AUTHENTICATE This COACH
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#1 - looks okay
#2 - looks okay though there should be more pictures
#3 - I don't recommend thequeenscloset11. Most, if not all her listings use pictures stolen from other sellers or other websites. When you buy from a seller who doesn't show the actual item, there's no telling what you'll receive.
Hello!
Could anyone help authenticate this Willis purse? It is not navy blue but a lighter toned medium to dark blue. I will post pictures of the black Willis on another post!)
Item: Coach Vintage Leather Handbag Lot of 2
Listing Number: 170680488285
Seller: sahm2six
Link: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=170680488285&ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT
Comments: I know this isn't "vintage", date code indicates 2005. It is a really lovely medium - dark blue, not navy. Hardware is silver color. I think the little round bullseye mark on the Creed means outlet center? I have added my own pictures.
Thank you very much!
Could anyone help authenticate this Willis purse? It is not navy blue but a lighter toned medium to dark blue. I will post pictures of the black Willis on another post!)
Item: Coach Vintage Leather Handbag Lot of 2
Listing Number: 170680488285
Seller: sahm2six
Link: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=170680488285&ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT
Comments: I know this isn't "vintage", date code indicates 2005. It is a really lovely medium - dark blue, not navy. Hardware is silver color. I think the little round bullseye mark on the Creed means outlet center? I have added my own pictures.
Thank you very much!
Attachments
Hello,
I am new to PurseForum but have been reading your past posts about Coach quality, Creed numbers and fakes. You are are an awesome group of knowledgable people! I would appreciate help in authenticating some of my collection.
Item: Red Coach Purse Bag 338-0731
Listing Number: 260828732357
Seller: Porkqueen68
Link: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=260828732357&ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT
Comments: I realize the Creed number means it was made before 1991 and the last 4 digits are not a model number. The seller didn't have many pictures so I took more of the bag I received.
Thank you for sharing your expertise!
If there's a pocket under the front flap it's called a Spectator Bag and is from the late 1980s. Looks ok to me.
Originally Posted by casadelosgatos 
Thank you, Hyacinth, for the taking a look at the pictures and replying. The attachment of the blue purse was helpful, too, but unfortunately I couldn't mag it enough to see some of the detail. I am attaching additional photos, which I am hoping will be of some help. I looked at the zipper and it is a YKK. The pull device at the end resembles another I have seen on a "how to spot a fake" website. I see your point about the color of the zipper, as well as the color of the thread. I saw one of the more recent posts also had a blue zipper with a brown leather.
What did you mean by a "pre-production" bag?
Thanks for your help!
A pre-production or Pilot Bag is a bag released in very limited numbers several months to a year or more before the full release of the bag is scheduled in order to gauge the buying public's reaction. I don't know what Coach did regarding pre-production bags that far back so it's impossible to say for sure if it might be one or if there would have been any kind of stamp or mark in the bag to show it was a pre-release bag.
As for the zipper, that "industrial-style" heavy-duty zipper was common in Coach's casual styles in the early to mid 1980s, but there are 2 problems with that kind of zipper appearing in your bag. One is that the Carriage Classics really weren't considered casual, they were more toward the dressy end of the scale and I can't see Coach using a casual type of zipper in that bag. The second and biggest problem is actually because of what you just mentioned about the zipper being YKK, since the zippers in that industrial style were, as far as I know, usually made by Talon, NOT YKK. Coach didn't start using YKK zippers until they started expanding production in the late 80s and early 90s, and I don't remember seeing that style of zipper with a YKK logo.
So that actually tilts the scale a bit more toward the bag being counterfeit.
And I hope that clarifies why those "authenticity guides" are so dangerous - not just because their information is usually totally wrong, but because authenticating a bag invovles SO much more than just looking at a zipper or seeing if the numbers in the serial are lined up straight! There are dozens of different things to analyze and if someone isn't familiar with that EXACT bag or family and also with Coach's designs and production methods during the time period the bag was supposedly made, they CAN'T make an educated authentication. There are no simple Rules and it requires an LOT of experience and actual research to be able to authenticate some of the trickier bags - and spot the fakes.
Thank you, Hyacinth, for the taking a look at the pictures and replying. The attachment of the blue purse was helpful, too, but unfortunately I couldn't mag it enough to see some of the detail. I am attaching additional photos, which I am hoping will be of some help. I looked at the zipper and it is a YKK. The pull device at the end resembles another I have seen on a "how to spot a fake" website. I see your point about the color of the zipper, as well as the color of the thread. I saw one of the more recent posts also had a blue zipper with a brown leather.What did you mean by a "pre-production" bag?
Thanks for your help!
A pre-production or Pilot Bag is a bag released in very limited numbers several months to a year or more before the full release of the bag is scheduled in order to gauge the buying public's reaction. I don't know what Coach did regarding pre-production bags that far back so it's impossible to say for sure if it might be one or if there would have been any kind of stamp or mark in the bag to show it was a pre-release bag.
As for the zipper, that "industrial-style" heavy-duty zipper was common in Coach's casual styles in the early to mid 1980s, but there are 2 problems with that kind of zipper appearing in your bag. One is that the Carriage Classics really weren't considered casual, they were more toward the dressy end of the scale and I can't see Coach using a casual type of zipper in that bag. The second and biggest problem is actually because of what you just mentioned about the zipper being YKK, since the zippers in that industrial style were, as far as I know, usually made by Talon, NOT YKK. Coach didn't start using YKK zippers until they started expanding production in the late 80s and early 90s, and I don't remember seeing that style of zipper with a YKK logo.
So that actually tilts the scale a bit more toward the bag being counterfeit.
And I hope that clarifies why those "authenticity guides" are so dangerous - not just because their information is usually totally wrong, but because authenticating a bag invovles SO much more than just looking at a zipper or seeing if the numbers in the serial are lined up straight! There are dozens of different things to analyze and if someone isn't familiar with that EXACT bag or family and also with Coach's designs and production methods during the time period the bag was supposedly made, they CAN'T make an educated authentication. There are no simple Rules and it requires an LOT of experience and actual research to be able to authenticate some of the trickier bags - and spot the fakes.
I think the bag looks okay but the older classic bags aren't my specialty so please do wait for other opinions on the bag.
My comment concerns the seller and her feedback.
Often, for a seller who doesn't sell a lot, one or two negs can skew a feedback score to make the seller's rep look worse than it actually is. But in this case, I'm more bothered by the seller's responses to her feedbacks because they are nasty, accusatory and immature.
And the most recent neg for an item not received (although not responded to by the seller) is concerning because the buyer won it on June 6 and nearly a month passed and she didn't receive it.
Personally, I'd stay away from earlierthebetter.
Originally Posted by casadelosgatos
What did you mean by a "pre-production" bag?
Thanks for your help!
A pre-production or Pilot Bag is a bag released in very limited numbers several months to a year or more before the full release of the bag is scheduled in order to gauge the buying public's reaction. I don't know what Coach did regarding pre-production bags that far back so it's impossible to say for sure if it might be one or if there would have been any kind of stamp or mark in the bag to show it was a pre-release bag.
As for the zipper, that "industrial-style" heavy-duty zipper was common in Coach's casual styles in the early to mid 1980s, but there are 2 problems with that kind of zipper appearing in your bag. One is that the Carriage Classics really weren't considered casual, they were more toward the dressy end of the scale and I can't see Coach using a casual type of zipper in that bag. The second and biggest problem is actually because of what you just mentioned about the zipper being YKK, since the zippers in that industrial style were, as far as I know, usually made by Talon, NOT YKK. Coach didn't start using YKK zippers until they started expanding production in the late 80s and early 90s, and I don't remember seeing that style of zipper with a YKK logo.
So that actually tilts the scale a bit more toward the bag being counterfeit.
And I hope that clarifies why those "authenticity guides" are so dangerous - not just because their information is usually totally wrong, but because authenticating a bag invovles SO much more than just looking at a zipper or seeing if the numbers in the serial are lined up straight! There are dozens of different things to analyze and if someone isn't familiar with that EXACT bag or family and also with Coach's designs and production methods during the time period the bag was supposedly made, they CAN'T make an educated authentication. There are no simple Rules and it requires an LOT of experience and actual research to be able to authenticate some of the trickier bags - and spot the fakes.
Oh, and BTW, the pull device on the zipper that some other site said was the sign of a fake? That's the common pull on older and vintage Coaches, although the ring on the end seems a bit larger than usual.
Like I said, please ignore any advice you find in those bogus authenticity guides. There are maybe half a dozen here and at Ebay that are reasonably accurate - including mine, of course (COUGH!) - but the vast majority are just Copy-and-Paste rehashes of some previous and even MORE out of date Guide.
That style number 5206 is the "Full Flap Messenger Briefcase" and that one is from 1999 and looks fine.
The buckles are fine for that bag.
The buckle isn't a problem - some older Coaches from the "classic" lines (10 to 20 years old) had buckles that were stamped Coach. But in general, the more times the Coach name is stamped into a bag's hardware, the more likely it is to be fake. Again, there are exceptions to every so-called Rule except maybe for two.
And the rest of the bag is fine. It's a Full Flap Messenger Brief from 1999.
As for the seller's Feedback, Toolhaus.org shows their entire Feedback history - you decide if you want to buy from them.
http://toolhaus.org/cgi-bin/negs?User=earlierthebetter&Dirn=Received+by&ref=home
thanks BeenBurned, DemRam & Hyacinth for the quick replies. now as BeenBurned pointed out, I have to decide if I am willing to wrangle with a problem child seller
Thank you so much, Hyacinth!
However, there is no pocket under the front flap. Just a long pocket on the back side.
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