Cargo Cults

[kate83675]

Maybe HH is having fun with us. Maybe they're tipping their hat to the "new normal". Does fashion have any real meaning in an economy like this one? Should we question our passion for material goods? What value do we attach to smooshiness or bling?

Or (DEAR GOD!!!) maybe they're pushing us to have discussions just like this one!

Actually I think that HH is giving us credit of having the intelligence of either getting the reference of Cargo Cult or doing as Syb did and having the curiosity to learn more about it.

I think the value of fashion is to give us an escape from the worries of the current economy since it is less relevant at a time like this. It amuses us and when we smell and pet our bags it give us a small moment of comfort and pleasure. Those are the positive contributions that "fashion" makes to us every day.

I dress in jeans and t-shirts most of the time but I do like having a bag that brings me enjoyment when I pick it up and makes me feel a little special. I appreciate HH doing that for me.

 

[fafnir]

I do think there is a certain amount of magical thinking that goes on (mostly in marketing) in the fashion industry. "cover yourself with exactly the right shoes, clothing, bags, etc and you too will attract the power of the elite". I'm pretty sure that's not what HH was aiming at, but they might be poking a bit of fun at it.

On the other hand, from what little anthropology I can remember from my undergrad days (hey, it was a long time ago, ok?), it is an almost universal human impulse to decorate oneself with beautiful things, whatever the social/cultural purpose.

 

[sallyca]

Couldn't have said it better! I agree that the petting and the smelling and the dreaming of new bags and the rush of pleasure I get from picking up a beautiful bag comfort me tremendously. As does the conversation and support here at tpf.

 

[gingeybear]

So I found myself typing a response..to Syb, Jenni[, Fafnir..et al/B]...and then realized that I was getting all analytical..blah blah blahddy blah...don't ask..between antropology, creative writing, sociology and my love of all things Diane Arbus I did not want to subject all of you to "gingey as a theorist". So...I do need to edit it down.

Allow me to post a bit of it please (see this is a bit..just imagine how I took the ball and went running with it..crikey...Jenni dear....YIKES!)..at least my take on this melding of culture and art as a social commentary..perhaps a bit of Toni thumbing her nose at the fashion arbeiters' declartion of it bags, as well as conformity while spending money on worshiping..stuff.

FWIW.... the emperor was nude and it took a child who was not a slave to fashion and who didn't fear retaliation to speak the truth. If we step back and look at ourselves and what we objectify as necessary and elevate to the realms of "must have" or "the it bag" and mindlessly and slavishly follow whatever a so called guru, such as Anna Wintour, proclaims as the next best thing that will bestow upon us instant cache, then we too in some ways are worshipping and fetishizing objects of no intrinsic value other than what has been ordained so by "she who must be obeyed".

We all view fashion through our own critical lens, we sometimes forget that we fetishize or worship objects of desire and are reluctant to march to the beat of a different drummer. That is exactly the opposite of what HH's design credo is all about. There is no "it bag of the season", no following trends or dictating silouhettes and although I am wondering about the absence of certain colors..so be it. Toni is somewhat of a cultural and artistic maven and magpie and a sorceress who can take the oddest concepts and make them work..at least most of the time.

I learned in anthro that some cargo cults adhere to the belief that cargo-bearing conveyances can be summoned magically or appear as a gift from the gods to bring goods and money. The practice is based on the native perception of the ‘white man’s" power and technology and that ideally roles should be reversed allowing Western wealth and material possessions to be redistributed. (Ah..Toni maybe this is what you are trying to tell us?)

But why meld juxtapose Diana Arbus with cargo cults? Perhaps due to the fact that Arbus' family was in the rag trade, the fur business in fact; (talk about luxury items). She rejected their values and lifestyle. As a photographer, she did did not pose her subjects, she somehow 'magicked" them into inviting her into their homes and waited to capture the moment when her subjects fully expressed their disabilty or oddity.

Arbus didn't flinch from showing us the truth. Again, perhaps she is analogous to the child who exposes (yes, pun intended) the emperor's new clothes since Diane Arbus exposed what at that point in America's history were the people who were often insitutionalized or hidden from sight. (Just to refer back to this idea that was thrown out here.)

As far as relevence to fashion and conformity, Arbus was a disillusioned fashion photographer, who did not distance herself from her subjects and prided herself on exposing our fears of anything different and threatening. Perhaps the fact that Arbus rejected all that was pretty, contrived and false about fashion is why Toni admires her work.

I could go out on a limb and stretch this a bit, and theorize that this Fall's collection is Toni's way of poking fun of everyone including herself to a certain extent by melding cargo cults' perception of things that are ordinary household obhects as being gifts from the gods. Furthermore, Susan Sontag wrote the definitive essay on Arbus and basically accused her of nihilism..."Arbus's photographs, undercut politics ... by suggesting a world in which everybody is alien, hopelessly isolated, immobilized in mechanical, crippled identities and relationships." Perhaps that too is the message here..a theme of isolation, and what is or is not conformity.

Toni realizes that she too in a way has to conform a wee bit and like Arbuswomen who follow the cult of sameness in fashion, no matter how expensive and who all manage to look the same despite the amount of money that is spent. I for one, and now that I know many of you, you as well, buy what we love for exactly the opposite reason. I know I enjoy every HH bag that I have kept because the are classics in their own way and will not be passe next year or the next.

See what I mean..all of this based on Fall '09..now..are we gonna get smacked for getting all intellectual on a forum that's supposed to be light and fluffy..Swanky..please forgive me..I know I have sinned yet again..I'll ratchet it down.

See..blah blah blahddy blah blah..yikes.

Over and out..over and out..and now..for something completely different...LOL

 

[Sybaryte]

Thank you all for participating in this thread! I seem to be fascinated by marketing these days but you never know what others will find interesting.

OK...back to Jenn's first response. I put Cargo Cult and the Iskia in the same category because HH is in the same position on both...a superficial dilettante using tribal characteristics...artistic inspiration or simply as a marketing tool? As you mentioned, HH provided no real information or history about that "inspiration." The HH lookbook went no further than the first paragraph on Wikipedia to define Cargo Cult.

This trivializes the cultures they purportedly are using for inspiration...and insults their customers who are paying good money for trinkets. I like meat on my bones. In on the joke? I feel like a peasant who is not at all amused by my queen dressing up as a Shepherdess. FWIW, I've come to the conclusion that as much as I may like some of their product, I don't really like Toni or Ben. And ultimately, "you can't expect to wield supreme executive power just because some watery tart threw a sword at you."

That's my inspiration.

 

[fafnir]

"watery tart", indeed! here's my inspiration:

 

[gingeybear]

Syb dear. I hear you.

Just in case I wasn't being clear..and please don't be insulted anyone..I adore you all..I'm just tired of "artistes" and their visions...especially since my focus in sociology is often on cultural and religious misconceptions and perceptions.

My discourse was really tongue in cheek because I can't tell you how many lectures I've sat through where I knew the prof or guest speaker was FOS and was talking down to us. See, what many designers do is BS with the best of them..truly I can do the same..as can anyone who is literate and well read...and "cultured". There's a difference between being intelligent and being a pseudo-intellectual..isn't there?

FWIW..we are for the most part a well rounded, educated, intelligent bunch of females here..it wouldn't take that much of a collaborative or individual effort to could come up with some weird concept for an accessory line...why not the Whirling Dervishes of Turkey, Sweeny Todd, and the The Magic Flute?

After all didn't Gaultier do a line that parsing and exaggerating Hassidic garments in 1993 (see below) which many found horribly offensive regardless of how he defined his concept? Didn't St. Laurent do an hommage to African tribalism? Derivation in fashion is all a game after all. As I said in my post..blah blah blahddy blah..esoteric,eclectic and oddball references and all.

You go girl. I love how you tell it like it is even though some might disagree. In fact..I sometimes wonder if HH believes we don't "get it"...but we really do..especially so many of us here..there has to be a line in the sand doesn't there? But who will draw it and where will it be?

"Listen, strange women lyin' in ponds distributin' swords is no basis for a system of government! Supreme executive power derives from a
mandate from the masses, not from some farcicial aquatic ceremony!

"Oh but if I went 'round sayin' I was Emperor, just because some moistened bink lobbed a scimitar at me, they'd put me away!"

So Syb...leaving MP...and going back to the fairy tale, are you she who has pointed out that the Empress might be exposed? Amigas, don't be harsh..or else..I will join our Syb and say(Go Dennis Go):

"Oh, what a giveaway! Did you hear that? Did you hear that, eh? That's what I'm on about! Did you see him repressin' me? You saw it, didn't you?"

Nope..free forum here..no repressing going on if I can help it.

XOXO
gingey

 

[missangelina]

Lots of interesting ideas and smart ladies here! Watery tart. LOL

I can't help but focus on Arbus, for some reason. Gingey - do you really think Arbus rejected all that was pretty? I find beauty in much of her work, that work that others see as ugly (my husband included - he's like, "Why do we have these books?" Sally Mann, too, Jenni!), and feel that a definition of "beauty" is at the heart of, possibly, everything in life, and is unique to each individual. To me, beauty is not shallow or "skin deep," but is part of every element on the planet. Each has his/her own definition and either avoids or is attracted to images, objects, people -- but I think Arbus was kind of saying, in reference to those images/people that we might normally avoid: "Is this really ugly? Or is it unique? And isn't that, somehow, beautiful?" I think there's beauty in the eyes of each of her subjects, trite as that may sound to you!

This collection is a gift from the deities for hunters and gatherers of the unique. Good Lord. I think that's a bit of a stretch for anyone's sense of humor. It is an irritating premise, even taken lightly (as I do). Those models eating chocolates in the bathroom are a nauseating distance from real life. I feel disoriented when I look at those photos, and come away thinking they are meant for a much different audience than Arbus'! LOL. I see many complaints on this board regarding HH's photography, and maybe it's just too "couture" for most of us to imagine IRL - is that why we love our own photos of the bags so much?? I really like their "IRL" campaign, BTW, and I told them!

Sorry if this is disjointed... I'm constantly interrupted by my own real life (i.e., 3 elves and a dog). My kids can't find any clean clothes. How's that for fashion?

 

[kate83675]

I finally had time to go back and read the second page of the a/w Look Book and it just sounds ridiculous. "verges on the mystical and unsettling" along with "drawing on the magical thinking, religious rituals and practices of the original cargo cults of remote pacific (sic) islands...the mood is dark, otherworldly and quirky." and "colors of ethereal mist and fog"

Considering those statements Harry Potter would have been a more appropriate reference, or Merlin and King Arthur's court.

"This collection is a gift from the deities for hunters and gatherers of the unique." Huh?

I'm going to agree with Syb, I don't like this theme, to me it "verges" on showing a lack of respect and condescension or, at best, a lack of understanding. Yes, we love our "pretties" and that's fine to like something just for being smooshie and smelling good but still, don't sell it this way.

 

[jennirane]

*sigh* I you guys!

 

[fafnir]

I guess I have a tolerant sense of humor, because I still find it pretty amusing. And also, if HH's reference to Cargo Cults gets a few people to look them up and learn something, then it's ok by me. We take our inspiration wherever we can get it.

MissA, I saw an exhibit by Sally Mann when I lived in Austin. It was at the Laguna Gloria Museum, which was a perfect setting (old, slightly decaying building, right along the river, with wildish park-like grounds). I really liked her work a lot.

 

[jennirane]

OMG Faf! You're the only other person I've ever met who knows LGM!! Isn't it amazing?? I had a torrid romance with a bad boy in Austin, and he took me there. When were you in Austin? I managed the Central Market Bookstop before B&N took it over... lived down south on Ben White.

 

[fafnir]

Heh, jenni, I attended the Museum Art School at Laguna Gloria, so that place was like a second home to me for a couple of years! I loved it. I lived there from '93 to 2001. I still miss Central Market. My DH would take the kids (they were really little then) to the playscape outside while I shopped.

Oh, we lived off of Westgate Blvd, past William Cannon. Talking about these streets makes me nostalgic...

 

[jennirane]

I was there from 94-96! I miss the gingerbread pancakes from Kerbey Lane!! And KGSR.

 

[fafnir]

My DH loved KGSR (I did too, but he was the music fanatic in our household). I still have 3 of their compilation cds... we must have passed each other somewhere! Did you ever go to the funky Christmas decorations on what, 37th?

Anyway, back to our scheduled programming...