Anyone else ever ran into a man who won't marry you??

[nathansgirl1908]

Originally Posted by juneping

nathansgirl1908 i think a lot of people's messages are marriage is not that important, and that piece of paper is not that important than actually being with the person they love. i will use myself as example. i do want to get married some day. and my bf just got a divorce. he lost everything to his ex. i can understand how that feel to loss everything he's been working for his entire life. now he is starting from 0. he does want to marry me someday but i am not thinking it as such a big deal. i am okay if we'll never be married. i saw the process and hassel...it really just is a piece of paper. but i agree it's more complicated when a child is involved. the law is very harsh towards men in divorce, especially men with a job a stable income or some kind of assets he had. so i am looking at myself...we are just dating now and we don't own anything or share any bank account together. i tell myself i can be financially independent bc depending on someone else for my welfare is just not wise.

I can understand that, and I don't recommend anyone depending entirely on someone else for their welfare. But I'm mainly talking about women who have children with these men. And as you point out that makes things more murky. If nothing else, they should be concerned about protections for themselves and their children in the event something happens. Your situation seems different... especially since you say that your bf is starting from 0. I think it is smart that you are simply dating him and not sharing anything together. In my opinion that is more in line with your statements about it not being a big deal whether you get married.

On another note, and this isn't in relation to your post Juneping, I'm just speaking in general. I find it ironic that heterosexual people are taking for granted and often discounting something that homosexuals are fighting os hard to get. Has anyone ever stopped to really look at why homosexuals are fighting so hard to get gay marriage legalized across the country? It's not just because they feel that terminology relating to marriage is discriminatory. It is also because they know the legal protections that married couples can get, that people with SOs CAN'T get.

And what exactly is the tax treatment of people who are living together and are not married? I ask because the last time I looked at the tax documents there was no category for "booed up and filing jointly."

[yenanh00]

Originally Posted by nathansgirl1908

You think being called "wife" is too formal, yet you live that formality every day? and how is it easier to walk away just because you aren't married? maybe if you didn't have kids and joint bank accounts, but even if you aren't married, it won't be that easy to walk away.

All I'm saying even though I enjoy to live with the wife formality everyday already.. I dont need a piece of paper to declare that formality.. However, I didnt say that I wont get marry one day.. Right now is not that time for us.. We are busy with everything going in our life already, I dont need marriage on my list of thing to do ( which is millions of things to do).. When the time come it comes.. I'm not saying marriage is not important either... Eventually I get to it.. If I never get to it, it's fine with me..

When I say 'walked away', I mean for legal purposes.. I didnt mean my own personally feelings.. I know it wont be easy to walk away.. if that day ever come, he can have everything in the joint bank account.. I have my own money to get through life with my kids.. It's not like I dont work.. Then as for kids, we would share custody.. I know my DB enough that he wont be fighting for everything with me.. Well maybe he will fight for my handbag and shoes collection just to pissed me off, but other than that he wouldnt want anything else.. Beside I live in WA, it does recognize common marriage law.. He already have a will set up already.. If anything happen to him, he will leave everything to the kids and I will be the legal guardian before they turn 18..

[juneping]

^^good point about gay marriage!!

[nikkipeps]

...he'll come around to marrying you in time. His to decide given whatever has stopped him in tracks to make that a reality sooner is only known to him and him alone. I'm for you sitting him down for a soulful honest to goodness talk about where this is heading and whether the love is still gona sustain what you both have.

Else I think he just may like the arrangement as convenient as it is...No strings just means no pressure and some guys dig that. I can't fathom them and sure don't condone that but I feel if one craves the security matrimony supposedly gives and also for the kids to view the arrangement as normal, then one ought to broach the issue with the dude and pick his brain on all this because it's obviously impacting you and inevitably will unto the kids & he can't just be all that irresponsible. Hell if he is, I'd say loose the delusion and leave. It takes a strength to walk away I know but it's about moving on despite adversity in one's face because you can only hope he changes for the better after counselling but then again there's no guarantee for anything.

[nathansgirl1908]

Originally Posted by juneping

^^good point about gay marriage!!

Thanks!

[nataliam1976]

Originally Posted by nathansgirl1908

That statement has nothing to do with values and is more about consistency. Personally, I'm not sure I WANT to get married, but with that being the case, I'm not going to live a married type of lifestyle (having children, sharing bank accounts, living together, etc). That would be inconsistent with what I'm saying about not wanting to be married. And interestingly enough, for those who say they don't want marriage because of the commitment, um, if you're doing all that stuff anyway, there IS a level of commitment. And as I said before, there are SO many legal issues that can still arise, that it isn't as simple as walking away. And with respect to the second part of your statement, it isn't appropriate to make references to the content of another thread in such a manner. This was an issue that has been addressed in the past because according to a mod on this site, it is unfair to take what someone said in another thread that isn't related and attempt to throw it in their face in an entirely different, unrelated thread. But since you want to go there, I will use this to make my point more clear. If I'm saying that I don't want kids, but I'm trying to get pregnant or going out and adopting a child, it would be inconsistent. However, I have said that I don't want kids, and I have done my best to fix it so that I WON'T have them.

I will start with the second part of your post. I did not intend to throw anything in your face but I used it as an example to show you what I mean on something you ( and myself personally as well as you know) can relate to. If you want to read it negatively, your choice, but it wasnt meant this way. All I was trying to say was that suggesting somebody is lying presenting a certain point of view because yours is different can be hurtful.


The thing is if somebody chooses having kids together, having shared accounts and so on but not getting married, why do you call it a married type of lifestyle? I would say its a new unmarried way of lifestyle, since apparently all this can be done fine without the rings on the fingers. And with the law being more more and more accomodating for unmarried couples, this argument will hopefully no longer be valid in the future.

[nathansgirl1908]

Originally Posted by nataliam1976

I will start with the second part of your post. I did not intend to throw anything in your face but I used it as an example to show you what I mean on something you ( and myself personally as well as you know) can relate to. If you want to read it negatively, your choice, but it wasnt meant this way. All I was trying to say was that suggesting somebody is lying presenting a certain point of view because yours is different can be hurtful. The thing is if somebody chooses having kids together, having shared accounts and so on but not getting married, why do you call it a married type of lifestyle? I would say its a new unmarried way of lifestyle, since apparently all this can be done fine without the rings on the fingers. And with the law being more more and more accomodating for unmarried couples, this argument will hopefully no longer be valid in the future.

It isn't a matter of accusing someone of "lying." It is a matter of being concerned that some women may be convincing themselves that they are happy with a certain arrangement when they really aren't. The word "lying" is too harsh for what I am talking about.


And yes, it is my choice to take what you said negatively. Based on what was said, it appeared to be intended in a hurtful manner.

[Cornflower Blue]

OP, I'd ask him to marry you, if he starts faffing around and gets uncomfortable I'd be wanting to know why and I'd personally be doubting his committment to the relationship, and if he did start getting all freaked I'd personally drop him like a hot potato - but that's just me...

[bagnshoofetish]

Originally Posted by nathansgirl1908

So while some try to play it off as just a piece of paper, practically speaking it is far more than that.

by your description it sounds like a LOT of pieces of paper!

the thing here is, no one is saying no one should get married. but when it is a one sided desire, perhaps marriage is not in the cards for that couple. if the OP wants to marry and the guy doesn't, they are on two different pages and he either has to switch to her page (but you can't force that) or she will have to find a different "book", ie; a guy who wants the same things she does.

[nathansgirl1908]

Originally Posted by bagnshoofetish

by your description it sounds like a LOT of pieces of paper! the thing here is, no one is saying no one should get married. but when it is a one sided desire, perhaps marriage is not in the cards for that couple. if the OP wants to marry and the guy doesn't, they are on two different pages and he either has to switch to her page (but you can't force that) or she will have to find a different "book", ie; a guy who wants the same things she does.

I agree about both people needing to get on the same page. However, I disagree with you in that I feel that some statements made on here have been leaning more towards saying that marriage is pointless. For instance, some people have questioned WHY the OP wants to marry him, before launching into a spiel about it being a piece of paper.

[envyme]

People are asking "why" because the OP stated:

Quote:

He's cheated and lied for a good duration of our time together...

Originally Posted by nathansgirl1908

I agree about both people needing to get on the same page. However, I disagree with you in that I feel that some statements made on here have been leaning more towards saying that marriage is pointless. For instance, some people have questioned WHY the OP wants to marry him, before launching into a spiel about it being a piece of paper.

[juneping]

i think in OP's case....she just want the guy to fully commit to her? she wanted the guy to go that extra mile to prove himself?

[nathansgirl1908]

Originally Posted by envyme

People are asking "why" because the OP stated:

Um no. The posts I'm talking about were asking why she wanted to be married so badly and there was nothing else in the post in reference to the cheating and lying. Not too many of the posts have been about the cheating issue.

[envyme]

... What posts are you referring to?

Originally Posted by nathansgirl1908

Um no. The posts I'm talking about were asking why she wanted to be married so badly and there was nothing else in the post in reference to the cheating and lying. Not too many of the posts have been about the cheating issue.

[Aslan]

Originally Posted by nathansgirl1908

Not every state recognizes common law marriages. Furthermore it isn't smart when it comes to estate planning and other important matters. Hands down spouses will ALWAYS have better protection than a significant other. For women who have children, I don't understand why you would put yourselves in such a precarious situation. Suppose your bf dies one day and you are left with your children. If he didn't have a will, you WON'T inherit under intestate succession. Even in some states where there is common law marriage, the laws are a bit iffy when it comes to intestate succession. If the bf dies testate, the will could be contested and you find yourself tied up in court for years at a time. That doesn't even include pension benefit issues and the like. Living will issues? Same problem. So while some try to play it off as just a piece of paper, practically speaking it is far more than that.

I totally agree, and I don't understand why a woman would want to forgo that kind of protection (the protection that marriage affords) when they have a child and share money.

And point taken: the gay marriage example well illustrates what the "marriage issue" is really about.