What would you want to know about men?

[Libertine]

Originally Posted by HappyGrl2008

Without getting too personal, but why did you think she hated you? I'm a very shy person and I often think people mistake my shyness for being arrogant....

Complicated story. Basically, I dated her ex-girlfriend after her ex-girlfriend broke up with her.

But don't worry about coming across as somewhat arrogant. To be honest, a bit of arrogance in women is often quite attractive.

Originally Posted by HappyGrl2008

Once again without getting too personal, how come he didn't notice her at all?? They were obviously a good match, so why didn't he see that before she approached him??

They'd never really met before.

[HappyGrl2008]

Originally Posted by ~Fabulousity~

dag girl would you like some knee pads to go with that LOL! I was just kidding don't crucify me...

keep on kidding, Fab!!

[HappyGrl2008]

Originally Posted by Libertine

Complicated story. Basically, I dated her ex-girlfriend after her ex-girlfriend broke up with her.

I guess that is a bit complicated!

[~Fabulousity~]

Originally Posted by HappyGrl2008

keep on kidding, Fab!!

[newlywed2007]

My mother has always told me "don't let the guy choose you, you choose the guy!" A very modern approach to dating from a woman who grew up in a conservative Asian country and married her first boyfriend I used to be really shy when I was younger and would wait for the guy to make the first move but my attitude has changed since. I believe in equal opportunity dating and hate double standards. If a guy can do it, a girl can do it too. If you see what you like, go for it!

[jayjay77]

Libertine -- I love your comments.

Here is a question from me -- Several years ago I had a "Guy Friend." We did a lot of fun things together and he was really sweet, took me out for my birthday etc, but never really put the moves on me. I could never figure out if he was just shy or perhaps gay? When I finally almost worked up the courage to make the move myself, I met Charming Guy who turned out to be Not So Charming Guy...but Charming Guy swept me off my feet -- we were soon living together, planning to get married -- before I finally saw that he was really a bad guy and got out of the relationship.

After a while I e-mailed Guy Friend to say hello and got no response. I then ran into him at a dinner and he suggested we get together. I was working on a big project at work, so he suggested that I e-mail him when the project was done. I did but again no response. I have run into him again and he was friendly but did not suggest getting together. Maybe he now has a girlfriend? If so I'm happy for him. Maybe he's hurt that I picked Not So Charming Guy over him sort of? I'm thinking of contacting him one more time and then three strikes I'm out... your thoughts? ... and he's pretty geeky and notoriously hard to get hold of -- the absent minded professor type -- with a normal guy I wouldn't give it another try, but with him maybe..

[LSnyder]

Why do men think that we are absolutely infatuated with everything they like and when we start talking about something we like they just cut us off and change the subject? Even if it is not about money, relationship, children, etc.

[Liz_x3]

Please explain this for me. X is very eager through texts for us to hang out. "We should hang out sometime." "We should leave together."

But then he doesn't make much of an effort to actually physically hang out.

What's up with that?

[mellecyn]

Originally Posted by newlywed2007

My mother has always told me "don't let the guy choose you, you choose the guy!" A very modern approach to dating from a woman who grew up in a conservative Asian country and married her first boyfriend I used to be really shy when I was younger and would wait for the guy to make the first move but my attitude has changed since. I believe in equal opportunity dating and hate double standards. If a guy can do it, a girl can do it too. If you see what you like, go for it!

Of course, but still you choose the guy between the ones who want you.
And there are lots of subtle ways to make that happen, you just help a bit by initiating (if the guy is too shy for instance). I don´t believe in women doing the job of chasing after the man. Never worked in my book, if the guy hasn´t shown any interest yet, it won´t work.

[Charles]

Originally Posted by HappyGrl2008

what a relief!! a few years ago I thought that this book was true for a while....which made me a little depressed!! thankfully I never bought it.

I disagree. I think that book has tons of useful insight.

Libertine, I think you're leading these girls down the wrong path.

Here's what I think, regarding asking men out and them being interested, etc, etc. Is it cool to ask a guy out..maybe. Some men are fine with it, some would rather take control. Just like anything with dating, this isn't an across the board rule.
This is what I think will yield the most positive results. If you like a guy, even if you just met him, watch him a bit. If he's looking at the ground, acting shy and scared, then perhaps you might need to take a bit of control. However, if he's confident looking and outgoing, I'd lay back and let him come to you. Now, that doesn't mean you don't make a move of some sort. Put yourself in his line of sight and let him know you want him to talk to you. Smile at him, keep your body language open towards him, etc. If he's interested, he'll approach.

Honestly, I think most guys tend to act like the latter example. If you let them know you're interested, he'll ask you out. If he doesn't ask you out, he's probably not interested. Most guys know their role here. Most guys know they need to make the first move if they're interested. Most guys are ok with being shot down. We don't like it, but we're used to it.

[Libertine]

Originally Posted by Charles

I disagree. I think that book has tons of useful insight. Libertine, I think you're leading these girls down the wrong path. Here's what I think, regarding asking men out and them being interested, etc, etc. Is it cool to ask a guy out..maybe. Some men are fine with it, some would rather take control. Just like anything with dating, this isn't an across the board rule. This is what I think will yield the most positive results. If you like a guy, even if you just met him, watch him a bit. If he's looking at the ground, acting shy and scared, then perhaps you might need to take a bit of control. However, if he's confident looking and outgoing, I'd lay back and let him come to you. Now, that doesn't mean you don't make a move of some sort. Put yourself in his line of sight and let him know you want him to talk to you. Smile at him, keep your body language open towards him, etc. If he's interested, he'll approach. Honestly, I think most guys tend to act like the latter example. If you let them know you're interested, he'll ask you out. If he doesn't ask you out, he's probably not interested. Most guys know their role here. Most guys know they need to make the first move if they're interested. Most guys are ok with being shot down. We don't like it, but we're used to it.

I'm sorry, but what you're saying is, imho, exactly the wrong path.

First, here's what that poll I posted on another forum stands at now:

Quote:

View Poll Results: Do you like it when women ask you out? Love it 31 81.58% Hate it 2 5.26% Meh 3 7.89% I'm a woman or gay 2 5.26% Voters: 38.

In the results you posted from your own poll, the percentage of guys who didn't like it was slightly higher... at 6.25%. Only a third of the guys who, in that poll, said they always waited for the woman to ask them out.

So the first thing we can firmly establish here is this: most men by far don't mind being asked out by a woman.

Now, on to the part where you say a guy will ask a woman out if he's interested.

Here's a quick overview of women I encounter on a somewhat typical day, which includes going to classes, going to the grocery store, going to the gym and having a few drinks with friends:

Quote:

- University. I'll likely see several hundreds of women here (med school is around 80% women here), several dozen will look at me or smile at me, and I'll casually talk with maybe half a dozen. - Grocery store. I'll see 50-100 women here, several of whom will look at me or smile at me. Most often, I'll meet a few I (vaguely) know, who will say hi or talk with me for a minute or two. - Gym. Same as grocery store. - Bar. Same as grocery store.

So, on a regular day, I easily see several hundreds of at least somewhat attractive women in the 20-30 age range. I'll usually casually talk with at least a dozen of them, and several dozens will say hi or smile at me. Med school inflates my numbers (though no more than for guys in university who do anything in a female-dominated field), but even without that, it reaches hundreds a day.

When I was single, I'd usually ask out one girl a week at most, and that's around the same number most of the single men I know reach. So, for a woman who's looking to meet a man, the math simply doesn't look good.

Besides, what's there to lose for a woman by asking guys out? We've already established that most men don't mind it. So yes, there's the chance of rejection, but it's a whole lot better than simply waiting for things to happen.

In my opinion, exactly two groups of people benefit from the whole "women should wait for men to ask them out thing": men in the "pick up artist" scene (because they usually ask 50+ women a week out), and people who sell dating books.

[juneping]

I just think two of you are different when approach women.
One is more comfortable and one is just more careful

[Libertine]

Originally Posted by juneping

I just think two of you are different when approach women. One is more comfortable and one is just more careful

It has little to do with being careful or comfortable, actually.

It's just that time is limited, and there are roughly 3.4 billion women in the world. If I was single and approached every woman I'd consider attractive enough to justify getting to know her better, it would take up literally all my time. And I'm fairly sure that goes for most men - at least excluding those living in very small towns and those working in IT.

If a woman follows the traditional advice of waiting for men to make the first move, she largely limits herself to dating men within her own social circle (who have gotten to know her already), and men who approach lots of women.

But if a woman is confident enough to make the first move herself when she's interested in someone, she immediately expands her options a thousandfold.

The truth is that regardless of your gender, taking initiative is far more likely to result in success than simply waiting for something to happen. And that goes for virtually every aspect of life, not just dating.

Compare it to looking for a job. No matter how great you are, simply posting your resume on a job board isn't likely to get you your dream job. To get noticed, you need to take initiative, stand out from the crowd.

The same goes for dating. If you simply wait for mr/ms right to approach you, you probably won't get noticed. But if you take initiative and make sure you do get noticed, there's a much better chance of people realizing you're exactly what they're looking for.

[Charles]

Originally Posted by Libertine

I'm sorry, but what you're saying is, imho, exactly the wrong path. First, here's what that poll I posted on another forum stands at now: In the results you posted from your own poll, the percentage of guys who didn't like it was slightly higher... at 6.25%. Only a third of the guys who, in that poll, said they always waited for the woman to ask them out. So the first thing we can firmly establish here is this: most men by far don't mind being asked out by a woman. Now, on to the part where you say a guy will ask a woman out if he's interested. Here's a quick overview of women I encounter on a somewhat typical day, which includes going to classes, going to the grocery store, going to the gym and having a few drinks with friends: So, on a regular day, I easily see several hundreds of at least somewhat attractive women in the 20-30 age range. I'll usually casually talk with at least a dozen of them, and several dozens will say hi or smile at me. Med school inflates my numbers (though no more than for guys in university who do anything in a female-dominated field), but even without that, it reaches hundreds a day. When I was single, I'd usually ask out one girl a week at most, and that's around the same number most of the single men I know reach. So, for a woman who's looking to meet a man, the math simply doesn't look good. Besides, what's there to lose for a woman by asking guys out? We've already established that most men don't mind it. So yes, there's the chance of rejection, but it's a whole lot better than simply waiting for things to happen. In my opinion, exactly two groups of people benefit from the whole "women should wait for men to ask them out thing": men in the "pick up artist" scene (because they usually ask 50+ women a week out), and people who sell dating books.

Your numbers seem to overlook history. I think most women have met their mate by not asking their mate out, rather their mate asking them out. Correct me if I'm wrong. However, given my poll, I think that most men tend to like the idea that they took control and asked their mate out (I could post the numbers, but I think that's overkill). Now, are there exceptions, sure, but please don't try to tell these women that they need to step up and make the first move. That's just leading them into a lot of hurt and time wasted.
Like I've said, the vast majority of men know that it's their job to ask women out and if they're truly interested in a woman, they will ask her out.

[GirlFriday]

I know most guys love it when girls ask them out, but I was never interested "most" guys. "He's Just Not That Into You" really helped me read guys better. Yes, some guys are just shy, but I wanted a guy that was sure and confident in what he wanted. The book won't lead you to players if you have the discernment and good judgement to know what a player is when you see it.

I know plenty of shy guys that take the plunge and ask a girl out when he really wants to. I don't think it's wrong for a girl to ask a guy out, but I think it's wrong for a girl OR guy to keep continuing a relationship with a person that's not making any effort. When you're in a relationship with someone that's not reciprocating and doing what it takes to be with you, then they're "just not that into you."