AUTHENTICATE this COACH

[Hyacinth]

Hi Ladies,

What do you think of this listing on Ebay? The serial number is very unique(First 3 digit, always see only 4 digits or letter followed by number) "60C- 9327", can you please educate me on this? Thanks again so much for your help.

Item: COACH* CLASSIC Willis BLACK LEATHER handbag purse satchel *
Seller: golfergirlismyname
Link: http://forum.purseblog.com/coach-shopping/authenticate-this-coach-818914-180.html

There's no auction number or link. Please be sure you always put that information in your posts.

And although the serial number isn't very clear, I'm seeing G0C-9927, would that be a problem? The bag is probably ok but the pictures aren't clear enough to be completely sure.

 

[Hyacinth]

@hyacinth thank again you so much for the advice. I spoke to the seller about the condition and she said it is in very good condition. The owner is a lady who bought a lot of stuffs, but afterward got sick and passed away and couldn't use her bag. They found this bag together with a bunch of her new unworn shoes Feel bad about it, but seem like a rare find

Also. the seller who sells the fake purse is not on ebay but on PoshMark, I left a comment there and they won't be able to delete my comment, so hopefully people will be smart to read and do some searching before buying from her

For that and other reasons, we don't recommend buying on Poshmark. It seems too much like iOffer and the crooks seem to feel that both are great places for dumping fakes on uneducated buyers.

 

[whateve]

Aha... Okay, all of that makes sense in an oddly Coach way...

I had already noticed lots of _4P anomalies on other styles, and this puts it into perspective.

Thanks bunches, both of you!

ADDED: whateve, I tried to multi-quote you in there, too - it didn't work... but I thank you, too!

You're welcome. I had come to the same conclusion as Hyacinth when I found all those 4P creeds that looked like 2004 bags.

 

[netlawyer]

one more please! I don't have exact measurements. the hang tag is split.
View attachment 2255905View attachment 2255907View attachment 2255908View attachment 2255909View attachment 2255910

I'm seeing a couple of problems besides just the lining.

The back zipper - the way the zipper is set into the bag isn't right. There shouldn't be any of the fabric around the zipper showing at all, just rolled leather edging that covers almost the entire zipper, and the zipper pull has too many links on the chain. Take a close look at the one in this listing:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/COACH-VINTA...880?pt=US_CSA_WH_Handbags&hash=item5ae8e14090


The creed stamping says Italy but the plant code is from a US plant. The serial number font is NOT right for the Italian plant even if we assume the 2 plant codes were reversed and actually should have read "B5E-". The center bar of the "E" in the Italian-made bags is shorter than the top & bottom bars, see this listing which I've also compared with the one I own that has an A5E- prefix, both creeds are identical but yours isn't:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/COACH-SONOM...362?pt=US_CSA_WH_Handbags&hash=item3a82855542

The details of the Coach logo on the 2 Italian creeds is also slightly different from yours. The cartouche is centered on the border around the creed and the name Coach is smaller.


There's a REMOTE chance that Coach may have been using the B plant for emergency production and given them a creed from the Italy plant to use, but that seems unusual. The B plant seems to have been mostly or completely deactivated by 1995 and only shows up rarely after that but I don't have any solid info about the timeframe, just guesses. Maybe they were given the old Italy stamp temporarily since Italy was just switching to the newer format stamp right around that time. I don't have any B plant creeds from 1995 to compare yours to.

I wish it was possible to see more photos of yours and be able to enlarge them. I'd especially like to see the inside pocket zipper and trim. Normally I'd like to see a closeup of the side of the magnetic snap where the maker and patent numbers are stamped but the one in mine is so worn down that it probably wouldn't be much help.

Yours MAY be ok, but there are problems that make it impossible to authenticate either way.

Hey Hyacinth... I'm having a dilemma over this now. I have 2 identical Olive Nubuc duffels...bought together....they are identical in every way except that one is made in Costa Rica and has the striped lining and one is made is Italy and has the solid lining and the creed says "distintive". The seams, zippers, measurements, feel, etc are completely identical. Is there a chance that there was an odd batch of Creeds from the Italian plant? I'm getting pics now.

Hi all - wanted to weigh in here, I think it is very unlikely that Coach shared an Italy creed stamp with a US plant. US and international trade rules require that products be correctly marked with the Country of Origin Labeling (COOL). That's been the case since 1930 - a good wiki article is here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Country_of_Origin_Labeling

Coach was certainly aware of this requirement in 1995 which is why they had Italy (and other country) creed stamps in the first place. Unless there is a theory that Coach used the B plant code in Italy or the month/plant code are reversed in this particular bag, I am dubious.

I will be very interested in Tetondeb's photos - the font and placement of the numbers seem off to me on erin323's creed.

 

[lleongll]

There's no auction number or link. Please be sure you always put that information in your posts.

And although the serial number isn't very clear, I'm seeing G0C-9927, would that be a problem? The bag is probably ok but the pictures aren't clear enough to be completely sure.

@Hyacinth thanks again for your help and sorry for posting the wrong link, hand and eyes are playing trick on me

 

[Hyacinth]

Hi all - wanted to weigh in here, I think it is very unlikely that Coach shared an Italy creed stamp with a US plant. US and international trade rules require that products be correctly marked with the Country of Origin Labeling (COOL). That's been the case since 1930 - a good wiki article is here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Country_of_Origin_Labeling

Coach was certainly aware of this requirement in 1995 which is why they had Italy (and other country) creed stamps in the first place. Unless there is a theory that Coach used the B plant code in Italy or the month/plant code are reversed in this particular bag, I am dubious.

I will be very interested in Tetondeb's photos - the font and placement of the numbers seem off to me on erin323's creed.

Did you get a chance to check posts 2682 and 2686? I tried to cover all possibilities in my answers but the only conclusion I can really draw is that there are some very close Sonoma fakes out there.

 

[Rarity]

Yes, the "2" plant code represents Turkey, along with the capital letter "i". The creed's hard to read but it's definitely from Turkey.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/VINTAGE-AUT...D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

Hyacinth,

Can you tell me when they started using numbers instead of letters in their plant codes? I want to add this info to my cheat sheet.

Thanks!

 

[Hyacinth]

Hyacinth,

Can you tell me when they started using numbers instead of letters in their plant codes? I want to add this info to my cheat sheet.

Thanks!

I'm not sure when Turkey was assigned a number "2" code, probably mid to later 1990s. Some of the Chinese plants have been using numbers since the very early 2000s.

 

[Rarity]

I'm not sure when Turkey was assigned a number "2" code, probably mid to later 1990s. Some of the Chinese plants have been using numbers since the very early 2000s.

Thank you.

 

[netlawyer]

Did you get a chance to check posts 2682 and 2686? I tried to cover all possibilities in my answers but the only conclusion I can really draw is that there are some very close Sonoma fakes out there.

Just did - I note that both Tetondeb and erin323's bags have the "DISTINTIVE" misspelling. I agree that you've covered all the bases - Tetondeb's bag doesn't support the argument that the month and plant codes were reversed with the G plant code. Too many things would have to happen - one of which would be that Coach would use a Made in Italy stamp for a bag that wasn't made in Italy or it used the G plant code for Italy - it doesn't add up.

I don't know how many nubuc stamps Italy might have had - but all three of these bags have the striped lining and DISTINCTIVE is spelled correctly. The little half-serif hook on the ends of the N is interesting and shows up on all three of these. All my Sonoma nubuc bags are packed away (starting some renovations, and already having withdrawals) but I know I don't have any with black lining to compare to.

 

[Hyacinth]

Just did - I note that both Tetondeb and erin323's bags have the "DISTINTIVE" misspelling. I agree that you've covered all the bases - Tetondeb's bag doesn't support the argument that the month and plant codes were reversed with the G plant code. Too many things would have to happen - one of which would be that Coach would use a Made in Italy stamp for a bag that wasn't made in Italy or it used the G plant code for Italy - it doesn't add up.

I don't know how many nubuc stamps Italy might have had - but all three of these bags have the striped lining and DISTINCTIVE is spelled correctly. The little half-serif hook on the ends of the N is interesting and shows up on all three of these. All my Sonoma nubuc bags are packed away (starting some renovations, and already having withdrawals) but I know I don't have any with black lining to compare to.

If you mean solid black lining, I doubt if any genuine Sonomas ever had it. And apparently Coach had more than enough of the striped lining available that they were able to use it in the Hudsons and a few other lines from the mid to late 1990s. When you think about it, Sonomas didn't have a lot of fussy details for the counterfeiters to copy. Two different kinds of zipper pulls, one type of strap slider, and a striped lining. I'm surprised the fakers often didn't bother with the linings. The cheaper ones don't even bother getting the creed wording right.

We've found some differences in linings in recent years too, depending on when bags were made and whether they were for the boutiques or the outlets. Coach started introducing the jacquard Sig C linings in the China-made leather bags starting in or around 2003, but the few leather bags still made in the US during that time stayed unlined or just had a basic solid color or Lozenge lining.

 

[SherriM]

Thank you for the information about my coach (fake) bag. I found it at St. Vincent's and was so excited, I put it on ebay. OUCH. I learn from my mistakes and will never do that again without finding out if it is authentic or not. I felt so bad. I would never try to sell something fake. This forum is great and I will be back. Thank you again!

 

[SherriM]

That's an interesting one because it ties in to the ones we were just discussing. Is it a fake, or a mistake in stamping the year code?

I'm strongly leaning toward fake though, since this bag would have been made in September 2004 if it was just a stamping mistake. There's no way it could ever have been made in 1994 as the 4 in the serial number seems to show - and those J4D- prefixes turn out to be in fakes at least 25 percent of the time. That style only came out in 2002.

There's proof from other creed photos that Coach had already started using the correct "04" code and also switched that plant's production AND plant code to China by January 2004, see the photos below. There's no way the bag in your post could have been made in the US eight months later in the same "D" plant.

So it's fake, sorry. The stitching around the top especially as shown in the second-last photo is also pretty uneven.

Thank you for the information about my coach (fake) bag. I found it at St. Vincent's and was so excited, I put it on ebay. OUCH. I learn from my mistakes and will never do that again without finding out if it is authentic or not. I felt so bad. I would never try to sell something fake. This forum is great and I will be back. Thank you again!

 

[netlawyer]

Hi ladies -

I'd appreciate your opinions on two recent purchases. I don't have any concerns and am really happy with both bags, but I haven't seen either in person before so I just wanted a check before I leave feedback for the sellers. I have developed a real hankering for gray bags since I got my Phoebe and my vintage gray bags are my favorites - it's the perfect neutral for me. So, there you go, more gray bags...

Thanks in advance!

Coach 15744 Vintage Gray Leather LRG Shoulder Bag $698
Seller: shopnagain
Item: 251301481045
http://www.ebay.com/itm/251301481045
Comments: Mia Harper Leather Satchel. Measurements: 16 x 10 x 6 Lighter weight than expected, which is nice. The textured leather really hides wear. The snap rings on the strap say COACH, let me know if you need photos of that or any other aspect of the bag.
Photos: https://www.dropbox.com/sh/xcn7ihbwqaxv8l2/jFM4I8Hf4I I powdered the creed in the last photo to make it easier to read.

Coach Legacy American Icon Pocket Tote
Seller: jwgroe
Item: 151076327280
http://www.ebay.com/itm/151076327280
Comments: Seller has zero feedback. Bag has been retagged w/a factory tag. Poor thing was flattened out and shoved in a priority mail carton, I've reblocked her with cardboard and tissue and warmed the leather with a hair dryer, so she came through OK. Size is 13 x 12 x 3 1/4
Photos of bag here: https://www.dropbox.com/sh/138h635ayfsnwhd/bp-SJ2GJem

 

[BeenBurned]

Hi ladies -

I'd appreciate your opinions on two recent purchases. I don't have any concerns and am really happy with both bags, but I haven't seen either in person before so I just wanted a check before I leave feedback for the sellers. I have developed a real hankering for gray bags since I got my Phoebe and my vintage gray bags are my favorites - it's the perfect neutral for me. So, there you go, more gray bags...

Thanks in advance!

Coach 15744 Vintage Gray Leather LRG Shoulder Bag $698
Seller: shopnagain
Item: 251301481045
http://www.ebay.com/itm/251301481045
Comments: Mia Harper Leather Satchel. Measurements: 16 x 10 x 6 Lighter weight than expected, which is nice. The textured leather really hides wear. The snap rings on the strap say COACH, let me know if you need photos of that or any other aspect of the bag.
Photos: https://www.dropbox.com/sh/xcn7ihbwqaxv8l2/jFM4I8Hf4I I powdered the creed in the last photo to make it easier to read.

Coach Legacy American Icon Pocket Tote
Seller: jwgroe
Item: 151076327280
http://www.ebay.com/itm/151076327280
Comments: Seller has zero feedback. Bag has been retagged w/a factory tag. Poor thing was flattened out and shoved in a priority mail carton, I've reblocked her with cardboard and tissue and warmed the leather with a hair dryer, so she came through OK. Size is 13 x 12 x 3 1/4
Photos of bag here: https://www.dropbox.com/sh/138h635ayfsnwhd/bp-SJ2GJem

Both look good.

The second seller is a newbie and may not realize the importance of proper packaging. She has another poorly listed Coach bag and her next buyer may not be as tolerant as you are. A bit of constructive criticism wouldn't hurt.