Evaluating exotic skin quality?

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A bottle of Red

A bottle of Red

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May 16, 2020
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#1
I know leathers have different quality levels and was wondering if that applies to exotics like croc and gator as well?
I'm wondering this because I came across a Coach bag in Alligator for $8,000 which is significantly less than other gator skin bags I've seen.
So how can you tell if the lower price is due to a lesser quality skin vs coach just not charging as much as another brand?
 
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#2
A bottle of Red said:
I know leathers have different quality levels and was wondering if that applies to exotics like croc and gator as well?
I'm wondering this because I came across a Coach bag in Alligator for $8,000 which is significantly less than other gator skin bags I've seen.
So how can you tell if the lower price is due to a lesser quality skin vs coach just not charging as much as another brand?
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The Coach alligator that I’ve seen is beautiful but there’s a couple of things that are red flags. (Especially that they don’t offer CITES documentation… which should be easy to source since most alligator is farm raised in the USA).

The main characteristics for exotics such as croc / gator are related to evenness of finish and suppleness of the hide.

(If you google alligator / croc hides from even the most reputable sources like HCP you’ll notice that prices are actually a lot cheaper than you might expect)

Historically brands have charged very high MSRPs so that’s what you see for exotics. Grade 1 hides shouldn’t have any visible flaws and great manufacturers only use grade 1.

Where brands do however cut costs is by using parts of the hide which are not as prized(anything that isn’t centre cut from the belly). For example, on this niloticus birkin the scales are part of the cheaper part of the hide nearer to the tail. IMG_8486.jpeg
This same cheaper part of the hide is used for the sides of the coach rogue.
IMG_8487.jpeg
 
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#3
Christofle said:
The Coach alligator that I’ve seen is beautiful but there’s a couple of things that are red flags. (Especially that they don’t offer CITES documentation… which should be easy to source since most alligator is farm raised in the USA).

The main characteristics for exotics such as croc / gator are related to evenness of finish and suppleness of the hide.

(If you google alligator / croc hides from even the most reputable sources like HCP you’ll notice that prices are actually a lot cheaper than you might expect)

Historically brands have charged very high MSRPs so that’s what you see for exotics. Grade 1 hides shouldn’t have any visible flaws and great manufacturers only use grade 1.

Where brands do however cut costs is by using parts of the hide which are not top grade (anything that isn’t centre cut from the belly). For example, on this niloticus birkin the scales are part of the cheaper part of the hide nearer to the tail. View attachment 6119700
This same cheaper part of the hide is used for the sides of the coach rogue.
View attachment 6119701
Click to expand...
Yes I wondered about cites because they say nothing about it on the website. Isn't it illegal to sell gator without cites?
Also will the lower quality skin on the sides be more prone to damage ?
 
#4
A bottle of Red said:
Yes I wondered about cites because they say nothing about it on the website. Isn't it illegal to sell gator without cites?
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No because they aren’t exporting it out of the country (same reason I can’t buy any exotics in Canada from coach)
(The hides themselves are certified but the certificates for the items aren’t issued)

A bottle of Red said:
Also will the lower quality skin on the sides be more prone to damage ?
Click to expand...
It is more along the lines of visual appeal than durability (the scale pattern of the centre belly is prized due to its look).

Albeit the closer you get to the tail, the higher the percentage of cartilage which is indeed less durable.
 
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#5
Christofle said:
No because they aren’t exporting it out of the country (same reason I can’t buy any exotics in Canada from coach)
(The hides themselves are certified but the certificates for the items aren’t issued)


It is more along the lines of visual appeal than durability (the scale pattern of the centre belly is prized due to its look).

Albeit the closer you get to the tail, the higher the percentage of cartilage which is indeed less durable.
Click to expand...
I appreciate your insight and clarification! Thank you so much
 
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#8
There are different grades for sure. Skins with minor flaws as @Christofle mentioned, and also various parts of the animal that are not as valuable like leg or sides. They also need to be tanned and finished properly. No spotting if dyed (different than hand staining or given a unique hand-dye). Alligator like crocodile could either be matte or shiny or somewhere in between, but not a bit matte and a bit shiny. US alligator should also be soft, supple and undulating.

Also, watch out for mismatched skins (back and front - or side to side). There is a definitely a temptation to use a perfect skin on the front and something altogether less perfect on the reverse. Scale size that's not considered within the scale of the design of a bag (either too big or too small). I think the holes need to be different (@Christofle can tell you more about that) most exotics are easier to tear if not sewn correctly.

I think it's very strange they don't offer CITES :shrugs: H and Gucci alligator always do, even fashion bracelets or other products with just a little trim.
 
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#9
papertiger said:
There are different grades for sure. Skins with minor flaws as @Christofle mentioned, and also various parts of the animal that are not as valuable like leg or sides. They also need to be tanned and finished properly. No spotting if dyed (different than hand staining or given a unique hand-dye). Alligator like crocodile could either be matte or shiny or somewhere in between, but not a bit matte and a bit shiny. US alligator should also be soft, supple and undulating.

Also, watch out for mismatched skins (back and front - or side to side). There is a definitely a temptation to use a perfect skin on the from and something altogether less perfect on the reverse. Scale size that's not considered within the scale of the design of a bag (either too big or too small). I think the holes need to be different (@Christofle can tell you more about that) most exotics are easier to tear if not sewn correctly.
Click to expand...

papertiger said:
I think it's very strange they don't offer CITES :shrugs:H and Gucci alligator always do, even fashion bracelets or other products with just a little trim.
Click to expand...
From my understanding, while talking to my old Coach SA who now works for Chanel: She seemed to make it sound like the exotics are mostly made for the New York flagship and are essentially a halo product.

They don’t really have the incentive to deal with the legal hassle of CITES documentation… maybe if they were more serious about exotics they’d offer them in many stores and like other brands they would have all the documentation on hand.

But again, for Coach 9000 USD is far far far away from their normal MSRP.
 
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#10
Christofle said:
From my understanding, while talking to my old Coach SA who now works for Chanel: She seemed to make it sound like the exotics are mostly made for the New York flagship and are essentially a halo product.

They don’t really have the incentive to deal with the legal hassle of CITES documentation… maybe if they were more serious about exotics they’d offer them in many stores and like other brands they would have all the documentation on hand.

But again, for Coach 9000 USD is far far far away from their normal MSRP.
Click to expand...
It is way higher than their normal price range so I was wondering if it's 'worth it' or not.
 
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#12
I do like the design ( my first brand bag not from an outlet was the rogue in grey suede) and I love the look of gator.
Now whether hubby thinks it's worth it is a whole ' nother story 😅😆
Eta they're definitely on the coach website in a few different sizes and colors
 
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