Check out the ACA diamonds at Whiteflash, they are the H&A ideal cut without the brand name, still come with all the requisite certifications.
Please help- HoF or GIA
- Thread starter phoebe_0526
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Total Depth Percentage 62.3%
Table Percentage 55%
Crown Angle 34.5
Crown Height Percentage 15%
Pavilion Angle 41
Pavillion Depth Percentage 43.5%
Star Facet Length Percentage 50%
Lower Girdle Facet Percentage 75%
Girdle Thickness Medium to Slightly Thick
Girdle Thickness Percentage 4
Culet Size None
Polish r Excellent
Symmetry Excellent
Fluorescence none
Here's what I see on GIA. is it a good one? HOF SA told me that every HOF diamond cut from AGS 0 standard if not better. The do not provide AGS report for diamond under 1 ct. though.
What should I do.
Thanks again.
Table Percentage 55%
Crown Angle 34.5
Crown Height Percentage 15%
Pavilion Angle 41
Pavillion Depth Percentage 43.5%
Star Facet Length Percentage 50%
Lower Girdle Facet Percentage 75%
Girdle Thickness Medium to Slightly Thick
Girdle Thickness Percentage 4
Culet Size None
Polish r Excellent
Symmetry Excellent
Fluorescence none
Here's what I see on GIA. is it a good one? HOF SA told me that every HOF diamond cut from AGS 0 standard if not better. The do not provide AGS report for diamond under 1 ct. though.
What should I do.
Thanks again.
Just want to do a quick updates with what I end up getting.
We have decide to get Hearts on Fire. We know this would cost a lot more than a certificate diamond. but he knows that I love HOF.
Just want to thank you all again being so helpful and teach me a lot.
Thank you girls. Love ya.
We have decide to get Hearts on Fire. We know this would cost a lot more than a certificate diamond. but he knows that I love HOF.
Just want to thank you all again being so helpful and teach me a lot.
Thank you girls. Love ya.
As a diamond manufacturer and wholesaler, I can tell you for a fact that HoF is a brand, like Tiffany's. Do you think that the silver in a Tiffany's bracelet is worth $300? at $12.25 an ounce (which is what it is today), thats almost a pound and a half worth of silver, which is DEFINATELY, not how much silver is in the bracelet. I sell a lot of Triple EX, or Triple Ideal cut stones, which sparkle way more than a HoF.
FYI, Super Ideal is a ploy. Its like saying "More Perfect Than Perfect".
HOF Certs are fast becoming popular but GIA is still considered the worlds Fairest Grading System. AGS is considered ALMOST neck and Neck with GIA. But I do for example carry a 7.25 carat diamond that got a K VVS1 from AGS and an L VVS1 from GIA. 90 percent of my business is GIA Triple EX, which is the Same as Ideal.
GIA Uses Triple EX.
AGS, EGL, and HOF USE Triple Ideal.
It's all in the measurements. Also, What are considered today's Ideal Measurements may not be tomorrow's Ideal measurements. Today 60/60 is considered Ideal. About 50 years ago, its was 62/57.
Hearts on Fire sends the retailer special lights and sometimes a special case just for their diamonds. If you want to truly compare diamonds, you need to take them outside on a sunny day. Then you tell me which is nicer.
As a diamond wholesaler, the only thing i would buy for myself is GIA Triple EX or AGS Triple 0 (which is Triple Ideal). No HOF or Tiffany's.
$5,000 for a .38 diamond? WOW!
I have a 1.09 G, SI1 GIA, Triple EX that I can sell you for that price.
FYI, Super Ideal is a ploy. Its like saying "More Perfect Than Perfect".
HOF Certs are fast becoming popular but GIA is still considered the worlds Fairest Grading System. AGS is considered ALMOST neck and Neck with GIA. But I do for example carry a 7.25 carat diamond that got a K VVS1 from AGS and an L VVS1 from GIA. 90 percent of my business is GIA Triple EX, which is the Same as Ideal.
GIA Uses Triple EX.
AGS, EGL, and HOF USE Triple Ideal.
It's all in the measurements. Also, What are considered today's Ideal Measurements may not be tomorrow's Ideal measurements. Today 60/60 is considered Ideal. About 50 years ago, its was 62/57.
Hearts on Fire sends the retailer special lights and sometimes a special case just for their diamonds. If you want to truly compare diamonds, you need to take them outside on a sunny day. Then you tell me which is nicer.
As a diamond wholesaler, the only thing i would buy for myself is GIA Triple EX or AGS Triple 0 (which is Triple Ideal). No HOF or Tiffany's.
$5,000 for a .38 diamond? WOW!
I have a 1.09 G, SI1 GIA, Triple EX that I can sell you for that price.
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I used the Holloway Cut Adviser to evaluate the GIA diamond:
Light return: Excellent
Fire: Very good
Scintillation: Very good
Spread: Very good
Total visual performance: 1.9
Anything below 2.0 is a stone that is worth considering; however, this one does not meet the criteria for AGS 0 grading.
I see you have decided to go with the HOF in a halo setting. I'm sure it will be beautiful. Please come back with pics
Light return: Excellent
Fire: Very good
Scintillation: Very good
Spread: Very good
Total visual performance: 1.9
Anything below 2.0 is a stone that is worth considering; however, this one does not meet the criteria for AGS 0 grading.
I see you have decided to go with the HOF in a halo setting. I'm sure it will be beautiful. Please come back with pics
Rising Sun,
Super Ideal is a term made up by the industry. believe me when i tell you that I've been immersed in the industry since birth. My whole family, direct and extended, deals with diamonds from the mine all the way to the hands of the consumer. Funny you mention "super ideal" because I just came back from a jewelry convention and when i went out to dinner with some dealer friends from new york and some prestigious retailers from LA, one of them actually told a story about a client requesting super ideal and how he explained to her how super ideal is a term coined by the promotional goods companies. Believe whomever you want. I speak the truth.
Some HOF stones are AGS certed, but AGS will inscribe anything you want on the side of the diamond. I can take a round diamond and have AGS inscribe "Princess Cut" on it if I wanted to, my friend actually got his wife's name inscribed on the stone.
I stand corrected on the cuts. I was reciting from memory at the time.
AGS ideal is about 61-62/56-57. 0 is the grade assigned, however we in the industry still use the proportions instead of just saying 0. If I were to tell a retailer that the particular stone was AGS triple zero, it means nothing to him. He wants numbers.
The Prices of EGL is reflected by the often higher color and clarity that a diamond receives after being certed by EGL. For example, if I got an H SI1 GIA, I would probably get a F VS2 EGL-US, and a E VS1 EGL-International. EGL still uses the term Ideal. GIA making the terms Triple EX were in response to AGS and EGL adopting the terms Ideal, bet you didn't know that! Also, AGS (within the last month) JUST released a new cert type, which you should be seeing pretty soon.
What i meant by the fact that I would not buy HOF is from a personal stand point. I can call one of my clients and pick up any HOF at cost for my wife, gf, etc.... Even if HOF contacted my about distributing their goods I would not want to.
Super Ideal is a term made up by the industry. believe me when i tell you that I've been immersed in the industry since birth. My whole family, direct and extended, deals with diamonds from the mine all the way to the hands of the consumer. Funny you mention "super ideal" because I just came back from a jewelry convention and when i went out to dinner with some dealer friends from new york and some prestigious retailers from LA, one of them actually told a story about a client requesting super ideal and how he explained to her how super ideal is a term coined by the promotional goods companies. Believe whomever you want. I speak the truth.
Some HOF stones are AGS certed, but AGS will inscribe anything you want on the side of the diamond. I can take a round diamond and have AGS inscribe "Princess Cut" on it if I wanted to, my friend actually got his wife's name inscribed on the stone.
I stand corrected on the cuts. I was reciting from memory at the time.
AGS ideal is about 61-62/56-57. 0 is the grade assigned, however we in the industry still use the proportions instead of just saying 0. If I were to tell a retailer that the particular stone was AGS triple zero, it means nothing to him. He wants numbers.
The Prices of EGL is reflected by the often higher color and clarity that a diamond receives after being certed by EGL. For example, if I got an H SI1 GIA, I would probably get a F VS2 EGL-US, and a E VS1 EGL-International. EGL still uses the term Ideal. GIA making the terms Triple EX were in response to AGS and EGL adopting the terms Ideal, bet you didn't know that! Also, AGS (within the last month) JUST released a new cert type, which you should be seeing pretty soon.
What i meant by the fact that I would not buy HOF is from a personal stand point. I can call one of my clients and pick up any HOF at cost for my wife, gf, etc.... Even if HOF contacted my about distributing their goods I would not want to.
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quote=bgdiamond;10509188]Rising Sun,
Super Ideal is a term made up by the industry. believe me when i tell you that I've been immersed in the industry since birth. My whole family, direct and extended, deals with diamonds from the mine all the way to the hands of the consumer. Funny you mention "super ideal" because I just came back from a jewelry convention and when i went out to dinner with some dealer friends from new york and some prestigious retailers from LA, one of them actually told a story about a client requesting super ideal and how he explained to her how super ideal is a term coined by the promotional goods companies. Believe whomever you want. I speak the truth.
I understand that "superideal" is a term coined by those in the industry promoting diamonds cut to superior physical and optical symmetry. Calling a stone superideal and having the stone meet the criteria are two different things. The word ideal has also been misused. We need to be sure that stones called ideal meet the AGS 0 criteria.
Some HOF stones are AGS certed, but AGS will inscribe anything you want on the side of the diamond. I can take a round diamond and have AGS inscribe "Princess Cut" on it if I wanted to, my friend actually got his wife's name inscribed on the stone. All HOF diamonds are graded by AGS. It's not something engraved at random by AGS or HOF. That would be fraud. In addition, the AGS grading report number is also engraved on the girdle and can be verified by AGS.
I stand corrected on the cuts. I was reciting from memory at the time.
AGS ideal is about 61-62/56-57. 0 is the grade assigned, however we in the industry still use the proportions instead of just saying 0. If I were to tell a retailer that the particular stone was AGS triple zero, it means nothing to him. He wants numbers. The numbers you have cited are not the parameters for AGS ideal.
*depth: 60-62%
*table: 54-57%
*CA: 34-45 degrees
*PA: 40.6-41 degrees
*LGF: 76%+
The Prices of EGL is reflected by the often higher color and clarity that a diamond receives after being certed by EGL. For example, if I got an H SI1 GIA, I would probably get a F VS2 EGL-US, and a E VS1 EGL-International. EGL still uses the term Ideal. GIA making the terms Triple EX were in response to AGS and EGL adopting the terms Ideal, bet you didn't know that! Also, AGS (within the last month) JUST released a new cert type, which you should be seeing pretty soon. There is no comparison between AGS ideal and EGL ideal. Anyone with knowledge in the field is aware of that. I have been aware of the new AGS system for quite some time. The only grading report I am interested in is the AGS Quality Performance Document, as it is their top of the line grading report.
What i meant by the fact that I would not buy HOF is from a personal stand point. I can call one of my clients and pick up any HOF at cost for my wife, gf, etc.... Even if HOF contacted my about distributing their goods I would not want to.[/quote] This is a matter of preference, of course. I have seen branded diamonds from HOF and A Cut Above. I can see the difference compared to the unbranded/ungraded diamonds I used to own. I would consider an unbranded stone, if it met the same performance criteria. I would no longer purchase an ungraded stone, but my preference would be AGS 0 followed by GIA Ex.
The reason I have responded to you in depth is that an increasing number of consumers are becoming highly educated about diamonds and it's important for those of us offering advice be current about the information we supply--especially those in the trade, who represent themselves as experts.
Super Ideal is a term made up by the industry. believe me when i tell you that I've been immersed in the industry since birth. My whole family, direct and extended, deals with diamonds from the mine all the way to the hands of the consumer. Funny you mention "super ideal" because I just came back from a jewelry convention and when i went out to dinner with some dealer friends from new york and some prestigious retailers from LA, one of them actually told a story about a client requesting super ideal and how he explained to her how super ideal is a term coined by the promotional goods companies. Believe whomever you want. I speak the truth.
I understand that "superideal" is a term coined by those in the industry promoting diamonds cut to superior physical and optical symmetry. Calling a stone superideal and having the stone meet the criteria are two different things. The word ideal has also been misused. We need to be sure that stones called ideal meet the AGS 0 criteria.
Some HOF stones are AGS certed, but AGS will inscribe anything you want on the side of the diamond. I can take a round diamond and have AGS inscribe "Princess Cut" on it if I wanted to, my friend actually got his wife's name inscribed on the stone. All HOF diamonds are graded by AGS. It's not something engraved at random by AGS or HOF. That would be fraud. In addition, the AGS grading report number is also engraved on the girdle and can be verified by AGS.
I stand corrected on the cuts. I was reciting from memory at the time.
AGS ideal is about 61-62/56-57. 0 is the grade assigned, however we in the industry still use the proportions instead of just saying 0. If I were to tell a retailer that the particular stone was AGS triple zero, it means nothing to him. He wants numbers. The numbers you have cited are not the parameters for AGS ideal.
*depth: 60-62%
*table: 54-57%
*CA: 34-45 degrees
*PA: 40.6-41 degrees
*LGF: 76%+
The Prices of EGL is reflected by the often higher color and clarity that a diamond receives after being certed by EGL. For example, if I got an H SI1 GIA, I would probably get a F VS2 EGL-US, and a E VS1 EGL-International. EGL still uses the term Ideal. GIA making the terms Triple EX were in response to AGS and EGL adopting the terms Ideal, bet you didn't know that! Also, AGS (within the last month) JUST released a new cert type, which you should be seeing pretty soon. There is no comparison between AGS ideal and EGL ideal. Anyone with knowledge in the field is aware of that. I have been aware of the new AGS system for quite some time. The only grading report I am interested in is the AGS Quality Performance Document, as it is their top of the line grading report.
What i meant by the fact that I would not buy HOF is from a personal stand point. I can call one of my clients and pick up any HOF at cost for my wife, gf, etc.... Even if HOF contacted my about distributing their goods I would not want to.[/quote] This is a matter of preference, of course. I have seen branded diamonds from HOF and A Cut Above. I can see the difference compared to the unbranded/ungraded diamonds I used to own. I would consider an unbranded stone, if it met the same performance criteria. I would no longer purchase an ungraded stone, but my preference would be AGS 0 followed by GIA Ex.
The reason I have responded to you in depth is that an increasing number of consumers are becoming highly educated about diamonds and it's important for those of us offering advice be current about the information we supply--especially those in the trade, who represent themselves as experts.
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- NOT ALL HOF ARE AGS GRADED. I went into a clients store the other day and saw one that was not inscribed or certed.
- Measurements are measurements, all labs measure the stone the same and for the most part there is not much of a discrepancy between what GIA, AGS, or EGL consider Ideal.
- I (along with the majority of people involved in the jewelry industry) consider the following certs from most stringent to most lenient.
1) GIA
2) AGS
3) HRD
4) EGL-US
5) EGL-International (Israel, Turkey, India, Belgium, etc...)
6) IGI, AGT,PGS, AGA, GGL, GQI, GCAL, WGI, VGR, AA&GO, AIG, DPL, DRL, DTL
- Measurements are measurements, all labs measure the stone the same and for the most part there is not much of a discrepancy between what GIA, AGS, or EGL consider Ideal.
- I (along with the majority of people involved in the jewelry industry) consider the following certs from most stringent to most lenient.
1) GIA
2) AGS
3) HRD
4) EGL-US
5) EGL-International (Israel, Turkey, India, Belgium, etc...)
6) IGI, AGT,PGS, AGA, GGL, GQI, GCAL, WGI, VGR, AA&GO, AIG, DPL, DRL, DTL
I have enjoyed reading the polite argument above.
I understand where both posters are comng from. It's a case of oldschool vs newschool in terms of mentality of the buyer.
I tend to steer away from branded diamonds, because the simple answer is an equal stone can always be found for less when it is unbranded.
That's my two pennies, and I never claim I am correct about anything; just opinionated, LOL.
I understand where both posters are comng from. It's a case of oldschool vs newschool in terms of mentality of the buyer.
I tend to steer away from branded diamonds, because the simple answer is an equal stone can always be found for less when it is unbranded.
That's my two pennies, and I never claim I am correct about anything; just opinionated, LOL.
I think you made a really great point about more educated consumers, us PS-trained folks are a strange breed and we're spreading like wildfire. I also think it's interesting how the educated consumers often ruffle the feathers of those "in the industry". So desperately are they clinging to the upper hand that they completely kill the entire sale/relationship. But I am also finding that those "in the industry" are less and less educated and more and more sales and pressure tactics.
I have to say I disagree with the rank of certs above but perhaps in the industry I am backwards but I always consider AGS above all and I know so little about HRD that I rank it lower than EGL-Israel or any other "nonames"
I agree, ame, that we are a "strange" breed and tend to ruffle the feathers of the old school. When I brought my IS into my jeweler, he gave me "the look." When I showed him how to use it, he could see the utility of it for people like me
HRD is used for grading primarily in Europe and has an excellent reputation. I believe it is based in Belgium.Nice to see you again