what would you do??

[DlkinVegas]

Originally Posted by nataliam1976

I will not lower myself to your level and reply to this post the way you expect me to. If you have a problem with me posting here, please take it to PM.

what are you talking about?

[nataliam1976]

Originally Posted by canada's

yes. if you aren't doing it, and you are outside of your own home and in a public setting and the child is doing something they aren't supposed to, yes, it is perfectly fine for another adult to tell them to stop doing something that is potentially dangerous. if you have a problem with how the stranger may approach the child, then nip it in the bud and be sure your child does not do things that may bring this on. it's as simple as that. again, i wouldn't call what these people did trying to "parent" your child, they're just telling the kid to put something down that isn't theirs just as a teacher or camp counselor might. yes, it's just a ball, but it doesn't belong to them, nor are they in an appropriate setting for playing with a ball.

Exactly. I think I said a few times already that the way the employees approached the situation was poor, OP, so I completely agree with you on this one. I just dont agree that they shouldnt have said anything at all.

[ilovepinkhearts]

but the difference here is that it's the EMPLOYEE that thinks that my child is in the wrong...i DON'T. i am their parent. yes we are in a store, and yes they bounced a ball and yes they very well could have hurt someone bouncing it [very unlikely]. but i was right there...if i think they are doing something wrong or misbehaving i tell them to stop. i don't need a grouchy employee at a store to be rude to my kids...the end.

[merika]

Originally Posted by ilovepinkhearts

i have read all the responses...and still i can't see how it's appropriate for the employees to think it's ok to talk so rudely to my children when i as their parent am standing right there. they all easily could have asked "where is your mommy or daddy" and then spoke to us about it. if i hadn't been there...then so be it. i want them to be safe and i want others in the store to be safe. so i do what it takes to make that the case. and im there telling them to put the balls back a rude employee that doesn't want to have to pick up a ball a few aisles over decides to speak rudely to them will never be ok with me. ask nicely and there would be no issue. i would never speak to a child that is doing something wrong the way the employees talked to my children. and as for letting a baby suck a pacifier and drooling and chewing all over a toy and putting it back...not the same thing. this is a ball. it has touched the floor who knows how many times prior to my sons touching/bouncing it. again the reason i posted was basically asking when is it OK for a stranger to parent your child...no one has really answered that. it seems more like people think im a bad parent for letting them touch a toy.

Yes. It is, if the person thinks the child is not being parented appropriately in a particular setting. I know you think that you wouldn't speak to a child the way the employees spoke to your children, but your children should also learn that if they do not behave in a way that an establishment considers appropriate not everyone will be nice and considerate to them.

There are adults who may think that that some kids' behavior is not appropriate even if their parents think it's fine, and the best thing to do in such instances is for the kids to stop whatever they're doing that annoys that person as a matter of courtesy. It's nicer still if you or the children can apologize - I find that an apology delivered in just the right manner makes way more of a point than getting in the face of a person who reprimanded your child. Teaches the kids great manners too!

[ilovepinkhearts]

and if i think they are in the wrong i do apologize...but in the case of them bouncing a ball and an employee gets in my 4 yr old sons face and tells him no and takes it away...then im not going to apologize.

this is a different instance...we were at the park, there were bigger boys playing. one of them hit my son in the back and then started laughing as my son stood there and cried. i saw the whole thing. i responded with "i dont know who hit him, but it's not nice and you don't need to hit" i of course saw the boy that did it. i didn't rudely get in his face and tell him not to hit my child and to keep his mean hands to himself. there are ways to talk to children and a rude employee in my son's face is not acceptable.

as i have stated they have bounced the balls numerous times, employees have seen them. they smile. then on the 3 occasion that an employee is grouchy they decide to talk to my children rudely as im standing right there. i am parenting them, i didn't walk off and do my shopping while i leave them to trash the toy section.

and for those that thinks it ok for any adult to talk to your child and tell them they are doing something wrong, that is your prerogative. but i don't agree [unless of course they were in dancer].

[nataliam1976]

Originally Posted by ilovepinkhearts

but the difference here is that it's the EMPLOYEE that thinks that my child is in the wrong...i DON'T. i am their parent. yes we are in a store, and yes they bounced a ball and yes they very well could have hurt someone bouncing it [very unlikely]. but i was right there...if i think they are doing something wrong or misbehaving i tell them to stop. i don't need a grouchy employee at a store to be rude to my kids...the end.

No you dont need a grouchy employee to be rude to your kids. But its not the end, because you are in a public place and its not only up to you to decide if they are doing something wrong or not. You are the one making those decisions in a private setting.

I must admit that I dont understand your argument " but I was right there", how would it change anything? If something happened, it would still have happened because you didnt stop them from playing.

[merika]

Originally Posted by nataliam1976

No you dont need a grouchy employee to be rude to your kids. But its not the end, because you are in a public place and its not only up to you to decide if they are doing something wrong or not. You are the one making those decisions in a private setting. I must admit that I dont understand your argument " but I was right there", how would it change anything? If something happened, it would still have happened because you didnt stop them from playing.

True dat.

[twinkle.tink]

I am sorry, but some of this examples are just so far off base...apples and oranges, really..bouncing a ball a few times is not equal to a baby chewing on a toy.

Regardless, the point is: It is not okay for a store employee to speak to anyone in this manner, rude and aggressive, let alone a child.

[DangerousJade]

I think there are two issues at play in this thread, which is why it's becoming frustrating:

One is whether it is okay for an employee to be rude, particularly to a child. I think everyone who has posted agrees that rudeness is not acceptable, although we seem to vary on whether it is okay to speak to children at all, if it was in a gentler tone. I agree 100% with the OP that an aggressive tone towards children (or anyone) is unacceptable.

The other issue is whether the OP has the right to decide rules for her children in a public place with someone else's property, if her rules conflict with the people who own the location and the items. This seems to be the place that we are diverging. For me personally, I think public manners are tremendously important, and I would err on the side of respect and caution even if I didn't think bouncing the ball was really a big deal...which it's obviously not, in the scheme of things.

To me it comes down to location, in this instance. It's not really about if bouncing balls is dangerous or horrifically bad or disruptive, but about who has the right to make rules regarding behavior, not in general, but in that store and with that property. No one objects profoundly to children gently bouncing a bouncy ball, but some may object to implying that one can make their own rules in public places if they feel justified.

[ChristyR143]

Okay, here's my take on the situation...First off, I assume we are talking about either a WalMart or a Target. I used to work at WalMart (many moons ago, lol) and to my knowledge there are no STORE rules regarding picking up and playing with, or otherwise handling merchandise (other than the merchandise that is behind lock and key). Now, there IS a store rule regarding climbing on shelves to get things that are at the very top, and that rule is posted very visibly, all over the store. The sign says to ask for assistance with items on the top shelf. SO, that being the case, it leads me to make the assumption that IF touching the balls was against store policy, there would be a sign on the bin stating such. Since there is NO such sign, as a parent, that means that *I* should use my own judgment to decide what behavior is appropriate for *MY* child. If the situation is exactly as Danielle described it (and we have no reason to believe otherwise) then it's my opinion that her son wasn't doing anything at all wrong, nor was she lacking in parenting him properly.

As I stated, I worked for WalMart when I was a teenager. Things get strowed ALL OVER the store, and NOT just by kids either. And guess what? It IS the employees' jobs to put those things back in their proper place. Now, am I saying it's perfectly fine to just pick things up and mess with them and leave them lay wherever? No, but what I AM saying is that if the employees in question were being rude to Danielle's son simply because they didn't want to have to put the ball back in a few minutes, then that IS wrong, because that IS part of their job, period.

And regardless of store policy/rules, it is NEVER okay for an employee to be rude to a customer, much less a small child, and those employees should be ashamed of themselves.

[vhdos]

Originally Posted by ChristyR143

Okay, here's my take on the situation...First off, I assume we are talking about either a WalMart or a Target. I used to work at WalMart (many moons ago, lol) and to my knowledge there are no STORE rules regarding picking up and playing with, or otherwise handling merchandise (other than the merchandise that is behind lock and key). Now, there IS a store rule regarding climbing on shelves to get things that are at the very top, and that rule is posted very visibly, all over the store. The sign says to ask for assistance with items on the top shelf. SO, that being the case, it leads me to make the assumption that IF touching the balls was against store policy, there would be a sign on the bin stating such. Since there is NO such sign, as a parent, that means that *I* should use my own judgment to decide what behavior is appropriate for *MY* child. If the situation is exactly as Danielle described it (and we have no reason to believe otherwise) then it's my opinion that her son wasn't doing anything at all wrong, nor was she lacking in parenting him properly. As I stated, I worked for WalMart when I was a teenager. Things get strowed ALL OVER the store, and NOT just by kids either. And guess what? It IS the employees' jobs to put those things back in their proper place. Now, am I saying it's perfectly fine to just pick things up and mess with them and leave them lay wherever? No, but what I AM saying is that if the employees in question were being rude to Danielle's son simply because they didn't want to have to put the ball back in a few minutes, then that IS wrong, because that IS part of their job, period. And regardless of store policy/rules, it is NEVER okay for an employee to be rude to a customer, much less a small child, and those employees should be ashamed of themselves.

No different this time, I agree with you again ChristyR143!!!!

[dallas]

Originally Posted by ilovepinkhearts

when i as their parent am standing right there. they all easily could have asked "where is your mommy or daddy" and then spoke to us about it.

I'm confused, so I'll ask. If you were right there, why would the store employee have to ask your children where you were?

I don't think it's okay for the store employee to be rude to children but I can see how they could become frustrated with children being unsupervised and allowed to do anything they like, and it may have appeared that way if you were out of sight.

[sweetneet]

Originally Posted by canada's

yes. if you aren't doing it, and you are outside of your own home and in a public setting and the child is doing something they aren't supposed to, yes, it is perfectly fine for another adult to tell them to stop doing something that is potentially dangerous. if you have a problem with how the stranger may approach the child, then nip it in the bud and be sure your child does not do things that may bring this on. it's as simple as that. again, i wouldn't call what these people did trying to "parent" your child, they're just telling the kid to put something down that isn't theirs just as a teacher or camp counselor might. yes, it's just a ball, but it doesn't belong to them, nor are they in an appropriate setting for playing with a ball.

i agree. while i don't think rudeness on the employee's part is acceptable, it still doesn't mean that it's perfectly ok for your child to be bouncing balls around in a store. just because you don't have a problem with it doesn't mean others (employees, other shoppers) don't find it extremely bothersome.

Originally Posted by DangerousJade

I think there are two issues at play in this thread, which is why it's becoming frustrating: One is whether it is okay for an employee to be rude, particularly to a child. I think everyone who has posted agrees that rudeness is not acceptable, although we seem to vary on whether it is okay to speak to children at all, if it was in a gentler tone. I agree 100% with the OP that an aggressive tone towards children (or anyone) is unacceptable. The other issue is whether the OP has the right to decide rules for her children in a public place with someone else's property, if her rules conflict with the people who own the location and the items. This seems to be the place that we are diverging. For me personally, I think public manners are tremendously important, and I would err on the side of respect and caution even if I didn't think bouncing the ball was really a big deal...which it's obviously not, in the scheme of things. To me it comes down to location, in this instance. It's not really about if bouncing balls is dangerous or horrifically bad or disruptive, but about who has the right to make rules regarding behavior, not in general, but in that store and with that property. No one objects profoundly to children gently bouncing a bouncy ball, but some may object to implying that one can make their own rules in public places if they feel justified.

i agree, very well said. the rudeness issue aside, i think it's perfectly ok for employees to tell children to stop doing something that this disruptive, dangerous, or just plain inconsiderate. the rules of a restaurant/store/public place don't have to be spelled out in stone for anyone to have the right to politely ask your child to stop an offending behavior. for example there's no rule on airlines that says repeatedly kicking the seat in front of you is strictly prohibited, yet it's pretty much understood by most that it's not nice to let your child to so to someone else for the duration of a four-hour flight. like merika said, a lot of it just boils down to plain old manners and consideration for everyone else.

When i was teen I once worked at a petting zoo at a local park and I remember this one lady brought her daughter (about 4 or 5 years old) in to pet the animals (goats, sheep, young cows, chickens, etc). Well this little girl was somewhat rough with the animals-- she would pull on their tails and hit them, thinking it was funny. Her mom was right there and would say nothing, acting as if it was normal child behavior. So another girl working there mentioned to the girl "would you please stop hurting the animals? it's not nice." She stopped at first, and would pet the animals nicely, but then when she thought nobody was looking, she would hit the animals again. Then the director then came over and said sorry she wasn't allowed to go into the stalls and touch the animals anymore. The little girl got upset and started to whine/cry. Her mom then got all defensive, replying with "don't be telling my daughter what to do" and "what is the point of a petting zoo if the children aren't allowed to touch the animals??" anyway, I was don't know what else we were supposed to do in that case...even though the mom was standing right there, she clearly wasn't stopping her child from her behavior, so that's why the other workers felt like they have to intervene directly. i'm sure store/restaurant employees see a lot of things like this all the time and are quite frustrated with the behavior of children that are either unsupervised or are with parents don't address certain behaviors that are bothersome to others.

[Roo]

Wow, this thread is, ummm, interesting.

I don't think that expecting children to be well behaved is exclusive to childless people. I personally can't stand kids who are running around and being disruptive and I know people with kids themselves that don't like it either. Just because the balls are there, does not mean there should be some implied entitlement that it's OK to throw them around for amusement, when there is no real intent to buy. If the temptation is too strong for kids to run around like that and there is a history of 'mean' employees at the store, maybe it's better to leave them home and/or shop elsewhere?

For me, hearing stories like this one is also just one more reason I refuse to shop at Walmart.

[ChristyR143]

Originally Posted by sweetneet

i agree, very well said. the rudeness issue aside, i think it's perfectly ok for employees to tell children to stop doing something that this disruptive, dangerous, or just plain inconsiderate. the rules of a restaurant/store/public place don't have to be spelled out in stone for anyone to have the right to politely ask your child to stop an offending behavior. for example there's no rule on airlines that says repeatedly kicking the seat in front of you is strictly prohibited, yet it's pretty much understood by most that it's not nice to let your child to so to someone else for the duration of a four-hour flight. like merika said, a lot of it just boils down to plain old manners and consideration for everyone else. When i was teen I once worked at a petting zoo at a local park and I remember this one lady brought her daughter (about 4 or 5 years old) in to pet the animals (goats, sheep, young cows, chickens, etc). Well this little girl was somewhat rough with the animals-- she would pull on their tails and hit them, thinking it was funny. Her mom was right there and would say nothing, acting as if it was normal child behavior. So another girl working there mentioned to the girl "would you please stop hurting the animals? it's not nice." She stopped at first, and would pet the animals nicely, but then when she thought nobody was looking, she would hit the animals again. Then the director then came over and said sorry she wasn't allowed to go into the stalls and touch the animals anymore. The little girl got upset and started to whine/cry. Her mom then got all defensive, replying with "don't be telling my daughter what to do" and "what is the point of a petting zoo if the children aren't allowed to touch the animals??" anyway, I was don't know what else we were supposed to do in that case...even though the mom was standing right there, she clearly wasn't stopping her child from her behavior, so that's why the other workers felt like they have to intervene directly. i'm sure store/restaurant employees see a lot of things like this all the time and are quite frustrated with the behavior of children that are either unsupervised or are with parents don't address certain behaviors that are bothersome to others.

Neither of these examples have anything in common with the situation at hand. Danielle's son was gently bouncing a ball in an empty isle. How, in any shape or form can this be compared to a child kicking the seat in front of them on an airplane, or a child causing harm to an animal?? Of COURSE in either of those two scenarios, if the parent is not handling the situation, then YES, a stranger has every right to speak to the child (NOT rudely, though), because the child is DIRECTLY affecting someone or something else. But that isn't even close to what happened to Danielle. IMO, what she was dealing with is employees who are probably not getting paid much more than minimum wage, hate their job, and didn't want to be bothered with possibly having to put a ball back in the bin (which, AGAIN, is in the description of a floor employee at WalMart). Here again...apples and oranges.