I have a secret.....

[exotikittenx]

I think you are doing the right thing. In your heart, you know what is right. It would be wrong to stay in a marriage where there is no love. It's unfair to both you and your husband, and could be potentially unhealthy for your children. So I really wish you the best.

[lolitakali]

Originally Posted by twin53

i read this last night and thought of you: there are no failures in life, just lessons.

Not good...

one can also say, there are no murders/crime in this life, just lessons.

Liberty should only extend on courtesy to another being who respect that same courtesy of freedom back to another...

When another violate the others' freedom & liberty, that another should have his/her liberty & freedom forfeited from them as well (a.k.a. punishable crimes etc., by jail/penalties etc. etc.)

So if a parent failed to teach their child since young what is right & wrong & that child failed to see taking another's life as wrong... is just only a lesson unlearned??? No, its a bigger problem than only a lesson... it is a "wrong" / "mistakes" a.k.a. "regrets" (an a costly one) still, not an excuse as a "lesson" not taught.

So yes, there exists failures... some failures can even unfairly take away anothers most precious... life.

Most lessons can be re-learned and may not be too late...

Most regrets can never be even corrected, eg. that of a forfeited / ruined "life" (self or others).

[bagnshoofetish]

I have no advice to give - just want to give you a hug for being so honest. Life is not perfect. Lots of twists and turns and unexpectedness. I do hope you and your whole family find peace among all this. It can't be easy for any of you. You sound like you are handling things the best you can. I'm just so sorry you are going through this.

[GirlFriday]

Bag Ladie,

Maybe I just shouldn't write. I don't know...I don't want to have you be offended, but at the same time, I do think that someone should say something, even if it's something you don't want to hear, and even if it's something that won't change your mind.

Your post as really struck a cord with me. My Dad left my mom for the exact same reasons, and he regretted it. I wasn't going to write anything at first, but I've thought about it for awhile and thought maybe somebody should say something.

It seems like your husband is doing everything it takes to make it work, but you've already made up your mind to leave, so you're not really making all the effort you should. Yes, I'm sure you've made an effort, but how much effort have you really made with this other guy in the picture? You said you haven't been with your husband physically in years even though he wants to be intimate. To me, that doesn't seem like trying. And I think it is because of this other man. Even if he's out of the picture right now, you are still in love with him, so you think about him all the time. You want to be with him eventually, probably once the divorce is final. So not seeing him for a few months (or even a couple of years) isn't really going to take away those feelings. And honestly, not until you make the decision to never see him ever again, and commit to your marriage, does your current marriage even have a shot of making it (although you've already made your decision). And honestly, I think you should give it your best shot because you owe that to your husband AND your children.

I know that divorce IS necessary in some circumstances, but to leave a husband that loves you and rip up the lives of three children just because you want to be happy? I'll say it, it just sounds kind of selfish. Because it's more than just about you. Yes, children want their mother to be happy, but if they love their father, and see that he loves you and you're just not really giving anything back (and really not even trying to love him), they're not going to think, "well at least she's happy!" They're going to feel pretty crappy for their dad. I say you should try to love, because love is a feeling at first, and once those giddy feelings subside, it's an action. It's a choice to love someone.

This man that you're in love with, that you think is your soul mate, will not be so dreamy once you live with him for a few years, because you are infatuated with him now. And really, did you really never love your husband? You don't seem to sure about that. When someone says that they never loved someone, is that really always true? Did you really ONLY marry him because your parents liked him and you wanted to marry SOMEONE? There wasn't more there? Don't you remember why you found him attractive in the first place? Why you dated him in the first place? The reason I say this, is because with the other guy in the picture, your husband doesn't stand a chance. If you compare the two men, of COURSE this other guy is going to come out on top! You've never been married to him, you've never lived with him. He's totally dreamy compared to your husband who you've known and lived with and raised children with for the past 15 years. Even if you loved your husband it would be like like trying to compare apples and oranges when it comes to your feelings about them.

I say this knowing full well I don't know the WHOLE story, and that all of us think differently when it comes to divorce. I'm basing my opinion on just the information that was given. But when reading your posts, I don't see a good reason to divorce your husband, other than the fact that you're not happy. But see, nobody can make you happy but yourself. Not your husband, not this other guy. It's your decision.

I love your posts Bag Ladie, and I have respect for you, that's why I have to tell you what I think instead of just telling you how courageous you are. Yes, it will be hard to tell your family what your decision is, but once you're with this new guy, I don't know how enjoyable it will be to be with him knowing what you will have done to your husband and kids. Yes, kids shouldn't witness an unloving marriage, but you have the choice to love your husband! That's why I say, you owe it to your kids to give it your best effort.

Okay, Bag Ladie, I hope I didn't totally offend you. I'm just being honest. And I know I'll probably get totally flamed. But that's okay. We all feel differently about these subjects. I wish you the best.

[divalicioust]

Very tough situation, I wish you all the best.

[exotikittenx]

Interesting point GirlFriday. I also realize I don't know enough about the individual situation to have offered advice. I don't know what your relationship is like, BagLady, and if the man you are in love with has clouded your opinion of your husband making it impossible to love him. Anyway, I meant what I said in that I wish you the best, and I think you should put your children first. I don't know your situation, so I just hope you choose the situation that will be best for your children.

[JNH14]

As a teacher of 32 years-I see the daily results of divorce with my 8-9 year old students. It's NOT pretty and often heartbreaking when they come and cry about missing their dad or mom. Please consider counseling for them and yourself. This is a huge step to take-and once done-is final. I've always said that the best thing a husband can do for his children is love their mother. It sounds as if he's tried to do that-have you? I am not judging, but it seems that your love for the other guy has totally turned you away from even considering trying to make things work. I have been married for 29 years and it's been the toughest job I've ever had-some years are great, while others bite. It's taken a lot on both of our parts to remain committed even when we couldn't stand the sight of each other. Personally, I don't think there is anything wrong with your children seeing you have problems and then being able to make up. It prepares them for real life-because nobody's marriage is perfect. Just my two cents worth-really think this through-there's a lot at stake. You're three childrens' lives are going to change drastically.

[lolitakali]

Originally Posted by GirlFriday

Bag Ladie, Maybe I just shouldn't write. I don't know...I don't want to have you be offended, but at the same time, I do think that someone should say something, even if it's something you don't want to hear, and even if it's something that won't change your mind. Your post as really struck a cord with me. My Dad left my mom for the exact same reasons, and he regretted it. I wasn't going to write anything at first, but I've thought about it for awhile and thought maybe somebody should say something. It seems like your husband is doing everything it takes to make it work, but you've already made up your mind to leave, so you're not really making all the effort you should. Yes, I'm sure you've made an effort, but how much effort have you really made with this other guy in the picture? You said you haven't been with your husband physically in years even though he wants to be intimate. To me, that doesn't seem like trying. And I think it is because of this other man. Even if he's out of the picture right now, you are still in love with him, so you think about him all the time. You want to be with him eventually, probably once the divorce is final. So not seeing him for a few months (or even a couple of years) isn't really going to take away those feelings. And honestly, not until you make the decision to never see him ever again, and commit to your marriage, does your current marriage even have a shot of making it (although you've already made your decision). And honestly, I think you should give it your best shot because you owe that to your husband AND your children. I know that divorce IS necessary in some circumstances, but to leave a husband that loves you and rip up the lives of three children just because you want to be happy? I'll say it, it just sounds kind of selfish. Because it's more than just about you. Yes, children want their mother to be happy, but if they love their father, and see that he loves you and you're just not really giving anything back (and really not even trying to love him), they're not going to think, "well at least she's happy!" They're going to feel pretty crappy for their dad. I say you should try to love, because love is a feeling at first, and once those giddy feelings subside, it's an action. It's a choice to love someone. This man that you're in love with, that you think is your soul mate, will not be so dreamy once you live with him for a few years, because you are infatuated with him now. And really, did you really never love your husband? You don't seem to sure about that. When someone says that they never loved someone, is that really always true? Did you really ONLY marry him because your parents liked him and you wanted to marry SOMEONE? There wasn't more there? Don't you remember why you found him attractive in the first place? Why you dated him in the first place? The reason I say this, is because with the other guy in the picture, your husband doesn't stand a chance. If you compare the two men, of COURSE this other guy is going to come out on top! You've never been married to him, you've never lived with him. He's totally dreamy compared to your husband who you've known and lived with and raised children with for the past 15 years. Even if you loved your husband it would be like like trying to compare apples and oranges when it comes to your feelings about them. I say this knowing full well I don't know the WHOLE story, and that all of us think differently when it comes to divorce. I'm basing my opinion on just the information that was given. But when reading your posts, I don't see a good reason to divorce your husband, other than the fact that you're not happy. But see, nobody can make you happy but yourself. Not your husband, not this other guy. It's your decision. I love your posts Bag Ladie, and I have respect for you, that's why I have to tell you what I think instead of just telling you how courageous you are. Yes, it will be hard to tell your family what your decision is, but once you're with this new guy, I don't know how enjoyable it will be to be with him knowing what you will have done to your husband and kids. Yes, kids shouldn't witness an unloving marriage, but you have the choice to love your husband! That's why I say, you owe it to your kids to give it your best effort. Okay, Bag Ladie, I hope I didn't totally offend you. I'm just being honest. And I know I'll probably get totally flamed. But that's okay. We all feel differently about these subjects. I wish you the best.

Great opinion.

Grass isn't always greener on the other side, but then since we aren't God, we won't know... but still, there is such a thing called karma to deal with... great life is not "given" but rather "strived for", reward reaped after the right seed sown (but still no guarantees in life KWIM).

Another thing, there is only that 50/50 chance (errrr... if even that) that the other man can make you happy... or actually only that "self" can make "self" happy; relying on you hubby or the other man to make that self happy one is more than doomed for another disappointment in life.

Many says 2nd marriage is less likely to succeed than the 1st one... so think through before making that step:
http://www.emaxhealth.com/5/16381.html

I too have friends who took the easy way out for falling out of love with their ex.

Are many of them still single... yeap, they may have remarry to divorce again, still looking for the "other" who can make them happy / or the other they can "blame" their unhappiness on...

Do they have regrets, I am sure... but most would never tell. Its like a mistake they'd hate admitting they made; all about pride & ego you know.

Would they always encourage other people to divorce??? Hell yeah, misery always love company.

But of course there are others who should divorce for some serious mistakes like an abusive partner... I also know of 2 in my life. But, somehow it is in their mentality that they always go back towards that same "unhealthy" relationship; one of them, her own mother married an alcoholic husband who abused her, daughter likes the same trait in her dad I think.

Just to remember that like everything, its a cycle... why I dread having children in a society filled with 50% chances of divorces (plus out of wedlock mistakes; not judging but life isn't only lessons without failures, there exists mistakes & regrets filled without 2nd chances too).

Say if you came from a set of healthy parent (who believes in love) what is the chances society is going to give you in that partner who has divorced parents (35% - 50 plus %)??? In turn, what is that % of you having a child that have both these parents (you + 50/50% divorce rate partner) surviving in a healthy love marriage to pass this healthy marriage aspect & mentality so he/she can believe in love without divorces again??? What is the chances of him/her divorcing in turn even if he/she survive your own survival of a healthy love marriage w/o divorces looming into future????

KWIM??? Once the cycle starts, it is very hard to break out of that cycle... that is all. Once the pure gene pool is corrupted enough, that pure gene would become very scarce indeed.

But thats whats becoming the norm though... oh well, to each their own.

I'd still stick to my ideals even if imperfection is norm... at least I can tell my maker I did try for the ideal of perfection.

Still, best of luck BagLadie.

[bernz84]

I'm a little jaded when it comes to romance; I think a lot of people put high expectations in their relationships in that you will always be "in" love with your partner. And when you're not, you should just divorce because they're obviously not the "one" for you (which I also think is crap...there's no such thing as "the one" in my mind). In most cases, it's not always true; in the long run, you're not going to be in love with your spouse but you will always love him/her, like an equal partner and a best friend. There are a couple lucky exceptions, but again, for the most part it's not like that (at least, from what I've been told).

But I think that if the OP is really unhappy with the marriage situation, she should just leave. She has even stated that she would rather be alone than be with her husband; I think that stating that (in addition to being in therapy for a few months) means a lot more than simply leaving him for a new man (who isn't even going to be in the picture for a while). I don't know, for me personally, I wouldn't want someone to stick around for me if they didn't really love me...I'd feel kinda cheated and it would hurt my ego. The only criticism I have is that she stayed for this long, now with kids in tow...it would've been less complicated had she left a lot earlier sans kids. But then again, life can complicate matters.

To the OP: I wish you and the children the best.

[HauteMama]

I agree with GirlFriday. You have feelings for another man (you sing his praises here over and over, despite claiming this is only about you and your dh), and you have refused to have the talks or engage in intimacy with your husband. You are actively preventing yourself from having any feelings for him.

Personally, I do not believe in "soulmates". Had I not ever met my dh, could I have ever married and been happy? Yes. Are there people who potentially might have been a better fit for me? I suppose, but love is often about choice and marriage is often about choices. It seems, from where I sit (which may not be the best perspective, I'll admit), that you have made a choice not to love your husband and not to try to save your marriage. Love isn't always about romance and infatuation and being carried away by your feelings. It is about making the choice to see the good and overlook the bad; it is about making the choice not to sabotage your relationship by engaging in an affair.

I just wonder if you would be as "miserable" if you did NOT have the "greatest guy in the world" waiting for you and if you put 100% of your effort into building and securing the relationship with your dh. Doctors often suggest that people who have no desire for intimacy try to engage in it anyway, because they often become more enthusiastic as they proceed. I cannot help but think something similar might be true for your marriage, and that if you actually engaged in talks, intimacy and fun activities with your husband (without a lover in the wings), you might develop or recapture feelings for him.

I do not know you, and I cannot tell you you are wrong. But it just makes me sad that it sounds like your dh wants to try and you have already decided that you have no feelings for him and aren't even willing to work on trying to have feelings for him.

[Charles]

Originally Posted by lolitakali

Not good... one can also say, there are no murders/crime in this life, just lessons. Liberty should only extend on courtesy to another being who respect that same courtesy of freedom back to another... When another violate the others' freedom & liberty, that another should have his/her liberty & freedom forfeited from them as well (a.k.a. punishable crimes etc., by jail/penalties etc. etc.) So if a parent failed to teach their child since young what is right & wrong & that child failed to see taking another's life as wrong... is just only a lesson unlearned??? No, its a bigger problem than only a lesson... it is a "wrong" / "mistakes" a.k.a. "regrets" (an a costly one) still, not an excuse as a "lesson" not taught. So yes, there exists failures... some failures can even unfairly take away anothers most precious... life. Most lessons can be re-learned and may not be too late... Most regrets can never be even corrected, eg. that of a forfeited / ruined "life" (self or others).

Huh?

BagLadie (I'm not sure of your real name, so excuse me), I was an only child with parents who were "trying to work it out" for the whole time I was living with them. Sure, you have kids that are upset that their parents divorced, but I'm quite sure they're not aware of a marriage that's overrun with anger and resentment. I'm pretty sure my parents hated each other, but they stuck it out for my sake. So what did that mean for me? Arguments at 2 am in the morning, disrupting my sleep. Times when I had to step in front of my parents cause I thought they were going to grab a knife sitting on the table and try to stab each other. Living with two parents that aren't happy isn't fun.
When they spoke of divorce, I was thankful, cause I really thought it meant that both my dad and mom would be happy apart from each other, but it never happened. Eventually, I moved out, yet they still stayed in their dysfuntional marriage. It was sad, and I've gotten into fights with my mom about it, but that's not the point. The point is...kids, when they're young, don't know what's best for them, so yeah, when they're 8 or 10, they might think a divirce sucks hard, but they don't know what it's like to be a child in a loveless marriage. They don't know how it feels for parents to stay together just for them. I'm sure if they did, they'd change their stance, just a bit.
Anyhow...again, OP, I support what you're going. You have to do what makes you happy, cause what makes you happy will make you a happy parent and happy parents produce happy children.

[GirlFriday]

^Charles, I understand what you're saying. And I can see a child wanting their parents to divorce when they witness what you did. But we don't have to deal in absolutes. It's not like the only two choices are:

1. Stay together and hate each other, scream and yell and damage the kids

or

2. Get a divorce

There is an in-between. People can stay together and form an imperfect, yet loving partnership. Good marriages don't just happen, it takes work. If BagLadie (I also apologize for not knowing your name) decides to stay with her husband, she doesn't HAVE to choose anger and screaming to communicate with her husband and she doesn't HAVE to create a damaging environment for her kids. It's all about choices.

When it's all said and done, maybe she shouldn't be with her husband, but I believe she shouldn't give up unless she's given it everything she's got to make it work.

[mombug]

Originally Posted by JNH14

As a teacher of 32 years-I see the daily results of divorce with my 8-9 year old students. It's NOT pretty and often heartbreaking when they come and cry about missing their dad or mom. Please consider counseling for them and yourself. This is a huge step to take-and once done-is final. I've always said that the best thing a husband can do for his children is love their mother. It sounds as if he's tried to do that-have you? I am not judging, but it seems that your love for the other guy has totally turned you away from even considering trying to make things work. I have been married for 29 years and it's been the toughest job I've ever had-some years are great, while others bite. It's taken a lot on both of our parts to remain committed even when we couldn't stand the sight of each other. Personally, I don't think there is anything wrong with your children seeing you have problems and then being able to make up. It prepares them for real life-because nobody's marriage is perfect. Just my two cents worth-really think this through-there's a lot at stake. You're three childrens' lives are going to change drastically.

Excellent post. You have echoed my thoughts exactly.
BagLadie, I wish you the best, and hope that you will take the time to think this all through, for the sake of yourself, your husband and your children.

[LOREBUNDE]

Your post reminded of a few things Farrah said in her interviews. I was watching a special doc. the other night w/Barbara Walters. It was interviews w/Farrah over the years. At one point in her younger years Farrah told her "i must be in love" (something along those lines). I never really thought about it but I guess why not want to always be in love, life is too short to just "settle". It also went on about how she left Charlies angels after 1 year because in her words she was not stimulated and then how she left her DH for Ryan O'neal. These were in Barbaras words very brave of her. It went on how Farrah was never afraid of things in life, just went for and did what she had to do to be happy, even if it wasn't the simplest of choices. Not everyone, myself included, can do these things. We stay to be comfortable. I know I'm rambling, trying to get my point across.

[vhdos]

Originally Posted by lolitakali

Great opinion. Grass isn't always greener on the other side, but then since we aren't God, we won't know... but still, there is such a thing called karma to deal with... great life is not "given" but rather "strived for", reward reaped after the right seed sown (but still no guarantees in life KWIM). Another thing, there is only that 50/50 chance (errrr... if even that) that the other man can make you happy... or actually only that "self" can make "self" happy; relying on you hubby or the other man to make that self happy one is more than doomed for another disappointment in life. Many says 2nd marriage is less likely to succeed than the 1st one... so think through before making that step: http://www.emaxhealth.com/5/16381.html I too have friends who took the easy way out for falling out of love with their ex. Are many of them still single... yeap, they may have remarry to divorce again, still looking for the "other" who can make them happy / or the other they can "blame" their unhappiness on... Do they have regrets, I am sure... but most would never tell. Its like a mistake they'd hate admitting they made; all about pride & ego you know. Would they always encourage other people to divorce??? Hell yeah, misery always love company. But of course there are others who should divorce for some serious mistakes like an abusive partner... I also know of 2 in my life. But, somehow it is in their mentality that they always go back towards that same "unhealthy" relationship; one of them, her own mother married an alcoholic husband who abused her, daughter likes the same trait in her dad I think. Just to remember that like everything, its a cycle... why I dread having children in a society filled with 50% chances of divorces (plus out of wedlock mistakes; not judging but life isn't only lessons without failures, there exists mistakes & regrets filled without 2nd chances too). Say if you came from a set of healthy parent (who believes in love) what is the chances society is going to give you in that partner who has divorced parents (35% - 50 plus %)??? In turn, what is that % of you having a child that have both these parents (you + 50/50% divorce rate partner) surviving in a healthy love marriage to pass this healthy marriage aspect & mentality so he/she can believe in love without divorces again??? What is the chances of him/her divorcing in turn even if he/she survive your own survival of a healthy love marriage w/o divorces looming into future???? KWIM??? Once the cycle starts, it is very hard to break out of that cycle... that is all. Once the pure gene pool is corrupted enough, that pure gene would become very scarce indeed. But thats whats becoming the norm though... oh well, to each their own. I'd still stick to my ideals even if imperfection is norm... at least I can tell my maker I did try for the ideal of perfection. Still, best of luck BagLadie.

Excellent post GirlFriday. I agree with you. Although I mean no disrespect to BagLadie, a lovely, active member of TPF, I find it a bit difficult reading through pages and pages of posts praising her for her doing the "right thing". The biggest problem I have with the whole situation is that she married her husband without ever even being in love with him. We all make bad decisions sometimes, but then why have 3 children with someone you don't even love? This is not simply a situation where oner person, or even both people, in a relationship have fallen out of love and have made a decision to better their lives and move on. Some marriages just don't work and I don't consider that a failure. I agree that in some cases it's better to move on. However, I can't help but look at this whole situation from her husband's point of view. He marries a woman, who he thinks really loves him, has a family with her, only to find out that she was never really in love with him at all. She becomes increasingly emotionally and physically unavailable to him as a result of her true feelings (or lack of feelings) and he suspects that she has met someone else (this is all info from the OP). Now, I know the husband, if he is like any normal husband, is far from perfect and probably has his fair share of issues in their marriage. I'm not making him out to be a saint in all of this. But it certainly seems to me like he's getting the raw end of the deal here. When you marry someone, there are expectations that both parties involved are in love. How would any of us feel if we later found out that our spouses never really loved us at all? Personally, I would be devastated, especially with children involved.
Also, I don't believe in the "soulmate" theory. I think that there are plenty of people in this world that we can be compatible with, not just one that "was meant to be." I do feel for the OP. I know how difficult it can be to know that you are just not compatible with someone, especially if you meet someone that you do feel compatible with.