... Flame Red, of course....

; -}

:lolots::lolots: wait for me while I find my fireproof GMs and go back above the sticky where I belong.

 

[chicinthecity777]

Good try on the asbestos story, but you cannot get asbestos cloth legally anywhere except China these days. You certainly cannot get it in the US, Canada or EU countries. (No, I am not kidding.)

These types of "not made in France" rumors are recurring and frankly, I choose not to believe them for a variety of reasons, not the least of which is that Hermes just put on a huge dog and pony show across the US (and perhaps other countries, I don't know) where they show and describe the process of making the scarves. As others who were lucky enough to see the demonstrations noted, the scarves are done in Lyon - except for some of the hemming apparently. Why would they bother with such a massive ploy to cover up a Made in China connection?!?

Like many here, I am a long time collector of Hermes scarves and number fellow collectors among my friends. No one better to talk scarves with!! Many of us have collected for well over 10 years but I don't know of any of us who feels we are or have Hermes connections, which I usually consider to be someone with the kind of inside knowledge that a high-level employee would have.

You are absolutely right! asbestos can be poisonous and is completely banned in the EU. The whole story is bizarre!

 

[joycieh]

I think the OP was kidding/being sarcastic about the asbestos scarf part......

 

[djmm]

Say can I SO asbestos thread and Kryptonite hardware for my Birkin? I think black Birkin with green piping and Kryptonite hardware would look very fresh and sporty.

 

[sarafinadh]

:lolots::lolots: wait for me while I find my fireproof GMs and go back above the sticky where I belong.

Say can I SO asbestos thread and Kryptonite hardware for my Birkin? I think black Birkin with green piping and Kryptonite hardware would look very fresh and sporty.

Oh yes, we would be smashing as a 'Brigade Sapeurs-pompiers!'

And please, for those who could not follow the humour in my last post, my apologies. It was a joke. Kryptonite is the outer-space metal that makes Superman weak, not a real metal. Hermès has no secret underground facility. And asbestos is, of course, cancer causing and not used in any items of apparel. Although it is fire proof ; -)

They do not email scarves of any kind...

And perhaps it is good to remember that we are only talking about scarves.... not world peace...

So, peace all!

 

[Luvbolide]

Don't assume we didn't all get your humor, we maybe didn't all find it too funny. I am going to assume that your facts on Hermes are as accurate as your facts on asbestos are...

 

[Toriatan]

Of course! You may perhaps not be aware that Hermès, out of its typical concern and consideration of its clientele, has an especial line of scarves, made at a secret factory just outsides of Lyons in an underground facility.

Here they produce an exceptional collection of scarves using a very secret process which bonds their famous silk twill with 36" sheets of the finest asbestos tissue lawn. From this specially treated fireproof fabric they screen on their magnificent scarf designs.

Once the printing is completed the scarves are sent to Mauritania, where they are hemmed, by hand, using kryptonite thread with kevlar needles. (ordinary needles would not be strong enough to handle the kryptonite thread of course!)

Once completed they are returned to Lyons, labeled, and then emailed all over the world to those clientele foolish enough to risk public censure on internet forums.

The asbestos lining in the scarves, if donned in time, protect the poster, to some small extent at least, from the heated fallout of their rash words online. Mine came in the classic Brides de Gala design...

And I checked for you... the CW is... Flame Red, of course....

; -}

This is possibly my favourite post in all my years on TPF...

 

[Ammietwist]

Sorry but unless you can show me some physical proof, I don't believe this "source". To label a product not produced in France "Made in France", it's not just un-ethical, it's in fact illegal! I don't believe for a high profile, legitimate, long history, national treasure French company, Hermes would risk its hundreds years' reputation to do such a thing!

I suggest reading the book, "Deluxe: How Luxury Lost Its Luster." The author goes into how quality is declining in many areas, and she had to sign nondisclosure agreements to see factories putting the "Made In....." label on things that had been imported from China. It's unethical, they're just skimming into the land of illegal, but plenty of luxury companies are doing this very thing to increase profits. I look at the jewelry done by Chanel, and I can't help but form the opinion that it's done very cheaply in China since the techniques and findings aren't what they used to be.

 

[Ammietwist]

These types of "not made in France" rumors are recurring and frankly, I choose not to believe them for a variety of reasons, not the least of which is that Hermes just put on a huge dog and pony show across the US (and perhaps other countries, I don't know) where they show and describe the process of making the scarves. As others who were lucky enough to see the demonstrations noted, the scarves are done in Lyon - except for some of the hemming apparently. Why would they bother with such a massive ploy to cover up a Made in China connection?!?

Like many here, I am a long time collector of Hermes scarves and number fellow collectors among my friends. No one better to talk scarves with!! Many of us have collected for well over 10 years but I don't know of any of us who feels we are or have Hermes connections, which I usually consider to be someone with the kind of inside knowledge that a high-level employee would have.

IMO everyone who buys so much as a single "luxury" item needs to read the book "Deluxe: How Luxury Lost Its Luster." The author was in the factories where items from China were getting the more prestigious "Made In Italy" or "Made In France" tags, and since others have talked about this before, I'd say it's happening.

Even without reading the book, I noticed that quality really is declining all around with a variety of brands, and Hermes had a season or two where people complained about the quality of the silk twill used in the scarves. Others have noticed that the cashmere/silk shawls aren't as heavy as they used to be, and I've personally seen a lot of very badly hemmed scarves in recent years.

I have no problem whatsoever with Hermes getting their products from various countries if for no other reason than the extreme difficulty of getting Europeans to go into the craft trades with lengthy apprenticeships. They, like many others, want office jobs where they can retire early, and there's a desperate shortage of workers (whence the Chinese communities outside Florence). The problem comes in when they promote the company mythology, possibly lie a bit in the marketing and then continue to not only charge "luxury" prices but to also raise them far faster than any rate of inflation.

A real concern I have is that even before LVMH purchased a good chunk of Hermes stock, they were already planning a massive expansion of the company in already established markets as well as the emerging markets. Since Europe has experienced a labor shortage for this type of work, and they're going to ramp up production, I think it's a legitimate question to ask where these items are produced. And if they're outsourced in some fashion, will the quality really be the same.

 

[Ammietwist]

Let's not blindly believe in the countries of origin and every news from H or non H source. The fact of the matter is that all luxury houses ( and even everyday P&G consumer products) are going after for more profits. China or other third world countries may offer workmanship at par or slightly lower or higher than France. It is up to the brand to do everything they can to protect its integrity.

I would not be surprised that one day that some of the other non Kellys and birkins bags may be outsourced to other countries once they find the qualified artisans to do it. It is just too tempting not to do that. This is similar to a few months ago when H announced that they will not be taken over by LV but yet I read that some H family members have sold their stock last month.

Fact of life is never say 'never'. Buy only what you like and never blindly fall in love with any brand.

ITA that it's up to the brand to protect it's integrity, and even more to never fall blindly in love with any brand, but if they cut labor costs to that degree, I think the consumer will rightly ask them to justify the price tag. Or at least the double-digit increases that occur most every year.

 

[chkpfbeliever]

IMO everyone who buys so much as a single "luxury" item needs to read the book "Deluxe: How Luxury Lost Its Luster." The author was in the factories where items from China were getting the more prestigious "Made In Italy" or "Made In France" tags, and since others have talked about this before, I'd say it's happening.

Even without reading the book, I noticed that quality really is declining all around with a variety of brands, and Hermes had a season or two where people complained about the quality of the silk twill used in the scarves. Others have noticed that the cashmere/silk shawls aren't as heavy as they used to be, and I've personally seen a lot of very badly hemmed scarves in recent years.

I have no problem whatsoever with Hermes getting their products from various countries if for no other reason than the extreme difficulty of getting Europeans to go into the craft trades with lengthy apprenticeships. They, like many others, want office jobs where they can retire early, and there's a desperate shortage of workers (whence the Chinese communities outside Florence). The problem comes in when they promote the company mythology, possibly lie a bit in the marketing and then continue to not only charge "luxury" prices but to also raise them far faster than any rate of inflation.

A real concern I have is that even before LVMH purchased a good chunk of Hermes stock, they were already planning a massive expansion of the company in already established markets as well as the emerging markets. Since Europe has experienced a labor shortage for this type of work, and they're going to ramp up production, I think it's a legitimate question to ask where these items are produced. And if they're outsourced in some fashion, will the quality really be the same.

Ammietwist- You summarized it so well and hit the nail on its head. I think increased worldwide demand especially from emerging countries have many brands put profits ahead of quality. Coupled with a shortage of artisans in Europe, it is no surprise that many items will be outsourced. I just wish that governments can tighten the laws on the labels and close the loopholes. In the US, many of the cosmetics and even food show who distributes it but rarely do they disclose where it is actually manufactured. That is very sad and not fair to consumers.

 

[Balto Bag Lady]

I suggest reading the book, "Deluxe: How Luxury Lost Its Luster." The author goes into how quality is declining in many areas, and she had to sign nondisclosure agreements to see factories putting the "Made In....." label on things that had been imported from China. It's unethical, they're just skimming into the land of illegal, but plenty of luxury companies are doing this very thing to increase profits. I look at the jewelry done by Chanel, and I can't help but form the opinion that it's done very cheaply in China since the techniques and findings aren't what they used to be.

I put as much stock in Thomas' uncited sources as I did in Michael Tonnelo's brilliant and entertaining work of fiction.
If you cannot back up your sources, your "research" doesn't mean too much to me.

 

[chicinthecity777]

I suggest reading the book, "Deluxe: How Luxury Lost Its Luster." The author goes into how quality is declining in many areas, and she had to sign nondisclosure agreements to see factories putting the "Made In....." label on things that had been imported from China. It's unethical, they're just skimming into the land of illegal, but plenty of luxury companies are doing this very thing to increase profits. I look at the jewelry done by Chanel, and I can't help but form the opinion that it's done very cheaply in China since the techniques and findings aren't what they used to be.

If you choose to believe something just because it's printed, that's your choice and it's perfectly fine with me. I don't believe everything just because it's "published" because I've read enough things which are inaccurate or simply wrong from varies types of publications. The author you mentioned, if she's signed a non-disclosure agreement, how come she's telling everything in a book? Like I already said in my previous post, I don't really care about where it is produced, as long as it meets my quality expectation. If you think the quality is not up to your standard, simply don't buy. Nobody forces you to buy anything from anybody. So why don't we just agree on the disagreement and move on?

And FYI, I don't know about labelling law in the U.S. But where I live, this is reinforced quite widely by reputable retail companies. Even if it's just a cucumber from the supermarket, it will label the country of origin without fail.