Funny fake!

[Chihua5]

Currently this bag is listed on eBay. Do you guys think this bag is a fake? It looks kind of odd.

I just had to comment that the hardware looks off, it's not suppose to be shiny gunmetal and I don't see the copper/pinkish rivets or the darker rivets in the flower's center. Hope someone does see this in the authentic thread.

 

[Hyacinth]

Currently this bag is listed on eBay. Do you guys think this bag is a fake? It looks kind of odd.

Please post at the Authenticate This Coach thread under Coach shopping and supply the auction link and the other needed information listed in Post One of that thread. Unless it's an obvious fake, nothing can be authenticated with only one photo.

I just had to comment that the hardware looks off, it's not suppose to be shiny gunmetal and I don't see the copper/pinkish rivets or the darker rivets in the flower's center. Hope someone does see this in the authentic thread.

"Someone in the Authenticate thread" DID see it - that's why I already answered in Post 14.

There's a reason we want this kind of question in the correct thread. Besides "posting in the proper thread" being part of the forum's Rules, we want the necessary information that's requested in the first post of the h Authenticate This Coach thread located in the Coach Shopping forum so we can actually IDENTIFY and authenticate the thing! Right now there's only ONE photo, NO creed photos or interior tags photos, and no Coach style number and no Ebay listing info or URL - how are we supposed to find it?. That's not enough information. And even if it's obvious to a blind person that it's fake, how are we supposed to report it with no listing information???? Sure, we could spend 15 or 20 minutes trying to search for the listing assuming we even know the style name, but we shouldn't have to. That's why there's a specific list of what information we need to see as part of that first Authenticate thread post.

If someone's really concerned about authenticity, please take the time to provide the correct information and in the correct place to get an accurate answer and allow us to take steps to get it removed if it does turn out to be fake.

 

[LL777]

"Someone in the Authenticate thread" DID see it - that's why I already answered in Post 14.

There's a reason we want this kind of question in the correct thread. Besides "posting in the proper thread" being part of the forum's Rules, we want the necessary information that's requested in the first post of the h Authenticate This Coach thread located in the Coach Shopping forum so we can actually IDENTIFY and authenticate the thing! Right now there's only ONE photo, NO creed photos or interior tags photos, and no Coach style number and no Ebay listing info or URL - how are we supposed to find it?. That's not enough information. And even if it's obvious to a blind person that it's fake, how are we supposed to report it with no listing information???? Sure, we could spend 15 or 20 minutes trying to search for the listing assuming we even know the style name, but we shouldn't have to. That's why there's a specific list of what information we need to see as part of that first Authenticate thread post.

If someone's really concerned about authenticity, please take the time to provide the correct information and in the correct place to get an accurate answer and allow us to take steps to get it removed if it does turn out to be fake.

I posted the listing number and link in the Authenticate This Coach thread (post 24150)

 

[Hyacinth]

I just had to comment that the hardware looks off, it's not suppose to be shiny gunmetal and I don't see the copper/pinkish rivets or the darker rivets in the flower's center. Hope someone does see this in the authentic thread.

Are you using an actual bag bought directly from Coach for comparison? Because the 58840 website photo and color and trim description doesn't match any of the ones on Ebay so it's not much help. Although Coach.com shows the metal as Brass, none of the black ones on Ebay have brass hardware, they're all Gunmetal. And I don't see any coppery color rivets in the flowers of the Ebay listings either. So did Coach change those details during production, or did they post the wrong info in the description? Or are the ones on Ebay all fake?

There are literally thousands of posts just in the Rogue Club thread when I search for "Rogue tea rose black" and even more posts in other threads. I don't have the time or the patience to look through 250 pages of posts hoping to find photos of the style so unless we can get some solid information and photos or links to photos of actual 58840s in that leather and color and bought from Coach or one of their partners there's no way to know what's right or wrong about the bag in the post.

 

[AstridRhapsody]

Are you using an actual bag bought directly from Coach for comparison? Because the 58840 website photo and color and trim description doesn't match any of the ones on Ebay so it's not much help. Although Coach.com shows the metal as Brass, none of the black ones on Ebay have brass hardware, they're all Gunmetal. And I don't see any coppery color rivets in the flowers of the Ebay listings either. So did Coach change those details during production, or did they post the wrong info in the description? Or are the ones on Ebay all fake?

There are literally thousands of posts just in the Rogue Club thread when I search for "Rogue tea rose black" and even more posts in other threads. I don't have the time or the patience to look through 250 pages of posts hoping to find photos of the style so unless we can get some solid information and photos or links to photos of actual 58840s in that leather and color and bought from Coach or one of their partners there's no way to know what's right or wrong about the bag in the post.

I own this bag, bought from it from Saks plus I bought 1 directly from coach as a present for my sister. The ebay version looks odd. Coach does not show hardware as brass, that is a different bag. Hardware is black copper, and a lot of the rivets should be a glittery copper color, not silver as they appear in the ebay listing. The keyhood should also be pebbled leather, not smooth like most other newer rogues (1st generation not included). I am definitely not an authenticator but to me, either the ebay bag is fake or the pics are just horrible quality distorting the fine details. If anyone is considering buying this bag they need better quality pics with more detail.

 

[Chihua5]

Are you using an actual bag bought directly from Coach for comparison? Because the 58840 website photo and color and trim description doesn't match any of the ones on Ebay so it's not much help. Although Coach.com shows the metal as Brass, none of the black ones on Ebay have brass hardware, they're all Gunmetal. And I don't see any coppery color rivets in the flowers of the Ebay listings either. So did Coach change those details during production, or did they post the wrong info in the description? Or are the ones on Ebay all fake?

There are literally thousands of posts just in the Rogue Club thread when I search for "Rogue tea rose black" and even more posts in other threads. I don't have the time or the patience to look through 250 pages of posts hoping to find photos of the style so unless we can get some solid information and photos or links to photos of actual 58840s in that leather and color and bought from Coach or one of their partners there's no way to know what's right or wrong about the bag in the post.

I do not have eBay so I wouldn't be able to see this listing. I do not have this bag, only the clutch which is the same pattern (flowers and hardware) My observation also is based on my experience looking at this bag in person, in detail, many times as it was one I really wanted to buy. The pinkish/copperish rivets on some of the flowers were ones that I always zeroed in as it makes the bag pop. That all being said, I was just commenting that the bag looked strange too and since I don't have eBay, hoping someone did look into it further-I never commented it was fake or real, just that it looked strange too. I'm sorry if this upset the balance of the proper channels.

 

[Hyacinth]

I do not have eBay so I wouldn't be able to see this listing. I do not have this bag, only the clutch which is the same pattern (flowers and hardware) My observation also is based on my experience looking at this bag in person, in detail, many times as it was one I really wanted to buy. The pinkish/copperish rivets on some of the flowers were ones that I always zeroed in as it makes the bag pop. That all being said, I was just commenting that the bag looked strange too and since I don't have eBay, hoping someone did look into it further-I never commented it was fake or real, just that it looked strange too. I'm sorry if this upset the balance of the proper channels.

Do these 25's have an actual serial number stamped on the creed patch? Or just the small white tag in the pocket? I', wondering if the black ones with pastel pink flowers and gunmetal hardware are misidentified with the wrong style number.

There are 2 very similar bags on Coach.com, the current style 58840 that is shown as having all darker color flowers with copper-colored rivets and with brass hardware,
http://www.coach.com/coach-rogue-25-in-glovetanned-pebble-leather-with-tea-rose/58840.html

and style 87065 which is shown as SOLD OUT and has exactly the same colors, gunmetal hardware, and silver flower rivets as the bags in the original Funny Fakes post and the ones on Ebay.
http://www.coach.com/coach-rogue-25-with-tea-rose-applique/87065.html

Several bags listed on Ebay as #58840 seem to actually be style 87065. Do we have 2 almost identical Rogues except for trim details and style numbers and some people are confusing one for the other because they may not know where to find the style number inside the bag? I know I'M confused! Classic and vintage bags are much simpler to authenticate.



Getting back to the bag in the original post, I can see some small differences in flower placement (don't know whether or not that's normal) and depth of some of the flowers and possibly in the metal colors of the flower rivets, but it's always possible that's due to lighting. Based only on those small details I might not recommend buying it but I'm not comfortable enough with those small differences to call it fake. And we'd still want to see photos of the creed patch and all of the inside tags, the "Made in ..," and the small white one with the production codes if there is one.

 

[AstridRhapsody]

The pink/black tea rose rogue is stamped #87065. It has black copper hardware and the rivets are various brushed nickel, black copper, and a glittery resin like copper. Some rivets are shaped as big studs and spikes which the other style does not have. The other style number is old brass hardware with old brass, black glitter, and burgundy glitter rivets.

 

[BeenBurned]

Getting back to the bag in the original post, I can see some small differences in flower placement (don't know whether or not that's normal) and depth of some of the flowers and possibly in the metal colors of the flower rivets, but it's always possible that's due to lighting. Based only on those small details I might not recommend buying it but I'm not comfortable enough with those small differences to call it fake. And we'd still want to see photos of the creed patch and all of the inside tags, the "Made in ..," and the small white one with the production codes if there is one.

https://forum.purseblog.com/threads/answers-to-authenticity-questions.94198/page-107#post-31229197
And the quote of the above post:

Do you have a picture of the spelling error you saw? Without a picture, it's impossible to answer your question.

Coach rarely makes spelling errors on creeds but it does happen. A few pages back, post #1583 Feb 10, 2017 shows several examples of a legitimate Coach spelling error. But again, that type of mistake is extremely rare.
https://forum.purseblog.com/threads/answers-to-authenticity-questions.94198/page-106#post-31059041

As for going into a Coach store to compare, comps aren't always definitive. Sometimes it can take expert eyes and a lot of experience in recognizing differences when the fakes are very close.

As an example of how difficult it is to compare unless you know what you're looking for is shown in my post below. Look carefully at the pictures showing examples.
https://forum.purseblog.com/threads/authenticate-this-coach.889527/page-1419#post-31206137

EDITED TO ADD THE FOLLOWING:
Are you referring to the bag discussed starting with this post?
https://forum.purseblog.com/threads/answers-to-authenticity-questions.94198/page-106#post-31209466
and here:
https://forum.purseblog.com/threads/authenticate-this-coach.889527/page-1421#post-31210405

If you saw the bag at a Coach store with the same mistake being discussed, it could very well be a legitimate mistake.

But unless we have actually seen pictures and know that the bag was seen and/or purchased from a Coach store, there isn't (yet) enough evidence to know whether the bag posted by Cytheria was authentic or not.

Until new evidence is presented to prove authenticity, we can't deem it authentic although it's not necessarily fake either.

Couple what Hyacinth said with the post above showing the possibility of what might be a legitimate spelling error on some creeds combined with Coach's inconsistency with creeds, no creeds, serial numbers, no serial numbers, etc. and the quality of some of the KNOWN fakes of some newer Swaggers, Dinky bags, Rogues and others, as the authenticator who does much of the authenticating on newer styles, I personally am very reluctant to authenticate them.

I don't want to make a mistake that could cost a buyer a lot of money nor do I want to cost a seller her reputation.

The time involved in authenticating some of these styles can take an hour per bag!

 

[Chihua5]

Do these 25's have an actual serial number stamped on the creed patch? Or just the small white tag in the pocket? I', wondering if the black ones with pastel pink flowers and gunmetal hardware are misidentified with the wrong style number.

There are 2 very similar bags on Coach.com, the current style 58840 that is shown as having all darker color flowers with copper-colored rivets and with brass hardware,
http://www.coach.com/coach-rogue-25-in-glovetanned-pebble-leather-with-tea-rose/58840.html

and style 87065 which is shown as SOLD OUT and has exactly the same colors, gunmetal hardware, and silver flower rivets as the bags in the original Funny Fakes post and the ones on Ebay.
http://www.coach.com/coach-rogue-25-with-tea-rose-applique/87065.html

Several bags listed on Ebay as #58840 seem to actually be style 87065. Do we have 2 almost identical Rogues except for trim details and style numbers and some people are confusing one for the other because they may not know where to find the style number inside the bag? I know I'M confused! Classic and vintage bags are much simpler to authenticate.

View attachment 3787775 View attachment 3787777

Getting back to the bag in the original post, I can see some small differences in flower placement (don't know whether or not that's normal) and depth of some of the flowers and possibly in the metal colors of the flower rivets, but it's always possible that's due to lighting. Based only on those small details I might not recommend buying it but I'm not comfortable enough with those small differences to call it fake. And we'd still want to see photos of the creed patch and all of the inside tags, the "Made in ..," and the small white one with the production codes if there is one.

I do not envy your job as an authenticator! With each tea flower supposedly handpainted, this can definitely make your job harder.

These two Rogue 25 are actually two different color styles. The first one #58840 is the dark burgundy flower with burgundy suede side interiors. No pink anywhere. The rivets are also more purple and black glitter with brass hardware. This one came out first and I believe is still available.

The other Rogue #87065 is the pink flower pattern with the pink suede interiors. It has the pale to bright pink flowers. The rivets range from the light pinkish copper to silver and dark black. This has the dark gunmetal (not shiny) hardware. This one came out in spring. It was featured in the recent sale which sold out and I'm not sure if they will make more in this color pattern.

Hopefully people will provide you (on the proper thread) more details and pictures of the creed patch.

I hope this helps a little and I don't muddle things further.

 

[Hyacinth]

I do not envy your job as an authenticator! With each tea flower supposedly handpainted, this can definitely make your job harder.

These two Rogue 25 are actually two different color styles. The first one #58840 is the dark burgundy flower with burgundy suede side interiors. No pink anywhere. The rivets are also more purple and black glitter with brass hardware. This one came out first and I believe is still available.

The other Rogue #87065 is the pink flower pattern with the pink suede interiors. It has the pale to bright pink flowers. The rivets range from the light pinkish copper to silver and dark black. This has the dark gunmetal (not shiny) hardware. This one came out in spring. It was featured in the recent sale which sold out and I'm not sure if they will make more in this color pattern.

Hopefully people will provide you (on the proper thread) more details and pictures of the creed patch.

I hope this helps a little and I don't muddle things further.

Even the creed patches probably won't be any help. There was one listing on Ebay for what's actually an 87065 but listed by the seller as a 58840 that showed the creed and it had one of those bogus made-up serial numbers that Coach was sticking in some Rogues and Dinkys and maybe a few other mostly 1941 styles for a while. (Bad enough they eliminated the USEFUL serial numbers that included the production codes, but then to replace that in some bags with a totally meaningless number that doesn't even include the actual style number is such a stupid STUPID move that I STILL get PO'd when I see one of them!)
"No RG-20315" - WTH is THAT supposed to signify???
http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Coach-Rogue-25-Tea-Rose-Applique-Leather-Handbag-58840-MSRP-895-/232421344562?hash=item361d644532:g:7uEAAOSwbtVZQxuQ&nma=true&si=rX8b1wWwq5TVxEdBl4%2FXIomrY60%3D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

Not to throw shade on Ebay sellers, but from what BeenBurned has posted on those frequently-faked styles, the only way I would ever buy one would be directly through Coach. There are just too many details that can't be authenticated effectively. And Coach's dumb-arsed decisions over the last few years about creeds and serial numbers haven't helped matters.

 

[Jlfordham]

I do not envy your job as an authenticator! With each tea flower supposedly handpainted, this can definitely make your job harder.

These two Rogue 25 are actually two different color styles. The first one #58840 is the dark burgundy flower with burgundy suede side interiors. No pink anywhere. The rivets are also more purple and black glitter with brass hardware. This one came out first and I believe is still available.

The other Rogue #87065 is the pink flower pattern with the pink suede interiors. It has the pale to bright pink flowers. The rivets range from the light pinkish copper to silver and dark black. This has the dark gunmetal (not shiny) hardware. This one came out in spring. It was featured in the recent sale which sold out and I'm not sure if they will make more in this color pattern.

Hopefully people will provide you (on the proper thread) more details and pictures of the creed patch.

I hope this helps a little and I don't muddle things further.

 

[Jlfordham]

Item:

NWT COACH 1941 ROGUE 25 TEA ROSE APPLIQUÉ LEATHER SATCHEL

Listing number: 392212856700
Seller: mercedesb60
Link: https://www.ebay.com/itm/NWT-COACH-...e=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649
Comments: It is style # 87065 made in spring with black and pink flowers.
The style number from Price tag matches style number on creed. My only concern was one of the flowers was creased.

Please authenticate.

 

[vivianyan]

Currently this bag is listed on eBay. Do you guys think this bag is a fake? It looks kind of odd.

I know some Chinese resaler (in China) sell fake tea rose bags. They have this same style, and the fake looks exactly like exactly the one in this picture (shorter key fob hang belt is one signature to spot them) So it’s a fake for sure.

 

[vivianyan]

Item:

NWT COACH 1941 ROGUE 25 TEA ROSE APPLIQUÉ LEATHER SATCHEL

Listing number: 392212856700
Seller: mercedesb60
Link: https://www.ebay.com/itm/NWT-COACH-1941-ROGUE-25-TEA-ROSE-APPLIQUÉ-LEATHER-SATCHEL-MSRP-895/392212856700?ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649
Comments: It is style # 87065 made in spring with black and pink flowers.
The style number from Price tag matches style number on creed. My only concern was one of the flowers was creased.

Please authenticate.

This one looks authentic. I don’t have Authenticator in my title, but I am very firmiliar with this bag.