out $1500 and my item on chargeback... Paypal doesn't seem to care

Apr 24, 2013
71
10
>Sold dress size 6 for $1,5xx.xx.
>Buyer receives and says they received the size 6 that I sold, but said after taking measurements the dress is really a size 2 and I should take a return minus restocking fee.
>I told them that's not how eBay works...You don't measure clothes and make up a size. If they want to return, they'd have to pay restocking fee
>Unhappy with my resolution, they open a dispute
>Ebay tells her same thing, item was as described, and it's her responsibility to find out what size she is in a certain brand
>Unhappy with eBay's resolution, she does a chargeback and takes $1500 out of my account.
>Sold something for $2k a week after (really got paid $500) because the $1500 paypal took out
>Paypal doesn't seem to care one bit about the chargeback now that they've collected the money from me and tells me I am going to lose



Supposedly the seller mailed the item back to me, but I didn't receive anything. I didn't give them my address, nor did EBay. Paypal said the card company could careless about if it was described or not, if the buyer returned it, than they will get a full refund....is this correct?

Second, the tracking number the buyer used shows delivery some place else, like a completely different city...shouldn't the card company ask them where they got the address and confirm it's not tied to me? Seems like a easy scam to just mail a friend a bday gift (say an ipad) and give that tracking number to your card company and claim it's the dress they sent back and sent to me
 

BeenBurned

Coach, Dooney, Uggs
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Feb 25, 2007
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Without even going into the details of the transaction yet, I'm confused.

The only size marking I see on the dress itself is 36.

Yet the title has 36 6 8 40. (I see in the description that you have 6 US and 8 UK) Where did you get the conversions? Personally, if a converted size isn't shown on the label, I wouldn't even put it in. Let the buyer figure out whether it'll fit based on the measurements and what she learns about how size 36 runs.

When did the buyer file her dispute? The listing ended in July. Wouldn't she have been past her dispute period?

What is the reason given for the chargeback? If SNAD, PP doesn't protect you against SNAD claims, however if they've determined that the description is accurate (albeit confusing to me, anyway), they should protect you.

You probably have to fight and escalate up the supervisor chain of command.
 

lovely64

LunAtic
O.G.
Nov 17, 2006
38,080
319
Europe
Without even going into the details of the transaction yet, I'm confused.

The only size marking I see on the dress itself is 36.

Yet the title has 36 6 8 40. (I see in the description that you have 6 US and 8 UK) Where did you get the conversions? Personally, if a converted size isn't shown on the label, I wouldn't even put it in. Let the buyer figure out whether it'll fit based on the measurements and what she learns about how size 36 runs.

When did the buyer file her dispute? The listing ended in July. Wouldn't she have been past her dispute period?

What is the reason given for the chargeback? If SNAD, PP doesn't protect you against SNAD claims, however if they've determined that the description is accurate (albeit confusing to me, anyway), they should protect you.

You probably have to fight and escalate up the supervisor chain of command.
PP does protect agains SNAD, so far as I know?
 

IrisCole

O.G.
Dec 28, 2007
9,291
45
Michigan
www.nikitajade.etsy.com
I haven't seen the listing, but a 36 is not a US size 6 - it's much smaller than that. If the listing only mentioned 36 (adding measurements always helps), then you're probably fine.

Speaking just in relation to what's happened with the chargeback, call PP again and ask them to speak to someone in their Fraud Department. If the seller protection says, "eligible" on the receipt for the transaction, explain that you're covered in case of chargeback, and that PP already ruled in your favor - that they determined the item is not SNAD - and push them release the funds.
 

BeenBurned

Coach, Dooney, Uggs
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Feb 25, 2007
45,270
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East Coast, USA
PP does protect agains SNAD, so far as I know?
I believe PP protects against SNAD but in the case of a chargeback for (supposedly) SNAD, I think PP doesn't protect against a chargeback for SNAD.

I'll try to see if I can find anything on that.
 

BeenBurned

Coach, Dooney, Uggs
Authenticator
O.G.
Feb 25, 2007
45,270
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East Coast, USA
PP does protect agains SNAD, so far as I know?
I believe PP protects against SNAD but in the case of a chargeback for (supposedly) SNAD, I think PP doesn't protect against a chargeback for SNAD.

I'll try to see if I can find anything on that.
What is the Seller Protection Policy?
Seller protection does not provide protection for: Claims, chargebacks , or reversals for significantly not as described . Intangible purchases (for example: services, online games, hotels).

https://www.paypal.com/us/webapps/h...erId=16777218&searchId=1411050381668&rankId=3


Seller protection is a free service provided to our members. It reinforces our commitment to building trust and safety in our network. It acts as a safeguard for claims, chargebacks, or reversals opened for the following reasons:

  • Unauthorized Payment
  • Item Not Received
Seller protection does not provide protection for:

  • Claims, chargebacks, or reversals for significantly not as described.
  • Intangible purchases (for example: services, online games, hotels).
  • Items that you deliver in person.
  • Transactions made through PayPal Direct Payment or Virtual Terminal.

Seller protection is available for qualified transactions. The Transaction Details page shows whether or not your transaction is eligible for coverage under this policy. If it is, ship to the shipping address displayed on the Transaction Details page.

To ensure that your items are shipped to the appropriate address, do not accept shipping labels from the buyer or offers to use their shipping services (such as access to their account), since you will not be covered under seller protection. Fraudulent buyers may encourage you to use their shipping services since they have the ability to change or reroute the shipping address and then open a claim saying they did not receive the item from you.
 

Sssy

Member
Jan 1, 2013
4,064
9
London
Sorry to hear that you have ebay problem again.
I just found your listing. French size 36 is not the same as e.g. Germany 36, so it is not really UK 8 or US 4. I think you were lucky winning that case. It was predictable that after loosing her case she would try charge back.
Did you contact the buyer regarding non receiving your dress back?
 

lovely64

LunAtic
O.G.
Nov 17, 2006
38,080
319
Europe
What is the Seller Protection Policy?
Seller protection does not provide protection for: Claims, chargebacks , or reversals for significantly not as described . Intangible purchases (for example: services, online games, hotels).

https://www.paypal.com/us/webapps/h...erId=16777218&searchId=1411050381668&rankId=3


Seller protection is a free service provided to our members. It reinforces our commitment to building trust and safety in our network. It acts as a safeguard for claims, chargebacks, or reversals opened for the following reasons:

  • Unauthorized Payment
  • Item Not Received
Seller protection does not provide protection for:

  • Claims, chargebacks, or reversals for significantly not as described.
  • Intangible purchases (for example: services, online games, hotels).
  • Items that you deliver in person.
  • Transactions made through PayPal Direct Payment or Virtual Terminal.

Seller protection is available for qualified transactions. The Transaction Details page shows whether or not your transaction is eligible for coverage under this policy. If it is, ship to the shipping address displayed on the Transaction Details page.

To ensure that your items are shipped to the appropriate address, do not accept shipping labels from the buyer or offers to use their shipping services (such as access to their account), since you will not be covered under seller protection. Fraudulent buyers may encourage you to use their shipping services since they have the ability to change or reroute the shipping address and then open a claim saying they did not receive the item from you.
I did not manage to read it all but I have won snad having paid via pp only, from a french online site called VC, and I currently have another case open with the same site. Thanks for all he info I will read it when Im on my pc.

Edit

Oh, but I was the buyer! I guess that is different though!
 

BeenBurned

Coach, Dooney, Uggs
Authenticator
O.G.
Feb 25, 2007
45,270
11,144
East Coast, USA
I did not manage to read it all but I have won snad having paid via pp only, from a french online site called VC, and I currently have another case open with the same site. Thanks for all he info I will read it when Im on my pc.

Edit

Oh, but I was the buyer! I guess that is different though!
Does VC = Vestiaire Collective? Ugh! Did they sell you a fake?
 

ThisVNchick

SGN<->SF<->DC<->CDG
O.G.
May 7, 2008
4,502
995
Bi-coastal Gal
What is the Seller Protection Policy?
Seller protection does not provide protection for: Claims, chargebacks , or reversals for significantly not as described . Intangible purchases (for example: services, online games, hotels).

https://www.paypal.com/us/webapps/h...erId=16777218&searchId=1411050381668&rankId=3


Seller protection is a free service provided to our members. It reinforces our commitment to building trust and safety in our network. It acts as a safeguard for claims, chargebacks, or reversals opened for the following reasons:

  • Unauthorized Payment
  • Item Not Received
Seller protection does not provide protection for:

  • Claims, chargebacks, or reversals for significantly not as described.
  • Intangible purchases (for example: services, online games, hotels).
  • Items that you deliver in person.
  • Transactions made through PayPal Direct Payment or Virtual Terminal.

Seller protection is available for qualified transactions. The Transaction Details page shows whether or not your transaction is eligible for coverage under this policy. If it is, ship to the shipping address displayed on the Transaction Details page.

To ensure that your items are shipped to the appropriate address, do not accept shipping labels from the buyer or offers to use their shipping services (such as access to their account), since you will not be covered under seller protection. Fraudulent buyers may encourage you to use their shipping services since they have the ability to change or reroute the shipping address and then open a claim saying they did not receive the item from you.
If this is the policy, then any buyer can file a SNAD claim and do a chargeback and the seller would be out of the item and money? Is it really that easy to scam people?
 

BeenBurned

Coach, Dooney, Uggs
Authenticator
O.G.
Feb 25, 2007
45,270
11,144
East Coast, USA
If this is the policy, then any buyer can file a SNAD claim and do a chargeback and the seller would be out of the item and money? Is it really that easy to scam people?
While it's clearly a way for scammers to scam, there's a limited number of times the scammer will get away with it (if ever successful) because the c.c. company isn't going to allow too many disputes for the same thing.

Although PP protection doesn't cover SNAD chargebacks, I do think that PP can try to argue on the OP's behalf that the dispute was already resolved against the buyer because the item was found to be accurately described.

So the c.c. company might deny the buyer's chargeback.