Any tPFers in Armenia? Help needed w/post office re: thief buyer!

Thank you both for your replies. They encouraged me slightly to not give up, even though I feel really defeated. :flowers: I will continue to call Paypal and be a thorn in their side until someone does the right thing here. I've been a PayPal/ebay member for SO LONG with an excellent track record. To be screwed over like this really hurts. I'll call PayPal again today and get a little more pushy.

I have filed a complaint with IC3 and I have let the buyer know this, even attaching the confirmation of receipt of complaint filing I received. I doubt this will be enough to rattle her. I've been very matter-of-fact in my communications with her. Forcing myself to remain non-emotional in my emails.

Again, I'm pretty certain Armenian Post got her signature. I've received an email from them saying this today:

Dear Customer,

We would like to inform you, that on the basis of your e-mail we don't have the authority to provide information with the recipient's signature, to do this you should complete an inquiry form or submit an application form(in English) after our Chief Executive Officer Haik Avagyan.

But again, I am unable to get them to provide me with a form so far. The Haypost website has some pages translated to English, but none of the forms are, so it's been very, very frustrating.

Thanks to all who have chimed in.

You can use google translate to translate their inquiry form (that you can download in pdf format) at this link:

http://translate.google.com/?tr=f&hl=en

It is still difficult to understand, but you can try to make sense of it.
 
No, International Priority doesn't require a signature; I don't think you can even insure it.

I'm not familiar with Haypost, so maybe they got a signature anyway? You can keep calling PP to see if you can find someone who will help, but without the signature, there may be no way to get your money back from the buyer.

I would certainly post her eBay ID so that she can be added to people's BBLs though.

Just to clarify - you can insure I. Priority to SOME countries, but not all. For example, a couple of years ago you could insure it with packages for the UK ; now you can't. You have to ask or check online.
 
You can use google translate to translate their inquiry form (that you can download in pdf format) at this link:



http://translate.google.com/?tr=f&hl=en



It is still difficult to understand, but you can try to make sense of it.


Thanks for this. I had no idea you could use this for PDFs.

I called PP again, and this time got another person willing to look into the case notes and willing to do stuff to help. I gave him the USPS case number again and he said he was going to call them himself to see if he could get some information on the status of the case. I have emailed USPS customer service, but they have not responded. I let him know that I opened up a complaint with IC3 and he said that was good. He asked for the number, but I was driving and he said I could supply it later. He said he'd reopen the appeal. I'm not too hopeful at the moment, but I'll try to get some info from Haypost or USPS in the meantime.
 
Oh that's a shame. I know PP made my buyer pay as the buyer told me their account was now in the negative (and I hope flagged their account as the letter from the Post Office confirmed the parcel had been delivered just before the claim closed so showed that the buyer was being slightly less than honest!)

In my case I got a refund from ebay. Yeah it's pretty annoying she got to keep both money ans the item but I'm glad I was able to get my money back.

OP, keep calling PP and try to get more information from the Armenian postal service.
Do they have a free toll/customer service number? I would try to call them and ask for someone who speaks English. I called USPS from EU via Skype and it's very cheap.
 
Thanks for this. I had no idea you could use this for PDFs.

I called PP again, and this time got another person willing to look into the case notes and willing to do stuff to help. I gave him the USPS case number again and he said he was going to call them himself to see if he could get some information on the status of the case. I have emailed USPS customer service, but they have not responded. I let him know that I opened up a complaint with IC3 and he said that was good. He asked for the number, but I was driving and he said I could supply it later. He said he'd reopen the appeal. I'm not too hopeful at the moment, but I'll try to get some info from Haypost or USPS in the meantime.


Very glad that you have even a little good news on this- best of luck!
 
No, International Priority doesn't require a signature; I don't think you can even insure it.

I'm not familiar with Haypost, so maybe they got a signature anyway? You can keep calling PP to see if you can find someone who will help, but without the signature, there may be no way to get your money back from the buyer.

I would certainly post her eBay ID so that she can be added to people's BBLs though.
No, International Priority doesn't require a signature; I don't think you can even insure it.

I'm not familiar with Haypost, so maybe they got a signature anyway? You can keep calling PP to see if you can find someone who will help, but without the signature, there may be no way to get your money back from the buyer.

I would certainly post her eBay ID so that she can be added to people's BBLs though.


Actually you can even insure First class International Packages with U-Pic...

and some countries require a signature for Priority International packages...
If I receive a Priority Package from the USA, I have to sign for it....
If it has to be picked up from the postal hub, I have to show my ID and
sign for it.....

If my husband is going to pick it up, I have to sign the paper, and
he has to bring MY ID and HIS ID...
and he also has to sign for it.....

This is for the postal category right above First Class.... That is the only one I don't have to sign for......
 
Actually you can even insure First class International Packages with U-Pic...

and some countries require a signature for Priority International packages...
If I receive a Priority Package from the USA, I have to sign for it....
If it has to be picked up from the postal hub, I have to show my ID and
sign for it.....

If my husband is going to pick it up, I have to sign the paper, and
he has to bring MY ID and HIS ID...
and he also has to sign for it.....

This is for the postal category right above First Class.... That is the only one I don't have to sign for......

I mean that when you go to USPS to purchase mailing services, you can't insure Priority or request signature confirmation for most international countries; you can only do that with Express or GXG. And even if you have to sign for it in-country, it won't update that way on the USPS tracking site.
 
So, I have some news, but I hesitate to be too positive about anything. This is paypal after all, and since any reimbursement at this point is going to come from their deep (but tight) pockets, I wouldn't be surprised if they found a way to deny me again. After Haypost told me that they couldn't release a copy of her signature unless USPS requested it or I appealed to their CEO, and after calling USPS and having them tell me that they have reached out to Haypost several times with no response, I emailed Haypost AGAIN with the USPS case number and the information that they have been requesting delivery info from Haypost and not receiving a response, they FINALLY emailed me a scan of the signed documents. A small miracle, but will it be good enough? Who knows? I called paypal AGAIN and was told an appeal had not yet been opened as they wouldn't open another appeal at this point without signature information, but the agent seemed sympathetic and willing to help so she gave me the number to fax the Proof of Delivery. I warned her that it was in Armenian and it was impossible to tell what it says for the most part, but it does have the tracking number on it and they highlighted the date and signature line. I sincerely hope this will finally be over and resolved in my favor, but, again, I'm not getting too excited yet. They've found ways to shoot me down every time I come up with something. I still can't believe they closed the case so quickly to begin with. ::sigh:: :nogood:
 
Hi OP,

So sorry you are going through this. I can read Armenian and can help with that. Also I have family in Armenia and lots of experience shipping to Armenia. PM me if you'd like.
 
Hi OP,

So sorry you are going through this. I can read Armenian and can help with that. Also I have family in Armenia and lots of experience shipping to Armenia. PM me if you'd like.

You are so sweet, AuthenticLux. Thank you! But actually, Haypost has been extremely helpful to me and have actually emailed me a scan of the actual document that she signed. 2 different Paypal agents told me they were incredulous that I was able to get this, as most people cannot obtain this information. So, I must give a huge kudos to Armenian post, as they have been great to me. Very helpful.

This is finally over for me. I'm not totally satisfied with the outcome, but here is what happened since my last post:

I called paypal when I got the signature doc and they had me fax the document to them, which I knew wouldn't fly, as it wouldn't be very legible, but I did. Paypal emailed me the next day to say they were denying the appeal based on the fact that no signature was available online. I did not accept this and called AGAIN. I let the agent know that I had a perfectly clear scan and that this buyer has signed for this item, she has the item and has her money back and I would like the appeal opened again. He gave me an email address to send the scan to, and he looked at it and said it was perfectly clear, he was very surprised I was able to get the document, as he said most people cannot, and saw no reason why an appeal wouldn't be granted in my favor, and it should happen within 48 hours. So I waited and heard nothing for 3 days. I called AGAIN and spoke with another agent who said there wasn't an appeal open currently, but after looking through the notes and seeing the last docs I sent in (again, she was shocked that I got the signature provided to me, and she was very sympathetic to all the crap I've been through), she said she'd make sure she'd open the appeal and, again, she was sure it would be granted in my favor. She said I would get a decision in 24-48 hours (again), but that she'd send it to escalations for review and she'd follow up with me herself at the end of the day, which she did.

Today I finally hear back from paypal saying they were granting my appeal! Great, right? WRONG. It says that my appeal was granted, but that I had to follow up with the buyer to get my refund! WTH?! I already went through all this with the buyer and she refused to communicate after canceling my invoice and telling me that paypal never refunded her. So, I call paypal again and get an agent who had no idea what she was talking about and said that my appeal was denied because I didn't have a signature. I explained that not only did I give paypal the signature, but they said they did grant my appeal. She then gave me nonsense about needing the buyer to refund me since paypal refunded her and I refused to accept this and asked for a supervisor. After holding for a long time, I spoke with a supervisor who, after looking at the case and my account status and putting me on hold for a long time (again), he said paypal would give me a "one time" credit of the amount I was due, because I was a good customer for many years. He recommended that I get a signature in the future, and I pointed out that I already provided the signature to paypal. He said "Um...oh." and confirmed that the buyer still gets to keep her refund. I can't believe she's getting away with this. I am going to keep the IC3 case against her (which I doubt will go anywhere given the relatively small dollar amount) just in case. I'd love to see her have to give the funds back to paypal. What a jerk.

Hope this helps others here in the future. Thanks to everyone for their advice and well-wishes! :flowers:
 
You are so sweet, AuthenticLux. Thank you! But actually, Haypost has been extremely helpful to me and have actually emailed me a scan of the actual document that she signed. 2 different Paypal agents told me they were incredulous that I was able to get this, as most people cannot obtain this information. So, I must give a huge kudos to Armenian post, as they have been great to me. Very helpful.

This is finally over for me. I'm not totally satisfied with the outcome, but here is what happened since my last post:

I called paypal when I got the signature doc and they had me fax the document to them, which I knew wouldn't fly, as it wouldn't be very legible, but I did. Paypal emailed me the next day to say they were denying the appeal based on the fact that no signature was available online. I did not accept this and called AGAIN. I let the agent know that I had a perfectly clear scan and that this buyer has signed for this item, she has the item and has her money back and I would like the appeal opened again. He gave me an email address to send the scan to, and he looked at it and said it was perfectly clear, he was very surprised I was able to get the document, as he said most people cannot, and saw no reason why an appeal wouldn't be granted in my favor, and it should happen within 48 hours. So I waited and heard nothing for 3 days. I called AGAIN and spoke with another agent who said there wasn't an appeal open currently, but after looking through the notes and seeing the last docs I sent in (again, she was shocked that I got the signature provided to me, and she was very sympathetic to all the crap I've been through), she said she'd make sure she'd open the appeal and, again, she was sure it would be granted in my favor. She said I would get a decision in 24-48 hours (again), but that she'd send it to escalations for review and she'd follow up with me herself at the end of the day, which she did.

Today I finally hear back from paypal saying they were granting my appeal! Great, right? WRONG. It says that my appeal was granted, but that I had to follow up with the buyer to get my refund! WTH?! I already went through all this with the buyer and she refused to communicate after canceling my invoice and telling me that paypal never refunded her. So, I call paypal again and get an agent who had no idea what she was talking about and said that my appeal was denied because I didn't have a signature. I explained that not only did I give paypal the signature, but they said they did grant my appeal. She then gave me nonsense about needing the buyer to refund me since paypal refunded her and I refused to accept this and asked for a supervisor. After holding for a long time, I spoke with a supervisor who, after looking at the case and my account status and putting me on hold for a long time (again), he said paypal would give me a "one time" credit of the amount I was due, because I was a good customer for many years. He recommended that I get a signature in the future, and I pointed out that I already provided the signature to paypal. He said "Um...oh." and confirmed that the buyer still gets to keep her refund. I can't believe she's getting away with this. I am going to keep the IC3 case against her (which I doubt will go anywhere given the relatively small dollar amount) just in case. I'd love to see her have to give the funds back to paypal. What a jerk.

Hope this helps others here in the future. Thanks to everyone for their advice and well-wishes! :flowers:


Glad you got your money back, but shame on PayPal for jerking you around and allowing fraud!
 
You are so sweet, AuthenticLux. Thank you! But actually, Haypost has been extremely helpful to me and have actually emailed me a scan of the actual document that she signed. 2 different Paypal agents told me they were incredulous that I was able to get this, as most people cannot obtain this information. So, I must give a huge kudos to Armenian post, as they have been great to me. Very helpful.

This is finally over for me. I'm not totally satisfied with the outcome, but here is what happened since my last post:

I called paypal when I got the signature doc and they had me fax the document to them, which I knew wouldn't fly, as it wouldn't be very legible, but I did. Paypal emailed me the next day to say they were denying the appeal based on the fact that no signature was available online. I did not accept this and called AGAIN. I let the agent know that I had a perfectly clear scan and that this buyer has signed for this item, she has the item and has her money back and I would like the appeal opened again. He gave me an email address to send the scan to, and he looked at it and said it was perfectly clear, he was very surprised I was able to get the document, as he said most people cannot, and saw no reason why an appeal wouldn't be granted in my favor, and it should happen within 48 hours. So I waited and heard nothing for 3 days. I called AGAIN and spoke with another agent who said there wasn't an appeal open currently, but after looking through the notes and seeing the last docs I sent in (again, she was shocked that I got the signature provided to me, and she was very sympathetic to all the crap I've been through), she said she'd make sure she'd open the appeal and, again, she was sure it would be granted in my favor. She said I would get a decision in 24-48 hours (again), but that she'd send it to escalations for review and she'd follow up with me herself at the end of the day, which she did.

Today I finally hear back from paypal saying they were granting my appeal! Great, right? WRONG. It says that my appeal was granted, but that I had to follow up with the buyer to get my refund! WTH?! I already went through all this with the buyer and she refused to communicate after canceling my invoice and telling me that paypal never refunded her. So, I call paypal again and get an agent who had no idea what she was talking about and said that my appeal was denied because I didn't have a signature. I explained that not only did I give paypal the signature, but they said they did grant my appeal. She then gave me nonsense about needing the buyer to refund me since paypal refunded her and I refused to accept this and asked for a supervisor. After holding for a long time, I spoke with a supervisor who, after looking at the case and my account status and putting me on hold for a long time (again), he said paypal would give me a "one time" credit of the amount I was due, because I was a good customer for many years. He recommended that I get a signature in the future, and I pointed out that I already provided the signature to paypal. He said "Um...oh." and confirmed that the buyer still gets to keep her refund. I can't believe she's getting away with this. I am going to keep the IC3 case against her (which I doubt will go anywhere given the relatively small dollar amount) just in case. I'd love to see her have to give the funds back to paypal. What a jerk.

Hope this helps others here in the future. Thanks to everyone for their advice and well-wishes! :flowers:

Very glad that you got your money back! It's ridiculous that PP lets buyers get away with this. When they have all of the proof in front of them that a buyer is attempting to defraud a seller, it floors me that they still don't really care.