Buyer doesn't want to pay customs charges. Please help!

[alfiebach]

Yikes! That is incredible - I didn't realize that you had to pay so much when buying internationally.

You mention that ParcelForce isn't cheap. Is there a better way to get items to international buyers? I always just go with USPS Global Priority Mail, which I guess sends the package to ParcelForce when it reaches the UK. Do you prefer a different shipping service? I am flexible and willing to use whatever the buyer wants me to (within reason) but no one has ever asked me to use an alternate shipping service.

If sellers dont want to lie on customs forms(which is fair enough i feel) fed ex, seem to be cheaper, and they deliver item, and you pay them, but their delivery can be a bit hit or miss.....I dont think there is a best way to be honest with you, unless we buy from other countries, that know the system, but you then take the chance of insurance being void as item is undervalued....which causes a lot of heated arguments here.......You have been unlucky, with this guy, as i really did not know the 1st time i was billed,about custons, as it was a used item. But commen sense tells you its not sellers fault, its your countries duties, and not down to seller. Good Luck, keep us posted

 

[asianbelle]

As a buyer, I always expect the seller to mark my package at full value, and when they don't, I just take that as a bonus on my end (lower custom fees). Although one time this idiotic seller (he was very rude to me for some reason, and it's not like I bothered him) marked my package at $250, and I only paid $19 for the item! His reason was that's how much the item originally cost, but hello, that's not how much I paid! So good thing I got my money back from customs b/c I printed out the auction page and sent it as proof.

I can't believe your buyer is being so unreasonable! Hope it works out for you!

 

[choo_girl123]

Hi OP here. I received the following from the buyer this morning:

Thank you kindly for your advice regarding the custom charge payment and for drawing my attention to the fine print of your listing which, had it not hitherto escaped my notice, would have caused me to avoid bidding altogether. As a matter of principle I do not consider it fair or justifiable to pay customs duty on a second-hand eBay item as the price paid on it is arbitrary and not assigned by a retail outlet. If I'd purchased the agenda from a Chanel cncession on ebay or other such I'd have been happy to allow for the added customs cost. As it is, however, my budget cannot accommodate any more outlay on this item. I therefore respectfully suggest that when the item is returned to you - and if you're then unwilling to revisit your position on a fairer customs declaration - you refund my payment in full (minus shipping) and we'll conclude this business amicably. I thank you for your comprehension and look forward to hearing from you soon.

And here is my response:

I appreciate your continued communication. Please allow me to clarify a few things for you.

First, I assure you that you did not buy a "used" or "second-hand" item as you assert. You purchased a brand new Chanel agenda, which was shipped to you in the original box with the original sales receipts and a copy of my credit card statement showing the actual price paid by me - $450 (USD) plus tax. This item is not used, it is not second-hand, and you purchased it at a steeply discounted price.

Second, the price of the item was not arbitrarily set, as you suggest. It was, in fact, set by YOU. You purchased this item as a "best offer" and in making your offer, you stated that the highest amount you were willing to pay was $320 (USD) because you would be subject to customs charges. Obviously, you knew that custom charges would be assessed so I wonder why you now seem surprised by these charges? I am equally puzzled as to why you would think the customs charges are MY responsibility when the listing (and common sense) clearly dictates otherwise.

Finally, regardless of what you think is fair or justifiable regarding completing customs form, the law dictates that I complete the forms accurately and completely, as do eBay's and PayPal's policies. Again - this should not have come as a surprise to you.

I have been in touch with both eBay and PayPal regarding this matter. Customer Service reps from both organizations have suggested that I email you and encourage you to pick up your item and complete the transaction as per the terms of our agreement. While I certainly cannot force you to adhere to the terms of our agreement I will tell you that if you fail to pick up the package, and the package does not reach me, PayPal seller protection will preclude you from receiving a refund. In addition, any shipping costs associated with the return will be deducted from any monies you might receive. Therefore, I strongly suggest you act in good faith and pick up your item.

What do you think? Was I too harsh?

There's a lot about this that makes me angry, but do you know what bugs me the most? I wasn't going to come down so much on my price, but the buyer kept sending me emails saying that he really wanted to buy the agenda as a holiday gift, but that he couldn't possibly go higher than $320 given the economic times & the VAT he'd have to pay. He KNEW there was going to be a customs charge & I came down to accommodate him. I just think it's such a low blow to now refuse the package.

Even worse? I got hit with that 30-day restriction, so there's no way I'll be able to relist in time for the holidays. I'm so bummed.

 

[Toothfairy4]

Your response is brilliant, you've been polite yet firm with him. This buyer obviously knew he'd get hit with customs but maybe thought he might get off a bit more lightly? I know myself from having things shipped into the UK it can be a bit hit and miss with wheter you get charged customs fees or not even if the ful value is declared on the package xx

 

[choo_girl123]

Your response is brilliant, you've been polite yet firm with him. This buyer obviously knew he'd get hit with customs but maybe thought he might get off a bit more lightly? I know myself from having things shipped into the UK it can be a bit hit and miss with wheter you get charged customs fees or not even if the ful value is declared on the package xx

Well thank you! I would have settled for 'you did okay' but brilliant is lovely to hear

 

[luvtami]

^^ I've been following this thread -- the wording of your emails to this buyer have really been excellent. You keep everything factual and don't come across as harassing.

 

[noshoepolish]

I would have just told her when you get the item back you will refund her less shipping and a 15% restocking fee and taken the negative.

 

[K.Z.]

choo-girl: killer letter

 

[shinymagpie]

Well your buyer should know that this is cheap, if its with parcel force. You get charged the whole amount ie $320 plus $25 shipping, our vat is 17 1/2 %, plus for small items is £8, and bags £13.50, and import duty as well on top. So dont give in to him, he is wrong here. Unless your just going to track the item with out insurance, there is no point lying saying its a gift, we still get charged for gifts over here. Hope that has helped, and good luck. Please dont be put off by this 1 mad man....

OP nice work to date and also thanks to the other posters for illuminating advice. But Alfiebach if you are out there, I want to ask a bit more about UK customs from your extensive knowledge.

So in the UK, Parcelforce is a privatised national delivery service? Is the the old British Post remodelled? Are the Parcelforce handling costs that you mentioned 8 Pound small (sorry, my board doesn't have the pound symbol, only the ￥and the $) and 13.50 pound fees apply for all mail or only EMS.

I usually use EMS because it is so fast and reliable & I put the paypal receipt in with the item. But, would using Airmail Small Packet with Registration and Insurance mean that Parcelforce doesn't add the handling fee?

Or does Parcelforce check everything that comes into the UK, regardless of class of mail used?

I just don't understand this in detail but I need to know all about it I think before anything else goes to the UK.

 

[chloehandbags]

Thank you very much for following up the package on my behalf and for your regular communication. I was overseas on business and returned on Saturday to find a letter from Parcelforce demanding a sum of 42 Pounds($63) to release my package to me. I find this an outrageous sum, as I'm sure you agree.

That's not outrageous - well it is, of course, but it's about what us poor saps always get shafted for!

In fact, if anything, it's very slightly less than usual, I think...?

It is customary when shipping used and/or eBay items overseas to declare a value of less than $50 or to write the word 'gift' to avoid such exorbitant custm charges.

No, it isn't - some sellers do that, but it's at their own risk, as if the package goes astray, they will not receive full compensation on the postal insurance they should have bought to cover themselves (not the buyer).

As it is I cannot pay this sum, which is in addition to the price I paid you which was in itself above what I was willing to pay.

I have sympathy if he really can't pay (and isn't just trying to con you into giving him a discount); things are tough at the moment, after all.

But, he should have factored customs duties in, before making his offer.

I think your emails to the buyer are excellent, choo_girl.

Although, obviously, you're not left in an easy situation, as there is little you can do to force him to pay, if he really doesn't want to.

 

[chloehandbags]

Perhaps customs over-valued the item.

Nope.

Undervalued it, if anything.

It's just wrong that we have to pay so much, isn't it?

 

[kristinmcd]

Fabu letter. I am thoroughly impressed! I am anxious to hear the response.

 

[chloehandbags]

OP nice work to date and also thanks to the other posters for illuminating advice. But Alfiebach if you are out there, I want to ask a bit more about UK customs from your extensive knowledge.

So in the UK, Parcelforce is a privatised national delivery service? Is the the old British Post remodelled? Are the Parcelforce handling costs that you mentioned 8 Pound small (sorry, my board doesn't have the pound symbol, only the ￥and the $) and 13.50 pound fees apply for all mail or only EMS.

I usually use EMS because it is so fast and reliable & I put the paypal receipt in with the item. But, would using Airmail Small Packet with Registration and Insurance mean that Parcelforce doesn't add the handling fee?

Or does Parcelforce check everything that comes into the UK, regardless of class of mail used?

I just don't understand this in detail but I need to know all about it I think before anything else goes to the UK.

No, not everything is delivered by ParcelForce (thank God!).

I'm not sure which US shipping methods end up with parcels falling into ParcelForce's (highly unprofessional) hands, I'm afraid, but I would definitely encourage US sellers to, if possible, always ask the P.O. whether a parcel sent via a certain delivery method will, ultimately, be delivered by them and if so, to refuse it and to select one that will NOT.

In this case, it sounds as though ParcelForce are doing their job fairly well, but, sadly, that has NOT been my experience of them, at all.

Whenever they have tried to deliver to me and I've been out, they have NEVER left me a delivery note and so I have been completely unaware that they have tried to deliver.

They also, often, seem to drastically overvalue things, for some unknown reason and always charge customs fees (via other methods, items sometimes seem to seem to slip through, uncharged, but not with dear old ParcelForce).

Their depots are also, invariably, 30 miles away, or more, too and often in some remote location, making it very difficult to pick up one's item in a timely fashion, even when one has finally worked out (on one's own) that it must be with them.

This is unlike the regular Royal Mail, where the postman leaves a note and you can, simply, pop down to your local Post Office to collect the parcel and pay any duties.

They also, rarely, seem to answer their phones, so even when you've finally figured out that ParcelFarce must have the missing parcel, if there is any problem with the duties being charged (as, as I say, there often seems to be!), it is virtually impossible to find anyone to talk to and even when you finally do, they are generally fairly polite but extremely unhelpful.

So, if at all possible, please avoid ParcelForce (and services that use ParcelForce) like the plague!

 

[AmourCouture]

Hi OP here. I received the following from the buyer this morning:

Thank you kindly for your advice regarding the custom charge payment and for drawing my attention to the fine print of your listing which, had it not hitherto escaped my notice, would have caused me to avoid bidding altogether. As a matter of principle I do not consider it fair or justifiable to pay customs duty on a second-hand eBay item as the price paid on it is arbitrary and not assigned by a retail outlet. If I'd purchased the agenda from a Chanel cncession on ebay or other such I'd have been happy to allow for the added customs cost. As it is, however, my budget cannot accommodate any more outlay on this item. I therefore respectfully suggest that when the item is returned to you - and if you're then unwilling to revisit your position on a fairer customs declaration - you refund my payment in full (minus shipping) and we'll conclude this business amicably. I thank you for your comprehension and look forward to hearing from you soon.

And here is my response:

I appreciate your continued communication. Please allow me to clarify a few things for you.

First, I assure you that you did not buy a "used" or "second-hand" item as you assert. You purchased a brand new Chanel agenda, which was shipped to you in the original box with the original sales receipts and a copy of my credit card statement showing the actual price paid by me - $450 (USD) plus tax. This item is not used, it is not second-hand, and you purchased it at a steeply discounted price.

Second, the price of the item was not arbitrarily set, as you suggest. It was, in fact, set by YOU. You purchased this item as a "best offer" and in making your offer, you stated that the highest amount you were willing to pay was $320 (USD) because you would be subject to customs charges. Obviously, you knew that custom charges would be assessed so I wonder why you now seem surprised by these charges? I am equally puzzled as to why you would think the customs charges are MY responsibility when the listing (and common sense) clearly dictates otherwise.

Finally, regardless of what you think is fair or justifiable regarding completing customs form, the law dictates that I complete the forms accurately and completely, as do eBay's and PayPal's policies. Again - this should not have come as a surprise to you.

I have been in touch with both eBay and PayPal regarding this matter. Customer Service reps from both organizations have suggested that I email you and encourage you to pick up your item and complete the transaction as per the terms of our agreement. While I certainly cannot force you to adhere to the terms of our agreement I will tell you that if you fail to pick up the package, and the package does not reach me, PayPal seller protection will preclude you from receiving a refund. In addition, any shipping costs associated with the return will be deducted from any monies you might receive. Therefore, I strongly suggest you act in good faith and pick up your item.

What do you think? Was I too harsh?

There's a lot about this that makes me angry, but do you know what bugs me the most? I wasn't going to come down so much on my price, but the buyer kept sending me emails saying that he really wanted to buy the agenda as a holiday gift, but that he couldn't possibly go higher than $320 given the economic times & the VAT he'd have to pay. He KNEW there was going to be a customs charge & I came down to accommodate him. I just think it's such a low blow to now refuse the package.

Even worse? I got hit with that 30-day restriction, so there's no way I'll be able to relist in time for the holidays. I'm so bummed.

I am so impressed. I am going to have to save this as a template for my next BS customs compaint.

 

[choo_girl123]

^^ I've been following this thread -- the wording of your emails to this buyer have really been excellent. You keep everything factual and don't come across as harassing.

Thank you! I've actually been taking the advice of all the fabulous people that have contributed to this thread and just trying to stay firm and reasonable. I will keep you posted & thanks for your help!!