Why Do People Buy Fake Designer Bags Or Fake Designer Anything?

[Pimpernel]

High moral ground? Come ON, who are some people here kidding, pretending this is all relative to just a question of theoretical ethics? This is a CRIME, and treated as such in Europe.

Fake producers perpetrate tax fraud worth billions of dollars. Maybe non Europeans don't care because, surprise surprise, most premier designer brands are "just" European (Chanel, LV, BV, Etro, Chloe, Hermes, Goyard, Valentino, Prada, Dior, Balenciaga, Mulberry...), so hey, let European folks deal with the tax revenue fraud that the fake I buy, order and wear in the US, Asia, Australia or Canada is a direct cause of, cuz their laws don't concern me and I can't be made liable since I'm not even there (never mind the absurdity of directly damaging the brand one professes to admire and covet by "investing" in a crappy wannabe copy...)

As an European who works for Europol (amongst other international organizations which fight fraud in all its forms) I happen to know well the consequences of this huge fraud, and I care. A lot.

And as a member of a forum that is explicitly against fakes I am sick of fake defenders, enablers and actual shills. They're barking up the wrong tree here.

 

[Yixie]

High moral ground? Come ON, who are some people here kidding, pretending this is all relative to just a question of theoretical ethics? This is a CRIME, and treated as such in Europe.

Fake producers perpetrate tax fraud worth billions of dollars. Maybe non Europeans don't care because, surprise surprise, most premier designer brands are "just" European (Chanel, LV, BV, Etro, Chloe, Hermes, Goyard, Valentino, Prada, Dior, Balenciaga, Mulberry...), so hey, let European folks deal with the tax revenue fraud that the fake I buy, order and wear in the US, Asia, Australia or Canada is a direct cause of, cuz their laws don't concern me and I can't be made liable since I'm not even there (never mind the absurdity of directly damaging the brand one professes to admire and covet by "investing" in a crappy wannabe copy...)

As an European who works for Europol (amongst other international organizations which fight fraud in all its forms) I happen to know well the consequences of this huge fraud, and I care. A lot.

And as a member of a forum that is explicitly against fakes I am sick of fake defenders, enablers and actual shills. They're barking up the wrong tree here.

You said it yourself - the reason why Europeans are so deathly against fakes is because the luxury goods economy is one of their primary growth engines, their cash cows. They're freaking out because if anyone does anything to threaten that source of income, their economies will tank like a sunk ship.

It boils down to money in the end. In matters of laws regarding intellectual property and patents - it always boils down to money. If the luxury industry wasn't worth so much tax revenue to the EU governments, if economic loss from imitators non-existent, would the regulators criminalize anyone for copying?

So the main reason for penalizing sale and possesion of fakes isn't because they're sooo concerned about ethics.....it's because it threatens their livelihood. It threatens one of their main sources of money.

There is no morality in money.

I am in no way regarding condoning fakes - just pointing out several hypocrisies that many engage in when slamming those who use fakes by bringing in some (shaky) high moral ground as the reason to condemn/be disgusted by fakes.

It's so much simpler than that really.

A. It threatens the economies of countries primarily in the luxury business

B. It irrevocably cheapens the brand value of the authentic products, and consumers who own the real thing aren't exactly happy to see abundant fakes on their once exclusive acquisitions

C. The intent to deceive others with fake goods is distasteful, and like all instances of dishonest business dealing, should be shut down on that basis alone.

There are more critical things that are deadly if faked - like medicines and even food - that should be prioritized on basis of human welfare over a ladies' purse. But yes ITA, outright fakes of any product have no business existing.

However, let's not sit on our high horses and judge the average end consumer of fake bags as a disgusting, unethical human being (like I've read in many posts here)

You're no better morally just because you happen to have the high-end version. There are tons of more terrible, yet innocuous things that makes a person unethical. And let he who is without sin cast the first stone.

 

[Mariapia]

High moral ground? Come ON, who are some people here kidding, pretending this is all relative to just a question of theoretical ethics? This is a CRIME, and treated as such in Europe.

Fake producers perpetrate tax fraud worth billions of dollars. Maybe non Europeans don't care because, surprise surprise, most premier designer brands are "just" European (Chanel, LV, BV, Etro, Chloe, Hermes, Goyard, Valentino, Prada, Dior, Balenciaga, Mulberry...), so hey, let European folks deal with the tax revenue fraud that the fake I buy, order and wear in the US, Asia, Australia or Canada is a direct cause of, cuz their laws don't concern me and I can't be made liable since I'm not even there (never mind the absurdity of directly damaging the brand one professes to admire and covet by "investing" in a crappy wannabe copy...)

As an European who works for Europol (amongst other international organizations which fight fraud in all its forms) I happen to know well the consequences of this huge fraud, and I care. A lot.

And as a member of a forum that is explicitly against fakes I am sick of fake defenders, enablers and actual shills. They're barking up the wrong tree here.

Great post, Pimpernel ![emoji106][emoji106]

 

[remainsilly]

You said it yourself - the reason why Europeans are so deathly against fakes is because the luxury goods economy is one of their primary growth engines, their cash cows. They're freaking out because if anyone does anything to threaten that source of income, their economies will tank like a sunk ship.

It boils down to money in the end. In matters of laws regarding intellectual property and patents - it always boils down to money. If the luxury industry wasn't worth so much tax revenue to the EU governments, if economic loss from imitators non-existent, would the regulators criminalize anyone for copying?

So the main reason for penalizing sale and possesion of fakes isn't because they're sooo concerned about ethics.....it's because it threatens their livelihood. It threatens one of their main sources of money.

There is no morality in money.

I am in no way regarding condoning fakes - just pointing out several hypocrisies that many engage in when slamming those who use fakes by bringing in some (shaky) high moral ground as the reason to condemn/be disgusted by fakes.

It's so much simpler than that really.

A. It threatens the economies of countries primarily in the luxury business

B. It irrevocably cheapens the brand value of the authentic products, and consumers who own the real thing aren't exactly happy to see abundant fakes on their once exclusive acquisitions

C. The intent to deceive others with fake goods is distasteful, and like all instances of dishonest business dealing, should be shut down on that basis alone.

There are more critical things that are deadly if faked - like medicines and even food - that should be prioritized on basis of human welfare over a ladies' purse. But yes ITA, outright fakes of any product have no business existing.

However, let's not sit on our high horses and judge the average end consumer of fake bags as a disgusting, unethical human being (like I've read in many posts here)

You're no better morally just because you happen to have the high-end version. There are tons of more terrible, yet innocuous things that makes a person unethical. And let he who is without sin cast the first stone.

We all live in this world together.
And what we do in one place touches others--stones thrown into a pond, sending ripple effects.

There is no morality in a tool, agreed.
But how one uses that tool, that money, does involve beliefs & ethics.

Yes, a whole range of fakes & deceptions exist.
Luxury handbags is one.
And one we can bring awareness to here.
Discussing the evils of counterfeit medicines, on a purseforum, seems bit ridiculous. Yes?

 

[Yixie]

We all live in this world together.
And what we do in one place touches others--stones thrown into a pond, sending ripple effects.

There is no morality in a tool, agreed.
But how one uses that tool, that money, does involve beliefs & ethics.

Yes, a whole range of fakes & deceptions exist.
Luxury handbags is one.
And one we can bring awareness to here.
Discussing the evils of counterfeit medicines, on a purseforum, seems bit ridiculous. Yes?

I beg to differ. Dismissing the evils of counterfeit medicine on ANY forum is more immoral than ridiculous.

What kind of person would dismiss massive human suffering and death resulting from consumption of fake medication that was bought in good faith to save patient lives?

The thing is, it's not a big problem in the first world with strict regulatory protection - but it is one in many poorer nations. But because it's not part of our daily existence, wdgaf?

What kind of person would say "I'd rather live in a world where there's fake medicine, rather than fake bags" ? I hope that's not the implication of the quoted author.

True, this is the PF. And we discuss our love for purses. Authentication and whistleblowing fraudsters who sell fake products are one of the most valuable services we provide for each other. I'm thankful to have this invaluable resource to learn about luxury products so I'm an informed consumer.

But to put it in perspective, there are still incalculable numbers of far greater evils than fake bags. And I think some here have lost sight, or don't even care about that.

The way some folks talk about fake bags, you'd think the producers are a 21st century version of Hitler perpetuating racial genocide and the buyers nazi sympathizers

Fraud and dishonest behaviour is intrinsically bad, I'm not condoning it.

But to frame fake bags (their production and consumption) as some pinnacle of immorality when the issue is more about economics, money and the elitism of luxury than anything else is... 😳 😐

 

[misskris03]

I beg to differ. Dismissing the evils of counterfeit medicine on ANY forum is more immoral than ridiculous.

What kind of person would dismiss massive human suffering and death resulting from consumption of fake medication that was bought in good faith to save patient lives?

The thing is, it's not a big problem in the first world with strict regulatory protection - but it is one in many poorer nations. But because it's not part of our daily existence, wdgaf?

What kind of person would say "I'd rather live in a world where there's fake medicine, rather than fake bags" ? I hope that's not the implication of the quoted author.

True, this is the PF. And we discuss our love for purses. Authentication and whistleblowing fraudsters who sell fake products are one of the most valuable services we provide for each other. I'm thankful to have this invaluable resource to learn about luxury products so I'm an informed consumer.

But to put it in perspective, there are still incalculable numbers of far greater evils than fake bags. And I think some here have lost sight, or don't even care about that.

The way some folks talk about fake bags, you'd think the producers are a 21st century version of Hitler perpetuating racial genocide and the buyers nazi sympathizers

Fraud and dishonest behaviour is intrinsically bad, I'm not condoning it.

But to frame fake bags (their production and consumption) as some pinnacle of immorality when the issue is more about economics, money and the elitism of luxury than anything else is... [emoji15] [emoji52]

I don't believe remainsilly was in dismissing the harm done by counterfeit pharmaceuticals. I believe the point was that this topic is beyond the scope of this handbag forum.

 

[jellyv]

But to frame fake bags (their production and consumption) as some pinnacle of immorality when the issue is more about economics, money and the elitism of luxury than anything else is... [emoji15] [emoji52]

Nah--it's about staying on topic. As in the topic of the thread (see its title). To rail about other crimes is fine, but patently off topic here.

 

[rdgldy]

Ladies, can we please get back to topic. This is running off course.

 

[Yixie]

+1000!!

All those people decrying fakes for being made in deplorable conditions....well unless they buy all their clothes and lifestyle goods exclusively from artisan houses and craftsmen, or buy only Fair Trade products....that's being either rather hypocritical or quite willfully ignorant

Think that Target dress or Zara blouse didn't cause many other people suffering from depressed wages and pollution required to produce such cheap goods? It's a much wider scale of suffering producing legit goods than fakes - because there's so much more of it in our economy.

And don't wave the terrorist flag either ....the richest terrorist group, IS was largely funded by consumers buying gas. If you buy diamonds or other jewels direct from retail, you've probably helped to fund terrorist groups in Africa to create child soldiers and continue civil wars.

I do find it hard to believe the average person who highly values luxury goods and disdains fakes will be willing to forfeit diamonds/precious gems and well, go without gas (unless you go electric in everything and make sure your sources of power are solar/hydro) to be consistent in their principles to "not enable suffering and fund terrorism"

That's a high moral ground that likely gets quickly disassembled when examining the person's lifestyle choices.

Let's just keep to the very simple and visceral reasons why many of us disdain fakes - it spoils the brand image and cheapens the value of the authentic luxury products we own when they 1. are mostly inferior quality and carried around by everyone (no longer an aspirational ) and 2. dishonest

Nah--it's about staying on topic. As in the topic of the thread (see its title). To rail about other crimes is fine, but patently off topic here.

The last sentence of mine you quoted was in reference to those who were talking about fakes "funding terrorism and causing suffering" when that's really hiding behind a smokescreen.

But true, the morality of the counterfeit industry has nothing to do with why people actually buy fakes. So let's leave it at that.

I believe the 2nd post on this thread actually already adequately addressed the reasons for why people buy fakes - for mostly the same reasons we buy the real thing 😂

 

[dangerouscurves]

You said it yourself - the reason why Europeans are so deathly against fakes is because the luxury goods economy is one of their primary growth engines, their cash cows. They're freaking out because if anyone does anything to threaten that source of income, their economies will tank like a sunk ship.

It boils down to money in the end. In matters of laws regarding intellectual property and patents - it always boils down to money. If the luxury industry wasn't worth so much tax revenue to the EU governments, if economic loss from imitators non-existent, would the regulators criminalize anyone for copying?

So the main reason for penalizing sale and possesion of fakes isn't because they're sooo concerned about ethics.....it's because it threatens their livelihood. It threatens one of their main sources of money.

There is no morality in money.

I am in no way regarding condoning fakes - just pointing out several hypocrisies that many engage in when slamming those who use fakes by bringing in some (shaky) high moral ground as the reason to condemn/be disgusted by fakes.

It's so much simpler than that really.

A. It threatens the economies of countries primarily in the luxury business

B. It irrevocably cheapens the brand value of the authentic products, and consumers who own the real thing aren't exactly happy to see abundant fakes on their once exclusive acquisitions

C. The intent to deceive others with fake goods is distasteful, and like all instances of dishonest business dealing, should be shut down on that basis alone.

There are more critical things that are deadly if faked - like medicines and even food - that should be prioritized on basis of human welfare over a ladies' purse. But yes ITA, outright fakes of any product have no business existing.

However, let's not sit on our high horses and judge the average end consumer of fake bags as a disgusting, unethical human being (like I've read in many posts here)

You're no better morally just because you happen to have the high-end version. There are tons of more terrible, yet innocuous things that makes a person unethical. And let he who is without sin cast the first stone.

You said you're not condoning fakes but you sure seem like it from your posts.

 

[Yixie]

You said you're not condoning fakes but you sure seem like it from your posts.

Please point out which part(s) of what I wrote was expressed in favor of counterfeiters.

I was merely expressing a more macroeconomic view of the entire counterfeit industry and how it affects luxury businesses - because money, distasteful as the subject is, talks.

Like pimpernel of europol said, it costs the EU billions of dollars in lost tax revenue and that fraud is hurting their pockets.

But the mods have warned, we are going off topic by condoning or condemning fakes. The title of this thread is afterall about why people own fakes - not to express a value judgment about those who own them.

Perhaps we can set up a separate thread for that and continue the conversation there?

 

[ladysarah]

High moral ground? Come ON, who are some people here kidding, pretending this is all relative to just a question of theoretical ethics? This is a CRIME, and treated as such in Europe.

Fake producers perpetrate tax fraud worth billions of dollars. Maybe non Europeans don't care because, surprise surprise, most premier designer brands are "just" European (Chanel, LV, BV, Etro, Chloe, Hermes, Goyard, Valentino, Prada, Dior, Balenciaga, Mulberry...), so hey, let European folks deal with the tax revenue fraud that the fake I buy, order and wear in the US, Asia, Australia or Canada is a direct cause of, cuz their laws don't concern me and I can't be made liable since I'm not even there (never mind the absurdity of directly damaging the brand one professes to admire and covet by "investing" in a crappy wannabe copy...)

As an European who works for Europol (amongst other international organizations which fight fraud in all its forms) I happen to know well the consequences of this huge fraud, and I care. A lot.

And as a member of a forum that is explicitly against fakes I am sick of fake defenders, enablers and actual shills. They're barking up the wrong tree here.

excellent post and sums up,my sentiment exactly! I generally try to look closely into the provenance of ALL my purchases. Perhaps not everything I own was made in ideal circumstances, but I don't see that as an excuse to justify buying illegal goods, made by children, slave labour and God only knows what else. We Can all start by eliminating the very worst, the bottom of the barrel so to speak which is what counterfeits are!

 

[dangerouscurves]

Please point out which part(s) of what I wrote was expressed in favor of counterfeiters.

I was merely expressing a more macroeconomic view of the entire counterfeit industry and how it affects luxury businesses - because money, distasteful as the subject is, talks.

Like pimpernel of europol said, it costs the EU billions of dollars in lost tax revenue and that fraud is hurting their pockets.

But the mods have warned, we are going off topic by condoning or condemning fakes. The title of this thread is afterall about why people own fakes - not to express a value judgment about those who own them.

Perhaps we can set up a separate thread for that and continue the conversation there?

Your whole post points it out. You're calling people who are proud not to have any counterfeit bags as being on high horse.
I side eye everyone who carries fakes knowingly they're fake.

 

[Kitties Are Cute]

People buy fakes because they don't want or cannot spend the money on the real thing and want to give off a certain image. Same why we buy anything we wear, they just don't want/can't buy the real. It's not that complicated as to WHY...

 

[jellyv]

But the mods have warned, we are going off topic by condoning or condemning fakes. The title of this thread is afterall about why people own fakes - not to express a value judgment about those who own them.

?

You misunderstand the warning. It was about going off the topic of fake bags and fake other designer goods. Not medicines, etc.

And: TPF is explicitly an anti-fake bags and anti-fake designer goods site, so that question of condemning vs. praising such goods here at TPF is quite settled.