Question about what is/isn't allowed here

[K.Z.]

I asked this question via PM about five weeks ago and haven't heard back (I know you guyz are super busy), so I figured I might as well ask it here.

I went over the forum's rules and couldn't get a definite answer to this question. According to forum policy, members can add links to their websites in their signatures after a certain amount of time here and number of posts, but can they promote a service (not an item) via PM? And can they use TPF resources to charge for a service?

For example:

- Member A reads about Member B's problem with the condition of bag just purchased and sends B a PM letting her know that she (A) has a bag restoration service and that for a fee she can fix B's bag.

- Member C reads Member D's thread about a fake bag and a PayPal claim, etc., and sends a PM to tell D that she (C) can authenticate the bag and issue a certificate for a fee.

- Member C the uses TPF's AT threads to get bags authenticated and then sells these authentications to her clients.

TIA!

 

[Swanky]

Answering in purple

I asked this question via PM about five weeks ago and haven't heard back (I know you guyz are super busy), so I figured I might as well ask it here.

I went over the forum's rules and couldn't get a definite answer to this question. According to forum policy, members can add links to their websites in their signatures after a certain amount of time here and number of posts, but can they promote a service (not an item) via PM? And can they use TPF resources to charge for a service?

For example:

- Member A reads about Member B's problem with the condition of bag just purchased and sends B a PM letting her know that she (A) has a bag restoration service and that for a fee she can fix B's bag.

no, not allowed - this is soliciting and is completely forbidden

- Member C reads Member D's thread about a fake bag and a PayPal claim, etc., and sends a PM to tell D that she (C) can authenticate the bag and issue a certificate for a fee.

no, not allowed - this is soliciting and is completely forbidden

- Member C the uses TPF's AT threads to get bags authenticated and then sells these authentications to her clients.

no rule against it, although the AT threads do say it's for buyers . . . but there's not a rule per se. In addition, I always tell authenticators they have ZERO obligation to authenticate, they can pick and choose

TIA!

 

[K.Z.]

 

[Swanky]

hope it helped{?}

 

[Ellie Mae]

Swanky... I have a question about same....

What about if Member A advises Member B of the services offered by Member C.

SUCH AS... there is a member here who does private authentications for a fee and provides letters for PP and Ebay claims. To my own personal knowledge, she is the ONLY person I know who authenticates this particular brand, other than CarolDiva.
And when I see a post about the purchase of a fake (this brand) on the ebay forum, I DO advise the buyer to contact this member's authentication website if a non-auth letter is needed. As do others....
She is not soliciting, others are referring her services, via her website.
IS THAT OK??

 

[K.Z.]

I thought that falls under what's not allowed kuz that's basically advertising/promoting either your services or the services of your friend, who is also a member here. And the PM system is not supposed to be used for that type of thing. At least that's what I'm understanding from TPF rules plus Swanky's response to my questions.

 

[Ellie Mae]

Actually, it's similar to LMB being a member here, as MANY refer other pfers to LMB website for restoration and product assistance. But LMB does not solicit it's own services via PM.
OR RDC and ****** being a member here and other members referring other members to their respective websites in quest of bags.


NOTE.. the members themselves are NOT PMing/soliciting their own service. And other members are being advised publicly to visit a website. This does not involve PM's.

 

[K.Z.]

I see what you mean, and I wonder where the line is drawn. I see this issue in two parts:

-- On one hand it could be OK if it's someone else (other than the owner of the business) promoting the service, but on the other hand this would open the door for just about anybody to send out PMs soliciting business through friends or associates here. And whether people call it referral or not, it's still a method of promoting a business or advertising a service here without paying ad fees.

-- The other part is the use of the PM system for something like this. If it's OK to recommend someone's business here, then why not post it on the thread? Why send PMs to OPs directing them to the TPFer's business/service?

I hope Swanky comes back to clarify this for us.

 

[Ellie Mae]

I am referncing posts on a thread, not PM.

 

[Swanky]

I could, for example, PM KZ and let her know that a member could help and tell her to contact that member OFF tPF - like through that member's business.

We'd get into over-moderating, IMO, if we tried to control friends advertising for friends unless it was blatant and disruptive. So there's not a rule that A can't tell B about C's business, like my very 1st sentence in this post. But it has to be OFF tPF because Megs and Vlad didn't offer tPF as a platform to further people's personal businesses.

Clear as mud?

 

[K.Z.]

Yes, ma'am!

 

[Ellie Mae]

I could, for example, PM KZ and let her know that a member could help and tell her to contact that member OFF tPF - like through that member's business.

We'd get into over-moderating, IMO, if we tried to control friends advertising for friends unless it was blatant and disruptive. So there's not a rule that A can't tell B about C's business, like my very 1st sentence in this post. But it has to be OFF tPF because Megs and Vlad didn't offer tPF as a platform to further people's personal businesses.

Clear as mud?

NOPE.. I am PMing you. Because what I reference is done ON pf, in a public post.
Go to bed and answer me MANANA

 

[K.Z.]

It also goes on via PM, which I think it's a bigger problem kuz it's done in hiding. Member A tells Member B about Member's C service/website, and maybe Member A is part of the operation and/or gets paid for this type of promotion. Swanky says this kind of activity needs to take place off TPF, but how? Members don't know each other's emails, so they send PMs. That's using TPF resources to promote a business and generate sales without paying ad fees. I also think it's unfair for members to charge their customers for authentications that are done here for free by other members. I suppose there's either no way TPF can moderate their activity or maybe it could but it would be too much of a PITA.

 

[Lvbabydoll]

^ We kind of had that problem in the LV area recently where a member who was a reseller would see what people were looking for based on their posts for authentications, then PM them saying they would keep an eye out for that item for them (essentially advertising their resale business). Fortunately the lovely LV mods nipped that in the bud.

 

[Lescoy]

The issue is that there is NO soliciting - and any member who solicits - IMO - is breaking the Rules.

If another member refers another member to a service - which is undertaken outwith tPF - then that is perfectly legitimate.

What goes on outwith tPF is not bound by the Rules herein.

There are members here who do offer a written authentication in terms of PayPal/EBay disputes/claims. I have NO idea whether they are doing this via PM or outwith our bounds. Until recently, I wasn't aware that anyone could do this - other than CarolDiva or MyPoupette.

As Swanky has said - tPF isn't about soliciting for business - but if someone recommends another member for either resale, or authentication (business) - and its done outwith tPF - then as far as I'm aware - its not breaking our Rules here -

Its important to remember that whilst we have Rules on tPF - they don't stretch outwith.

As for the AT Threads - I'm well aware that sellers use the AT Threads for authentication purposes - Point is - we are generally helping buyers - but there is no reason why we can't help sellers - providing they aren't actually posting links to their auction listings.

We offer this authentication service freely - and using our own time - and are happy to do so.

If girls are able to run a business outwith tPF doing this service - and charging a fee - they aren't stopping girls posting on the tPF AT Threads - as most people don't want to pay for the service. There is, however, still a 'niche market' for a paid service - and if some girls here are offering that - then providing its down outwith tPF and not using any of the correspondence links here - then IMO - its not an issue.

Bottomline - don't solicit any sales or services via tPF - I think if we can put it that way - then surely most people can understand.

These are just my thoughts - and no doubt I'll be shot down in flames