i always wonder that in educating sellers who we believe to be genuinely fooled, and as sellers of authentic things on ebay who genuinely want to reassure and educate our buyers about authentic goods by sharing our knowledge about signs of authenticity, are we not giving the counterfitters more information...? i am not saying we should not do these things, but how do we do so without at the same time educating counterfitters. i suppose with the net, we can never really tell who the counterfitters are. i am just sharing my dilema with you... and wonder what you all think about what approach we should take.
are we educating counterfitters by giving info?
- Thread starter bagpunk
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One of the replica sites actually wrote this: [We actually buy an authentic Marc Jacobs Quilted Stam bag to take apart to copy, this ensures that these replica, inspired, knock off, fake, imitation, knockoff, mirror image Marc Jacobs Quilted Stam, handbags, bags, purse, clutches are made as close to the genuine one as possible.]
If a bag can be replicated, receipt/tags/dustbag/giftbag/etc can certainly be copied as well. How hard can that be?
If a bag can be replicated, receipt/tags/dustbag/giftbag/etc can certainly be copied as well. How hard can that be?
The counterfitters can go to nordstrom/NM/etc. buy the bag and return it when they're done with it. So if they can do that, there is no stopping them and we're just left to try to educate consumers. My point is, I don't think we're helping counterfitters, I think we're educating consumers. Counterfitters will continue as long as they have access to the product.
Counterfeit manufacturers are very sophisticated in their productions of replicas, and have access to the same material, information, technology, etc as the actual designers. As consumers, it all comes down to supply and demand: the only thing we can do is not purchase them. While most if not all of us on this site oppose fakes, there are many other consumers who knowingly and eagerly buy fakes. And as long as that demand is there, the supply will also be there to meet it. It's the people who UNknowingly buy fakes that I feel bad for, but that's why it's so important for the consumer to educate herself and to use common sense (ie, not expecting to get authentic bag for half the price).
I've had my own (limited) experience with fakes, I knowingly bought one replica and I ended up giving it away before I ever carried it out of the house, despite what I paid for it (good replicas aren't cheap). I gave it to someone who couldn't care less about designer bags and was just happy to have a new, functional, leather bag. But I still felt bad about buying it in the first place....never again!!
I've had my own (limited) experience with fakes, I knowingly bought one replica and I ended up giving it away before I ever carried it out of the house, despite what I paid for it (good replicas aren't cheap). I gave it to someone who couldn't care less about designer bags and was just happy to have a new, functional, leather bag. But I still felt bad about buying it in the first place....never again!!
Yes so true regarding counterfiet manufacturers being very sophisticated.
Most counterfiet manufacturers have the original product in their hands and are working on replicating before we consumers have access to it in the retail world.
Educating ourselves and buying from reputable retailers is key.
Information here is great based on our experiences with actually buying the item and showing photos, telling details etc.
As far as the sophisticated counterfeiter, they had this info long before we did.
Most counterfiet manufacturers have the original product in their hands and are working on replicating before we consumers have access to it in the retail world.
Educating ourselves and buying from reputable retailers is key.
Information here is great based on our experiences with actually buying the item and showing photos, telling details etc.
As far as the sophisticated counterfeiter, they had this info long before we did.
I was actually worrying about this yesterday with Suli's post. That was a pretty minute detail that she found. Could that help someone counterfeit her bag better? This thread makes me feel better though. They ALREADY have access to real bags...scary but I guess it's good to educate everyone else.
There's an article (written by Dana Thomas) on counterfeit goods in the January 2007 issue of Harper's Bazaar (US Edition). Dana Thomas's book, Deluxe, will be published by the Penguin Press in August.
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[....
For years, it was easy to spot a fake. For handbags, the material was cheap, the stiching was uneven, and the logos were a little off. Watches looked as if they were made of tin or brass, and they kept rotten time. You couldn't even see through faux-luxury-brand sunglasses because the lenses were so cloudy. I remember walking into a hip-looking clothing store with my husband one evening in the French Concession district in Shanghai in April 2004. The racks were filled with Giorgio Armani suits. At least, that's what the label read. We picked out a gray one with a price of $150. The fabric felt cheap. The lining was cheap. My husband tried it on. The jacket was crooked.
But now counterfeiters are getting so good that it's becoming difficult to tell whether an item is legit or not. They buy real handbags, wallets, and clothes, take them apart, scan the pieces on a computer, and send the images via e-mail to their factories in Asia. With watches, they study the real ones and copy them with cheaper materials. I went to a Swiss-watch expert in Hong Kong to buy a fake Rolex. We were approached by a shady guy on Nathan Road, just behind the Peninsula Hotel, and we asked him to take us to see the watches. We went down several dark alleys, into a tenement that would have been condemmed in the United States, and up a rattling elevator to the sixth floor. Our hustler knocked on the steel-reinforced door and uttered a code word through the peep hatch, and we were let in. It was a dingy single room filled with four very menacing men and shelves of fake Chanel 2.55 handbags and the newly released Chanel J12 ceramic chronograph watches. We said we wanted a Rolex. He showed us a steel Oyster Perpetual and told us it was $80. It looked real to me. After a bit of negotiation, we got it down to $40. When we left, my friend said the watch was an excellent copy and that it would take someone from Rolex to identify it as fake...]
* Buy luxury goods from either brand boutiques or mainstream dealers such as department stores and brand-approved Web sites. Items available at a flea market, from a street peddler, or via spam in your e-mail inbox are likely to be fake.
* Report counterfeit dealers to the Internationl AntiCounterfeiting Coalition: Call 866-NOTFAKE, or go to iacc.org - DT.
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[....
For years, it was easy to spot a fake. For handbags, the material was cheap, the stiching was uneven, and the logos were a little off. Watches looked as if they were made of tin or brass, and they kept rotten time. You couldn't even see through faux-luxury-brand sunglasses because the lenses were so cloudy. I remember walking into a hip-looking clothing store with my husband one evening in the French Concession district in Shanghai in April 2004. The racks were filled with Giorgio Armani suits. At least, that's what the label read. We picked out a gray one with a price of $150. The fabric felt cheap. The lining was cheap. My husband tried it on. The jacket was crooked.
But now counterfeiters are getting so good that it's becoming difficult to tell whether an item is legit or not. They buy real handbags, wallets, and clothes, take them apart, scan the pieces on a computer, and send the images via e-mail to their factories in Asia. With watches, they study the real ones and copy them with cheaper materials. I went to a Swiss-watch expert in Hong Kong to buy a fake Rolex. We were approached by a shady guy on Nathan Road, just behind the Peninsula Hotel, and we asked him to take us to see the watches. We went down several dark alleys, into a tenement that would have been condemmed in the United States, and up a rattling elevator to the sixth floor. Our hustler knocked on the steel-reinforced door and uttered a code word through the peep hatch, and we were let in. It was a dingy single room filled with four very menacing men and shelves of fake Chanel 2.55 handbags and the newly released Chanel J12 ceramic chronograph watches. We said we wanted a Rolex. He showed us a steel Oyster Perpetual and told us it was $80. It looked real to me. After a bit of negotiation, we got it down to $40. When we left, my friend said the watch was an excellent copy and that it would take someone from Rolex to identify it as fake...]
* Buy luxury goods from either brand boutiques or mainstream dealers such as department stores and brand-approved Web sites. Items available at a flea market, from a street peddler, or via spam in your e-mail inbox are likely to be fake.
* Report counterfeit dealers to the Internationl AntiCounterfeiting Coalition: Call 866-NOTFAKE, or go to iacc.org - DT.
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Wow that was a great article. Really have to think about what you're buying and be careful. counterfeiters really no what they're doing now so everyone needs to watch out.
I think we do run the risk of helping them, as, just because they can buy a bag and take it apart to copy, it doesn't mean that they are, automatically, going to get every detail correct.
By pointing out flaws, we are effectively acting like quality controllers and giving them a consumer's eye view of their products; so I'm sure we are, unintentionally, helping them 'perfect' their fakes, unfortunately.
I think this is part of the reason why members used to try to not give too much information, about the potential differences between fake and authentic bags, in any one thread. I think it also might have been safer when each bag being authenticated had its own thread - so, at least the counterfeiters had to search through lots of different threads for their info.
By pointing out flaws, we are effectively acting like quality controllers and giving them a consumer's eye view of their products; so I'm sure we are, unintentionally, helping them 'perfect' their fakes, unfortunately.
I think this is part of the reason why members used to try to not give too much information, about the potential differences between fake and authentic bags, in any one thread. I think it also might have been safer when each bag being authenticated had its own thread - so, at least the counterfeiters had to search through lots of different threads for their info.