Maintaining an H relationship

[papertiger]

Please focus on the title of this thread rather than each other, TY

If you find it very hard to ignore certain people, please feel free in adding them to your 'Ignore' list.

For advice on how to obtain a B/K/C please go to the reading room in the Reading Room The Newbie's HOW DO I GET A BIRKIN (or other bag) Reading Room

For advice on how to shop at your local store please do a search in Hermes Shopping sub-forum and look for your store/region/country.

 

[Crapples]

I’ve a follow up question.. i’m seeing several people recently mentioning a 3x to 6x prespend - I don’t think I can justify that kind of spend to get a $10k bag 😣 Is the 1:1 ratio a thing of the past?

I’m at Madison. I was at 2.2:1 for my K25 last year.

 

[GabrielleS]

Eek ok this is good to know to level set my expectations 🙈 I see some lucky tiktokers talking abt not spending 1:1 and getting a kelly bc they looked the part etc. so I was sort of dreaming up a fantasy a bit 🥲
Ahh my purse strings are gna be groaning 😂😅

If budget is an issue, is it worth considering resale. I am too nervous to buy resale but lots of people do it successfully. Resale provides certainty of pricing, style, color and timing.

 

[momoc]

If I had a nickel every time someone misunderstands what freedom of speech is, I’d have…actually probably more than enough to buy a Birkin.

I do want to say that from reading through - perhaps a part of this whole debate is stemming from a difference in the reading of the original post by @880 as saying that you have to shop together with your spouse in order to be given good treatment by Hermes, which I think is of course 1) not true and also 2) not her intent (or at least not how I read it).

I think it’s saying that if you do it, you would be more likely to be preferred, which I think everyone here is agreeing, even in different words - if you shop with your spouse, whole family, etc, it means you are more likely shopping across a broader range of categories, more likely sticking with the brand for longer, and of course most importantly spending more $, which we all are agreeing is what a business would want. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with advising that if your spouse can also enjoy Hermes then both shop and show that to the store. However, there is absolutely nothing wrong with not doing that. I don’t! I’m the only one interested in Hermes (or any luxury shopping) in my family; DH does not care at all (helps that I’m the breadwinner in my family and I spend all my own money), and this not for the lack of trying on my part either I always shop at H alone, I don’t find it a problem and have enjoyed plenty bag offers.

 

[880]

thanks @momoc im not sure how my post could ever be construed as “you must shop with your spouse (or you must have a spouse) at H to get XYZ. Not to mention, of course there are as many ways to get to a desired outcome here as there are number of contributors to the thread.

The comment came about when an H manager was talking to DH. She said it was an ideal situation for them to see us shop together as a couple with one SA. In the context of their conversation, she was actually not referring to increased or doubled amount of spend. They were talking about a synergy of aesthetics and taste that goes with having a well versed third opinion of a partner who happens to have a good eye and really care about the issues of fit and quality of RTW. That synergy also benefits the SA.

@maxroxxherhandbags also mentioned this when she shops with her DH or when her clients shop with their spouses. But, it has its downsides. There have been times when I’ve loved something, only to try it on, and have both DH and my SA shake their heads even before they open their mouths. It actually happened at the resee. Both the head of retail and DH rejected my top pick of a safari jacket as soon as I tried it on bc the proportion is simply for a taller person. That wouldn’t have happened if the SM/SA wasn’t comfortable enough to voice an honest opinion. It isnt just about making the highest sale possible at that moment.

 

[textilegirl]

Funny, our house is a combination of @tinkerbell68's and @momoc's which is to say we shop alone and dine together, and have a really fun time at both. Much as I've tried, DH is not especially interested in things H except as they make me happy so there are no joint visits to the boutique (even with the promise of a lovely dinner afterwards!). Further, I actually prefer to shop alone as it allows me to focus, and establish a relationship with my SA. @880's comments really resonate here because although I'm not privileged to have many SAs, when those I have know what I've already purchased and remember what I've worn or described having, they can be so helpful in recommending for or against a particular item under consideration. DH is useless at this (seriously useless ). But we have a great time dining out, especially in our favorite spots. As I've said elsewhere, if it's not a party, why bother?

 

[MacawGuy]

Pro tip #1: don't believe these videos.

Best advice of the day - week - month, etc.

 

[BorntoRunandShop]

thanks @momoc im not sure how my post could ever be construed as “you must shop with your spouse (or you must have a spouse) at H to get XYZ. Not to mention, of course there are as many ways to get to a desired outcome here as there are number of contributors to the thread.

The comment came about when an H manager was talking to DH. She said it was an ideal situation for them to see us shop together as a couple with one SA. In the context of their conversation, she was actually not referring to increased or doubled amount of spend. They were talking about a synergy of aesthetics and taste that goes with having a well versed third opinion of a partner who happens to have a good eye and really care about the issues of fit and quality of RTW. That synergy also benefits the SA.

@maxroxxherhandbags also mentioned this when she shops with her DH or when her clients shop with their spouses. But, it has its downsides. There have been times when I’ve loved something, only to try it on, and have both DH and my SA shake their heads even before they open their mouths. It actually happened at the resee. Both the head of retail and DH rejected my top pick of a safari jacket as soon as I tried it on bc the proportion is simply for a taller person. That wouldn’t have happened if the SM/SA wasn’t comfortable enough to voice an honest opinion. It isnt just about making the highest sale possible at that moment.

Pretty spot on with my experience. DH wasn’t going to go with me to get my last quota bag and then I told him to come as my SA has mentioned to bring him. So last minute decision I did. It worked out. It was a good visit. And my SA gets to know and feel better about his selections because he has someone that will confirm his great choices for me.

 

[Veritybelle]

thanks @momoc im not sure how my post could ever be construed as “you must shop with your spouse (or you must have a spouse) at H to get XYZ. Not to mention, of course there are as many ways to get to a desired outcome here as there are number of contributors to the thread.

The comment came about when an H manager was talking to DH. She said it was an ideal situation for them to see us shop together as a couple with one SA. In the context of their conversation, she was actually not referring to increased or doubled amount of spend. They were talking about a synergy of aesthetics and taste that goes with having a well versed third opinion of a partner who happens to have a good eye and really care about the issues of fit and quality of RTW. That synergy also benefits the SA.

@maxroxxherhandbags also mentioned this when she shops with her DH or when her clients shop with their spouses. But, it has its downsides. There have been times when I’ve loved something, only to try it on, and have both DH and my SA shake their heads even before they open their mouths. It actually happened at the resee. Both the head of retail and DH rejected my top pick of a safari jacket as soon as I tried it on bc the proportion is simply for a taller person. That wouldn’t have happened if the SM/SA wasn’t comfortable enough to voice an honest opinion. It isnt just about making the highest sale possible at that moment.

I tend not to shop with DH (unless it’s a joint project like buying art or furniture). I think I’m the problem there though! I am sensitive to SAs paying less attention to me and deferring to him and that can get in the way of me building an independent relationship with them (my younger son rolls his eyes and says “Mum! Not everything is a feminist issue!” ). Plus, although my boys are teenagers now, I associate shopping with family as being an activity that has a time limit - and thus time pressure - because of their impatience and energy when they were little boys. Just having the family with me imposes a subtle pressure to curtail that I find unhelpful! So I shop on my own. I can concentrate better that way. I like to have other opinions on items I’m considering but I also don’t want to be too easily swayed by them.

My H SA knows that I love heritage leathers, chèvre and vintage, and that is an important aspect of our relationship. We enjoy talking about the different bags I carry, leathers, discontinued colours etc. I can’t be sure but I think that puts me in a smaller group of “interested” clients when heritage leathers come into the store. I offer this as just another data point about the value of building a “real” relationship with SAs. Of course spend will always be important in what is a commercial transaction, but it’s not the only thing.

 

[storytotell]

If you’re extremely lucky and likable you MIGHT be able to succeed with 1-1.5 for the first bag but after that I’m guessing the SA would milk you for bag number two to make up for it.

What would you count as SA "miking" you? I am seeing so broad ranges reported here and there when it comes to pre-spend, so it is getting so hard to determine reasonable expectations.

 

[QuelleFromage]

I would hope that all readers of the public threads not take any post as gospel truth, but merely as a narration of OP’s conversations and experiences with Hermes SMs and SAs.

📣 If folks could understand this, it would be much easier to navigate H relationships.
We all have our experiences. We sometimes try to share them here in order to be helpful (no good deed goes unpunished ).
No individual experience is replicable.

I think people hang on every word as if there is a guide, which is probably why influencers actually sell guides to H shopping! The thread title here says it all...it is a relationship (albeit transactional, with a sales team)...all relationships are different.

I think there is a very French way of shopping, which means having a relationship with the store/vendor/boutique. Typically French people do that anyway with everyday items, like buying bread, wine, cheese etc. They will often visit smaller shops, get to know the vendors and eventually they will get 'offered' first dips on limited supply wine, cheese or a new patisserie. Its a very French way of shopping. French women usually prefer to buy from their local boutique rather than primark. They often value the experience of interacting with knowledgeable SA's, discussing the origin and quality of the products, and generally enjoying the social aspect of shopping. it is a cultural thing, Hermes did not invent the system.

This is true and is core to understanding the philosophy.

I’ve a follow up question.. i’m seeing several people recently mentioning a 3x to 6x prespend - I don’t think I can justify that kind of spend to get a $10k bag 😣 Is the 1:1 ratio a thing of the past?

3x to 6x is really high even at Madison and BH (I shop at both). Don't be discouraged. There are also other ways to become a valued customer other than spending like a drunken sailor with a trust fund (like: loving the maison, being nice and polite, having good taste, etc.). (ETA: 3x is not insane if you are after a mini Kelly or a pink B25 or whatever today's flavor is. But it's also not a rule.)

This is all very true but the commission systems for Hermes that operate outside of France do change the shopping dynamic IMHO.

French SAs get rewarded when their clients buy and are pretty attached to loyalty and spend across metiers, just sayin' 🤷‍♂️

Eek ok this is good to know to level set my expectations 🙈 I see some lucky tiktokers talking abt not spending 1:1 and getting a kelly bc they looked the part etc. so I was sort of dreaming up a fantasy a bit 🥲
Ahh my purse strings are gna be groaning 😂😅

Somehow I feel that saying "I used Mommy's credit card and bought a bunch of homeware, baby gifts, and blankets and then begged for months" isn't as sexy on social media as claiming "OMG! I went to Hermès to begin my H journey and I was SO CHARMING and SO WELL-DRESSED that they tried to GIVE me a Mini Kelly". Most of it is total horse hockey.

 

[Veritybelle]

spending like a drunken sailor with a trust fund

Somehow I feel that saying "I used Mommy's credit card and bought a bunch of homeware, baby gifts, and blankets and then begged for months" isn't as sexy on social media as claiming "OMG! I went to Hermès to begin my H journey and I was SO CHARMING and SO WELL-DRESSED that they tried to GIVE me a Mini Kelly". Most of it is total horse hockey.

Hilarious!

 

[acrowcounted]

What would you count as SA "miking" you? I am seeing so broad ranges reported here and there when it comes to pre-spend, so it is getting so hard to determine reasonable expectations.

I really just meant that the second bag would likely be much more difficult than the first. If forced to speak in numerical terms, I would expect the typical prespend to at least be averaged over the two bags. So, for example, if the first bag was offered at 1:1 spend and the going typical rate is 2.5:1, then the second bag would probably be held back until 3.5-4x is reached. Again, none of this is written in stone.

Everything I put out is meant to be used as a guide for expectations. We tend to get a lot of newer shoppers on this thread who are very upset and ready to go to the manager because their SA still hasn't offered them a mini Kelly and then when we dig a bit we find out that they started shopping last month and have only bought a pair of Orans and a clic bracelet. In my opinion, 3x is around the point currently where it is justified to be upset about not getting a bag offer of some kind in some semblance to one's actual desired bag (ie if you're clamoring for a mini Kelly and getting offers for neutral K25s, I would still count that as a valid offer, but getting offers for a B35 at that point, not so much). There are plenty of examples where people are waiting beyond 5x for something extremely specific or coveted but typically they are offered other items in the meantime. If one is getting no offers at that point, its reasonable to come here with specifics for advice on what went wrong/what to do next.

 

[storytotell]

I really just meant that the second bag would likely be much more difficult than the first. If forced to speak in numerical terms, I would expect the typical prespend to at least be averaged over the two bags. So, for example, if the first bag was offered at 1:1 spend and the going typical rate is 2.5:1, then the second bag would probably be held back until 3.5-4x is reached. Again, none of this is written in stone.

Everything I put out is meant to be used as a guide for expectations.

Thanks for sharing. My question solely aimed to help with the expectation setting. I've been reading this forum for the last year and definitely got valuable insights that cleared a lot of confusion. Those who are yet to be offered their first bag (me included) tend to overthink and look for "clues" from their SA indicating when an offer can potentially surface. Then we are reading stories here about SA actively offering blankets/watches/whatever, thence this made me think about how milking can be defined.

 

[momoc]

+1 on the point for “specific and coveted” offers. I feel like being very specific in your wishlist is an under-emphasized factor for what makes the spend ratio go up - I know someone who just ended up at an insane ratio for a bag as she wanted one specific bag (only one style, color, leather, hardware for a size 25). She has a long and prolific relationship with the store (bags, SOs). It’s also not the most common color and she didn’t want any other shades in the same color family nor other super popular specs except the one she was asking for. I doubt this is the only story of this type out there.

Because of stories like this, I would say that if you are able to broaden your wishlist, it’s a good idea as long as they are indeed bags you would gladly take. If you do have a very set, very narrow wishlist (completely understandable, at this price point you should absolutely get the perfect bag for you), it really may just require a lot of patience. IMO it may be better to slow down and don’t try to “force” it, we joke about buying sofas but even sofas won’t make a bag that truly isn’t there appear instantly (and SAs definitely can smell desperation). Also, after spending enough, while waiting it’s easy to end up buying even more: new things / collections come in; may still want to go and check in with the SA and buy a bit of things here and there, etc.

@storytotell SAs are absolutely going to suggest items like jewelry, RTW, watches…at the end of the day they are trying to do their job which is to sell those things. It is true that sometimes they may be suggesting because they think the client needs a little bit more spending to compete for a bag, or maybe it’s a department that they have some sales targets for that month, or maybe they just genuinely think it fits with your style. But no matter the reason, if what they are suggesting isn’t to your taste, just kindly decline and let them know you aren’t interested. They will understand.

 

[Mrs.Hermess]

At the trunk show (re -see) and cocktail off site yesterday, I had the opportunity to talk to the women’s RTW manager; a manager of a different location (my friend introduced me); and some SAs of friends who couldn’t make it. The women’s manager introduced DH to the men’s one. (Not sure why the men’s one was at this event, but they ended up talking for a while about a bunch of different things.
The topic of lifestyle clients came up in DHs conversation. Apparently it’s pretty common to have a client shop a variety of metiers. But it’s not just whether someone buys a big ticket item. It’s also about the potential for future spend. What seems obvious now, in retrospect, is that the ideal scenario from a premier big brand’s point of view is to get two spouses to shop a variety of metiers together with their SA. As it turns out, we actually do this with our SAs at various brands which helps the relationships. (Though DH tends to get along better with the SAs than I do lol). It’s easier for them bc if I strike out and don’t find anything, there is always the possibility that DH will be lucky. Meanwhile, we benefit from the collective good taste from the SA and spouse. In our shopping, we don’t plan that much, and serendipity plays a major role

💯 when I shop w my DH (and I kinda prefer to do my shopping alone) it’s always fun. My SA is very lovely and pleasant and we usually find items for him much easier than me). My SA really enjoys that we have converted my DH to an H fan. He now recognizes H and appreciates the quality. I find that SA’s curation of my DH pieces is masterfully done and she recalls what I have purchased for him and suggests across seasons pieces to enhance his rtw. It’s really an art form.