Cheap Clothing, Expensive Handbags
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It's not a matter of designer, it's about ethics. Sweat shop clothes are unacceptable in the sense that the people who make them are being exploited and not being paid a living wage. It's much better to choose made in Europe or US clothes and support a fairer system, even if those clothes are more expensive.
I remember reading about perceived value of fashion and how fast fashion has skewed the public's perception of what prices should actually be for the clothes they buy (designer or not). Cheap clothes definitely equates to cheap labour. And cheap labour almost definitely translates into poor working conditions. Remember the 2013 factory collapse in Bangladesh?
Certainly, while contemporary designer brands cost a pretty penny, if they're made in Europe or the US or in a country with enforced labour laws ensuring a decent living wage and humane treatment of employees, I think it's absolutely worth it.
A word of caution though. "Made-in-Europe" may very well mean "Assembled-in-Europe, Made-Cheaply-Somewhere-Else". Even worse, there are little factory towns in Italy importing and employing cheap Chinese labour to supply the Made in Italy tag. Last I read of it was in 2010 but the latest news item I could find on the issue is in 2014.
Do your research. Learn as much as you can about the supply chain. Be informed.
Furthermore, fast fashion is problematic because it encourages throwaway culture. You buy more because you believe you're making a savings. But how sustainable is buying cheaper clothes at volume, only to leave them at the back of the closet to move on to the next trendy, equally cheaply sold thing? It's a vicious cycle. It's not good for the environment or the workers paid the bare minimum in rough working conditions.
It's also not good for anyone to have a closet heaving with unwanted and unloved items that just end up being burdensome to a person's mental and emotional wellbeing. I know because I am one such person. A higher price point makes me think twice about spending money, forcing me to minimise my wardrobe to a few key pieces that will last longer, style-wise and quality-wise.
In my opinion, prevention of overbuying (not necessarily overspending in this context), is better than curing the overbuying after the fact.
If you have the spare time, Google "Slow Movement". Its Wikipedia entry covers everything from food (the originator of slow movement) to science, to fashion. If you don't have the time, it's summed up quite nicely by the oft coined but little followed "quality over quantity".
Bangladesh garment workers suffer poor conditions two years after reform vows
Assault, verbal abuse and forced overtime persist following the Rana Plaza disaster, which killed 1,100 people in Dhaka, Human Rights Watch claims.
- The Guardian, April 2015
Source: http://www.theguardian.com/world/20...ll-suffering-two-years-after-factory-collapse
Source: http://www.theguardian.com/world/20...ll-suffering-two-years-after-factory-collapse
Certainly, while contemporary designer brands cost a pretty penny, if they're made in Europe or the US or in a country with enforced labour laws ensuring a decent living wage and humane treatment of employees, I think it's absolutely worth it.
A word of caution though. "Made-in-Europe" may very well mean "Assembled-in-Europe, Made-Cheaply-Somewhere-Else". Even worse, there are little factory towns in Italy importing and employing cheap Chinese labour to supply the Made in Italy tag. Last I read of it was in 2010 but the latest news item I could find on the issue is in 2014.
Fire Exposes Illegal Chinese Factories in Italy
Thousands of people have been smuggled into Italy, finding work at factories that ignore basic safety standards, while billions of euros are smuggled back to China.
- Associated Press via Business of Fashion, October 2014
Source: http://www.businessoffashion.com/articles/news-analysis/fire-exposes-illegal-chinese-factories-italy
Source: http://www.businessoffashion.com/articles/news-analysis/fire-exposes-illegal-chinese-factories-italy
Do your research. Learn as much as you can about the supply chain. Be informed.
Furthermore, fast fashion is problematic because it encourages throwaway culture. You buy more because you believe you're making a savings. But how sustainable is buying cheaper clothes at volume, only to leave them at the back of the closet to move on to the next trendy, equally cheaply sold thing? It's a vicious cycle. It's not good for the environment or the workers paid the bare minimum in rough working conditions.
It's also not good for anyone to have a closet heaving with unwanted and unloved items that just end up being burdensome to a person's mental and emotional wellbeing. I know because I am one such person. A higher price point makes me think twice about spending money, forcing me to minimise my wardrobe to a few key pieces that will last longer, style-wise and quality-wise.
In my opinion, prevention of overbuying (not necessarily overspending in this context), is better than curing the overbuying after the fact.
If you have the spare time, Google "Slow Movement". Its Wikipedia entry covers everything from food (the originator of slow movement) to science, to fashion. If you don't have the time, it's summed up quite nicely by the oft coined but little followed "quality over quantity".
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I have some pretty major body image issues, and buying clothes is really stressful and anxiety-inducing for me. Beautiful designer bags and -shoes don't make me hate the way I look. I don't spend much on clothes because I would rather spend it on something that makes me happy and makes me feel good about myself.
- Keep in mind there are affordable brands that have changed or are changing production to meet these ethics. H&M for example launched a campaign and has also been removing chemicals from their clothing.
There are quite a few brands that are a tad more than H&M but still not even close to contemporary designer.
- Also many high end brands have move production and may not be producing as ethical. Prada is making bags in China now, other brands were under criticism for hiring poor Chinese workers, and there is always the rumor that high end fashion is only "finished", in Europe. Many East Asian factories have claimed to be producing for European Luxury Labels as well...
- Aside from these things, consider that some simply won't be able to afford all goods luxury, even if they budget and buy quality over quantity. So they simply stick to buying a quality bag. I don't think they should be forced to buy designer clothing over a bag.
That depends almost entirely on the mentality of the buyer:
1. One can shop selectively at H&M, Zara etc/ buy less
2. You can treat these items well and they will last. Like I mentioned before I have lots of H&M items that are 10-20 years old and look great. I can take pictures if you are interested to see, they carry the old label
People tend to treat cheap clothing cheaply too...hot washes and dryers, when it should be cold washing, line drying and removing stains beforehand.
Afterall most designer clothing requires gentle washes or even dry cleaning too.
3. As a seamstress I can say the quality of the material and craftsmanship in terms of durability only ever so slightly outweighs that of cheaper brands. Cotton and Polyester stay cotton and Polyester no matter how pricey, the seams are "prettier" in high end clothing as in French Seams for example, but an overlock stitch can hold up well too.
I think really, we are more fooled into thinking designer items are of much better quality. We pay for brand name, pretty holigraphic tags, beautiful and innovative designs, pretty packaging, lovely stitching...but the quality of the clothing is not "that" much above cheaper brands.
Again this does not apply to everyone though. I will love a pretty Zara dress just as much as a Versace dress if the design is right.
When I shop I buy what I truly love. Whether it is a mainstream brand or something more pricey. Good looking items can be found at a lower price range. No one ever told me my H&M outfits look cheap, or my designer items strike them as amazing quality. Most people can't tell (and as a blogger I do get enough comments on that)
Trends are best ignored anyway...again buy what you love, wear it for years. If you love the Bohemian Dress, rock it for years to come.
I used to be the kind of person to buy cheap on sale items...just because they were on sale, and lots of them too. But I re-evaluated this thinking a while ago and went to still buying affordable, but less and only what I love. I'm not one to have unloved items in my wardrobe these days. Here and there I will invest in designer, but to a certain degree...not only because of finances, but also because it better be fantastic if I am going to spend a lot of money on it.
Bottom line is what I buy is loved, special, cared for...no matter if flea market item, affordable clothing, designer goods...and I think that is the best mentality, to value all your belongings well no matter the name or price tag.
I'd like to toss in, though, ethically made doesn't necessarily mean designer and it doesn't mean made in the USA or Europe. There are ethical factories in other parts of the world.
Love your honesty. Great comment. I don't work so I don't have to have a huge wardrobe (hence, I rather spend it on bags). Totally understand how clothes shopping can sometimes be stressful/not fun. I do try to find my own style that works for me & part of my "style" is a nice bag. To me, nice bags are little works of art. I love the history behind LV & Chanel. The designers creativity is something I can appreciate. I'm not a designer shoe person but I am a bag person. Regardless if my weight is fluctuating, the bag always fits. Luckily, I don't have "major" body issues but it kills me when I meet someone that does. I do see the beauty inside a person & when someone smiles, it changes everything. Stay strong & I'm sure you're rocking it every day. Enjoy your shoes & bags & I hope they keep a smile on your face. Hey, we're all different and we're all beautiful in different ways. Don't forget, smile [emoji3]
+1
This is the lesson I'm trying to teach to my daughter. She's at an age where she prefers to buy her own clothing. She understands that price & labels do not mean much if the workmanship and material content are subpar. She is learning to sew and this has really helped her decide whether or not a garment is well made. Some fast fashion companies are slowly changing to become more social responsible and using better materials. While some designer labels are cutting corners and producing lesser quality items but keeping the prices high.
You made a number of excellent points. Obviously everyone can do whatever their conscience allows them, personally I find that (knowingly) buying sweat shop made clothes, is unacceptable and even more so combined with expensive designer bags.
Here is some of what I do. I bought a few Eileen Fisher on sale at Nordstrom to get a feel for product and sizes. Then I shop Evilbay for EF in my sizes, reading carefully their size descriptions. Now, this is still going to be too much for some, but works great for me. Plus Norstrom rack, Hautelook , Nieman Marcus, etc. have marked down EF all the time. I mention Eileen Fisher as she is the only ethical designer who makes plus size clothes, but for regular size ladies there are many more options 
Very good post to combat many of the faulty assumptions stated. 👍- Keep in mind there are affordable brands that have changed or are changing production to meet these ethics. H&M for example launched a campaign and has also been removing chemicals from their clothing.
There are quite a few brands that are a tad more than H&M but still not even close to contemporary designer.
- Also many high end brands have move production and may not be producing as ethical. Prada is making bags in China now, other brands were under criticism for hiring poor Chinese workers, and there is always the rumor that high end fashion is only "finished", in Europe. Many East Asian factories have claimed to be producing for European Luxury Labels as well...
- Aside from these things, consider that some simply won't be able to afford all goods luxury, even if they budget and buy quality over quantity. So they simply stick to buying a quality bag. I don't think they should be forced to buy designer clothing over a bag.
That depends almost entirely on the mentality of the buyer:
1. One can shop selectively at H&M, Zara etc/ buy less
2. You can treat these items well and they will last. Like I mentioned before I have lots of H&M items that are 10-20 years old and look great. I can take pictures if you are interested to see, they carry the old label
People tend to treat cheap clothing cheaply too...hot washes and dryers, when it should be cold washing, line drying and removing stains beforehand.
Afterall most designer clothing requires gentle washes or even dry cleaning too.
3. As a seamstress I can say the quality of the material and craftsmanship in terms of durability only ever so slightly outweighs that of cheaper brands. Cotton and Polyester stay cotton and Polyester no matter how pricey, the seams are "prettier" in high end clothing as in French Seams for example, but an overlock stitch can hold up well too.
I think really, we are more fooled into thinking designer items are of much better quality. We pay for brand name, pretty holigraphic tags, beautiful and innovative designs, pretty packaging, lovely stitching...but the quality of the clothing is not "that" much above cheaper brands.
Again this does not apply to everyone though. I will love a pretty Zara dress just as much as a Versace dress if the design is right.
When I shop I buy what I truly love. Whether it is a mainstream brand or something more pricey. Good looking items can be found at a lower price range. No one ever told me my H&M outfits look cheap, or my designer items strike them as amazing quality. Most people can't tell (and as a blogger I do get enough comments on that)
Trends are best ignored anyway...again buy what you love, wear it for years. If you love the Bohemian Dress, rock it for years to come.
I used to be the kind of person to buy cheap on sale items...just because they were on sale, and lots of them too. But I re-evaluated this thinking a while ago and went to still buying affordable, but less and only what I love. I'm not one to have unloved items in my wardrobe these days. Here and there I will invest in designer, but to a certain degree...not only because of finances, but also because it better be fantastic if I am going to spend a lot of money on it.
Bottom line is what I buy is loved, special, cared for...no matter if flea market item, affordable clothing, designer goods...and I think that is the best mentality, to value all your belongings well no matter the name or price tag.
And, if I wanted to wear one of my Chanel bags with yoga pants from target I would. If I wanted to wear my mink coat and carry a plastic grocery sack I would. It's laughable that anyone has any sort of a value judgement on how I manage my closet and any combination of my items.
1. One can shop selectively at H&M, Zara etc/ buy less
2. You can treat these items well and they will last. Like I mentioned before I have lots of H&M items that are 10-20 years old and look great. I can take pictures if you are interested to see, they carry the old label
People tend to treat cheap clothing cheaply too...hot washes and dryers, when it should be cold washing, line drying and removing stains beforehand.
Afterall most designer clothing requires gentle washes or even dry cleaning too.
3. As a seamstress I can say the quality of the material and craftsmanship in terms of durability only ever so slightly outweighs that of cheaper brands. Cotton and Polyester stay cotton and Polyester no matter how pricey, the seams are "prettier" in high end clothing as in French Seams for example, but an overlock stitch can hold up well too.
I think really, we are more fooled into thinking designer items are of much better quality. We pay for brand name, pretty holigraphic tags, beautiful and innovative designs, pretty packaging, lovely stitching...but the quality of the clothing is not "that" much above cheaper brands.
Again this does not apply to everyone though. I will love a pretty Zara dress just as much as a Versace dress if the design is right.
When I shop I buy what I truly love. Whether it is a mainstream brand or something more pricey. Good looking items can be found at a lower price range. No one ever told me my H&M outfits look cheap, or my designer items strike them as amazing quality. Most people can't tell (and as a blogger I do get enough comments on that)
Trends are best ignored anyway...again buy what you love, wear it for years. If you love the Bohemian Dress, rock it for years to come.
I used to be the kind of person to buy cheap on sale items...just because they were on sale, and lots of them too. But I re-evaluated this thinking a while ago and went to still buying affordable, but less and only what I love. I'm not one to have unloved items in my wardrobe these days. Here and there I will invest in designer, but to a certain degree...not only because of finances, but also because it better be fantastic if I am going to spend a lot of money on it.
Bottom line is what I buy is loved, special, cared for...no matter if flea market item, affordable clothing, designer goods...and I think that is the best mentality, to value all your belongings well no matter the name or price tag.
I agree with these points. I myself buy from H&M and Zara occasionally and I've learned to stop buying clothes on a whim or on sale ages ago.
The skewed perception of value goes both ways. On one end of the spectrum, hundred dollar or thousand dollar price tags that involve buying into branding, mostly, and the belief that one is buying quality. It's not always the case that designer or Made-in-Europe/USA is quality. Nor is it always the case that designer brands are fully transparent and follow ethical production guidelines. But I do have to point out, designer brands tend to stand behind their product and have warranties (however limited) and the resale value of certain brands seem to give back a considerable return. But these usually involve handbags and clothing is not always valued the same way.
On the other end of the spectrum, one is buying into the idea that they'll make a savings. It's not untrue, but it's not strictly true either. When I talk of throwaway culture, I don't mean to disparage people who shop at fast fashion brands because of the more accessible price point. I mean that excess is almost inevitable. It really screwed with me when I was younger, finding so many things at such lower price points. I bought so many clothes and shoes without ever wearing them. It's actually one of my biggest regrets to this day. I don't earn much at all and the epiphany about how much fast fashion influences my spending was life-changing. Now, I only buy one or two pieces every few months and I love my non-branded nylon handbag just as much as I love my LV bag. I fully admit I love designer brands but I don't necessarily purchase often or spend big on clothing at all. I spend more on my cats and my dog than I do myself.
It would be nice to find a happy medium between the two, to buy local, lesser known brands at a reasonable price point (for both consumer and producer) but accessibility, as always, is a big problem. Smaller companies don't always have the resources to be able to compete against larger retailers and get their goods to market. In this respect, fast fashion brands are no different from luxury designer brands in the intensity of their marketing and branding. Consumers tend to believe that because there is a visibility to the brand, that a level of quality exists in comparison to an unknown, locally made fashion label.
Companies have a priority to their shareholders first, consumer second. Therefore, they will often try to find ways of cutting corners until it blows up in their face in the media. This won't change anytime soon. I'm glad H&M and a number of other companies are going in the right direction. But H&M is certainly not the end of the story. There are hundreds of companies that are not following a more sustainable and ethical line of production.
Manelieht, you're part of a rarer breed of consumer. You have gained an enlightened philosophy towards clothing and you have insider knowledge on how clothes are made. Thus, you are in an empowered position. Most people don't know or care, nor do they want to know or care. This, to me, is an imbalance of power between consumer and producer.
I don't want to place the burden on the consumer to make the ethical choice. If they're comfortable with it, then that's where they're at. I'm probably doing any number of things that are within the grey areas of ethics. But perhaps, it would also be in the consumer's best interest to be able to make informed decisions about the products they consume. It's not a medical procedure or anything as drastic or life-altering but it's certainly important. If people are in the position to be able to take a deeper look around, there are things that could be improved upon in which ultimately, only the informed consumer can effect change.
Thank you. ❤️
I love how this thread makes me think, and how everybody is stating their opinions clearly but with respect for one another's viewpoints.
Yes, some labels decided to cater to what the customers want, while others cheapened their production.
Your daughter seems to be growing up with a great mindset! When I was a teen fast fashion wasn't as popular. I had my dockers boots, levis jacket, eastpack backpack, Baby G watch. I was in a really happy place but then entered a phase where I began buying too many cheap things I did not really love, just because I could have lots. Glad I eventually stopped myself.
Just that argument sort of goes out the window with some of the points I listed ^^....designer isn't necessarily better in many ways. Not even guaranteed ethical either. And it is so hard to know what really goes on behind the scenes.
Lol at the grocery sack! New trend?
