**Have you or anyone close tried ECT? Opinions needed, emergency situation**

[Love my Tanos]

^
I have been following this thread and wanted to let you know that I'm really touched by your relationship with your cousin. I wish I was half as close to my cousins as you are with yours. I'm praying for you guys and really hope she comes to a decision that she's comfortable with, and that gives her some relief from her depression.

FWIW I have a neurological condition that I take meds for which have side effects on my short-term memory. I'm also one of these "very intelligent people," or used to be, before the meds :) It can be very frustrating, struggling to find the right word, or honestly not being able to recall what I ate for dinner the night before, but I find that if I give myself a little more time to think about things, the answers usually come to me, albeit a little more slowly than they used to. I've created work-arounds by becoming more organized, making lists, and in general just learning how to let certain things go and realizing that it's not critical to remember every little thing, even if it would be nice to be able to. I'm easier on myself than I used to be. My job is to aim for health, not perfection.

If your cousin does pursue the ECT and does experience minor memory loss, then it may be that she can work around it the same way I've learned to. It isn't fair, but it's doable. And certainly better than struggling against the illness itself.

I hope this helps. GL to you both.

[karmenzsofia]

Thank you so much for chiming in and telling your story. I'm sorry to hear about your memory loss. It looks like you've found a way to work things out. I've been sick for years and have had the same problem, mostly with immediate-term memory, dates and "finding the right word"--which is terrible for me kuz I'm a writer and editor...so imagine that scenario! Memory loss would suck I suppose, but I don't know what I would do if I lost my ability to process info kuz of some sort of cognitive damage. But if my cousin were to blow off the ECT kuz of these concerns, then what would she do? Talk about being between a rock and a hard place...

[Love my Tanos]

It does sound like an impossible choice but the life she's living now doesn't sound like a tenable situation. It's kind of a trade-off...potentially lose a few memories and get stumped for words sometimes in exchange for freedom from her debilitating depression. There are work-arounds for memory loss, but it doesn't sound like there are any more work-arounds for her depression, you know?

The memory loss isn't terrible in my case, and actually I've learned to laugh about it (better than crying over it). Granted it hasn't led to anything dangerous - just annoying - and most of the time, the memory comes back, it just floats to the top of my mind a while after I tried to recall it in the first place. It's been an interesting experience. It isn't permanent, and if I went off the meds (which I probably will at some point) my memory would go back to normal.

In your cousin's case, if she did experience memory loss, it sounds like there are enough experienced doctors out there who are trying to be cautious and responsible about it, who could help her learn to compensate for it. Everything carries risks but it does sound like she's getting good information from competent doctors and is doing her best to make the right decision for herself. I really admire you both for your tenacity and dedication to finding the right answers for your cousin, not just the easy answers.

[karmenzsofia]

Originally Posted by Love my Tanos

It does sound like an impossible choice but the life she's living now doesn't sound like a tenable situation. It's kind of a trade-off...potentially lose a few memories and get stumped for words sometimes in exchange for freedom from her debilitating depression. [IF--big "if"--it works. It doesn't help everyone, just about 70% of the patients, and the degree at which it helps also varies. The relapse rate also can be high. So it would suck to go through it, end up with memory and/or cognitive problems and not any better from the depression. I'm hoping that won't be the case with her, but it's impossible to know without doing it. It's a big risk.] Therre are work-arounds for memory loss, but it doesn't sound like there are any more work-arounds for her depression, you know? [Yup. That's why this is being considered; otherwise, I doubt she would.] The memory loss isn't terrible in my case, and actually I've learned to laugh about it (better than crying over it). Granted it hasn't led to anything dangerous - just annoying - and most of the time, the memory comes back, it just floats to the top of my mind a while after I tried to recall it in the first place. It's been an interesting experience. [I was just going to say that! -- "interesting."] It isn't permanent, and if I went off the meds (which I probably will at some point) my memory would go back to normal. In your cousin's case, if she did experience memory loss, it sounds like there are enough experienced doctors out there who are trying to be cautious and responsible about it, who could help her learn to compensate for it.Everything carries risks but it does sound like she's getting good information from competent doctors and is doing her best to make the right decision for herself. [I told her to call her doctor's office to ask which type of wave she would get, whether he uses a fixed or tailored dose, what to expect regarding the cognitive side effects, and where to find objective info about that. She should be as informed as possible, and the answers to those questions are important.] I really admire you both for your tenacity and dedication to finding the right answers for your cousin, not just the easy answers.[Thank you! ]

I really appreciate you taking the time to share all this info.

[Love my Tanos]

WHOA. This is crazy. I don't know what time zone you're in or if you'll see this before it's over, but Private Practice is on and one of the storylines on tonight is about a patient opting for electroshock therapy to treat her depression.

I thought you might want to check it out just to see if it helped to see the portrayal of the situation. (not that it would be educational per se...but sometimes seeing something like this acted out helps me to crystallize my own thoughts on a situation; I hope that makes sense)

Hope you see this in time but if not maybe they run the episodes again on abc.com

[Allisonfaye]

My mom had it. Many years ago (like 40). She wasn't diagnosed correctly at the time but she is bipolar. I don't know much about the details. When I was in college and I took her to the hospital twice for psychosis, they admitted her. She was paranoid and thought someone was trying to poison her so she refused to take her med and they can't legally force her to. So since she wasn't improving, they wanted to do this. They made me watch a film because it was up to me to consent. It was awful because my older sister told me NO WAY was she going to agree to this and I was only 19 at the time. They were telling me my mother's life was at risk on one hand, because when you are pyschotic, your heart races and you could go into cardiac arrest. So, I was agonizing over the decision. My sister (who WASN'T) there was pressuring me NOT to do it and the hospital was pressuring me to do it, quickly. Luckily, before I had a chance to decide, she started taking her meds (with lots of encouragement) and she got better. But honestly, if her life was at risk, I would have done it. I know she has memory loss and it tends to be short term memory loss. She remembers things from 30 years ago, but she can't remember what movie she saw on Sat (sometimes). It is spotty memory loss. But she also has Parkinson's now and I can't tell how much of her problems are related to that either.

Sorry, my kids are fighting. I will come back later.

[gacats]

KZ, I lost 2 very close family members to suicide and don't have sufficient words to describe the pain of losing them. However, it's nothing compared to their pain. They couldn't stand to live anymore.
I hope your cousin finds the peace she craves. I pray for her.

[karmenzsofia]

allisonfaye: Thanks for sharing your story. It's so unfair when obstinate, misinformed people hinder our ability to help someone, especially when they're not the ones providing care, making sacrifices and compromises to help the loved one. I saw that take place between my mom and her sister when it came to my grandma. It was awful. I'm glad your mom was able to get better with the meds, though I'm sorry to hear about the Parkinson's.

gacats: Two lost to suicide--that must have been incredibly tough. I agree with you that despite the pain the relatives and friends feel, the pain of the person who commits suicide is much worse--so unbearable that they can push through our strongest instinct--to preserve life, to ensure survival--and opt to end their lives kuz they can't conceive enduring it for another day. Thank you so much for your good wishes.

The treatment is supposed to begin Wed. I think she's staring to get scared kuz of a couple of comments she's made and kuz she had a good day--the first one in months--a few days ago and felt good enough to question whether or not she needs the ECT. She told she worries that she could be making a huge mistake she will regret later--to put her brain through something that might not help at all and cause damage. But we keep coming back to the fact that there's no way of knowing how she will react to ECT without trying it. I honestly don't know what I would do if I were her. I really wish she didn't have to do this. But I see someone who has "no life" (as she often says), who's just enduring every moment and barely surviving, who doesn't seem to be getting any better, and--worst of all--who after too many lost battles has also lost the determination she once had to overcome all of this and is finally admitting defeat. I think the hopelessness, helplessness, loneliness, bitterness ... all those "nesses"... will most likely kill her sooner or later if they don't miraculously disappear, and that's unlikely to happen.

[kimberf]

I'm very late in finding this thread, and I have only third-hand information to contribute, but maybe it will be some help or encouragement to your cousin. I have a friend whose mom has struggled with severe depression and has attempted suicide in the past. She underwent ECT and has maintenance treatment, and it's helped immensely, from what my friend told me. Not quite night & day, but close. My friend said that she no longer has to worry constantly about her mom, and that it's basically given both of them a lot more freedom. She also said that the treatment is not at all the "One Flew over the Cuckoo's Nest" experience that people envision. She is very positive about it overall.

[karmenzsofia]

Thanks for chiming in, kimberf. It's good to know it's helped others. Yes, these days ECT is nothing like what was portrayed in that movie. It's too bad that so many people avoid this treatment kuz of that notion.

[Hally]

KZ, Carrie Fisher was on Joy Behar tonight and she talked about her ECT therapy. It might be worth reading her book. I don't usually buy celeb books but she is a writer and has a great sense of humour.

[karmenzsofia]

Thanks Hally. I love her and plan to read her book.

[jences]

www.truehope.com

This literally changed my life in ways I cannot explain.

[karmenzsofia]

Thanks for the link, jences. I'll pass it on to her, though this seems more targeted to bipolar and anxiety disorders, and hers is depression.