Update: payments and PCI Compliance

[TropicalGal]

Originally Posted by lovebags2

I've been told that there is sensitive information you need to submit to MB re your banking etc... I"d love to know exactly what type of info is required since Jackie mentioned there is only a proof of address needed and can't understand all the fuss. In any event,

Why don't you go onto the Money Bookers site and check it out for yourself. Don't rely on hearsay.

[lovebags2]

Originally Posted by TropicalGal

Why don't you go onto the Money Bookers site and check it out for yourself. Don't rely on hearsay.

Good point TG.

I did go on their site quickly yesterday and it "appeared" to me that they were going to request sensitive information about banking etc....

But, I"m going to follow thru more with your suggestion soon when I have the proper time.

[lionlaw]

As far as the fraud verification goes, there is not one answer for everyone and what they require depends on who you talk to.

I have had PMS asking if they really asked for my bank statement. Yes, they did. I have the emails where ti was listed with also utility bills. I do not receive utility bills through the post so this is what the reps asked for on the phone. They may not ask this from everyone.

I don't think any of the concerns here were meant to bash BE. The defensiveness to questions, is really off putting imo. I like Be and I know Jackie is working hard to resolve this for everyone, but I think this is a public forum and people have the right to ask questions and post their experiences without basically being called liars.


It is very simple to verify this yourself by reading their privacy policy and terms of use:

I quote from the Privacy Policy:

We may collect the following information about you:

* Any information you disclose to us in or in connection with your Application, such as (but not limited to) your name, previous names, Social Security Number, trade name, current and previous home addresses, current and previous business address, date of birth, telephone numbers, fax numbers, email addresses, bank account details, information on your financial status and creditworthiness and other financial information.

# Information we may gather about you during our business relationship, such as transaction data, data collected from you during the any credit Review Procedure or from third party providers such as credit rating agencies or fraud prevention and detection service providers;
# Information we may receive about you or in relation to your transactions from any auction website, vending website or web portal on or through which you offer and sell your goods or services;
# Information we may receive from card associations or their members in relation to you or your transactions;
# Information we receive from you for the purpose of executing a transaction;
# Information we may gather about you when opening and using a User Profile;
# Information we gather about you when visiting our website generally (usually through the use of Cookies, see section 5 below, and/or by recording your IP address, domain name and browser type).

And from the Terms of Use:

5. Personal Information

5.1 You are required to keep the information in your User Profile accurate and up to date. Continued use of your User Profile with inaccurate information may be regarded by us as a breach of these Terms and Conditions and may result in termination of your User Profile.   You agree that we may require you to provide additional information at any time in order to participate in our services. From time to time, we also may obtain information from third parties (including but not limited to credit or identity verification information) to ensure you are authorized to use your Payment Instrument, verify that your Payment Instrument account is in good standing or otherwise verify your ability to receive services from Moneybookers in accordance with these Terms and Conditions.

5.2 We will collect, process and/or disclose your personal information in accordance with our Privacy Policy which forms part of these Terms and Conditions.

[lovebags2]

Lionlaw,

THANK YOU for this information. It's exactly what I was looking for. I"m more convinced that I"ll stay with Paypal (or not order again).

And I agree with your comments that everyone should have a right to express their opinions here without worry.

[BAGSLOVERsg011]

Wow! A lot of confusion here & there abt the new payment system. Fortunately for me, I didn't face any of the problems stated by fellow tpfers. I paid my purchase thru Diners & my bank called me up(on the same day) to verify the purchase I made online, now just waiting for my bag to arrive in Singapore. No problem with MB at all! Phew! It's a big relief.

[BelenEchandia]

Morning,

I've been through this thread now and scribbled answers to your questions/concerns.

Rather than copying and pasting, I'm going to use the @ sign to indicate when I'm answering a question. Hope it's ok, here goes...

@Moonfancy:

You probably don't need to do anything. You pay as normal on our site. IF for some reason they cannot verify you (usually because they need to verify your address) you would register at www.moneybookers.com and give a proof of address. If they ask you for any sensitive details you do not feel comfortable providing please just don't provide them, contact me and we'll find a way around it. I will get one of them to call you personally and make sure that they don't. In case of any issues it might be worth getting this done in advance but no worries if you don't have time. Then you pay on our site as normal.

@Lionlaw:The second round of verification procedures is not something I have been told about. CS has insisted to me that they don't need any sensitive information - though as with Paypal and any other financialcompany, they are entitled to ask for it. I will make sure you don't have to provide it. I think the problem is that as with PP and other big companies they are using an overseas call centre and there is a lot of communication problem. Which of course I agree is terrible and I am annoyed to find out about it. I know you have been asked for this data and I am so sorry for this and don't understand why they are giving you such trouble.

@sgreg you don't have to pay with MB, you just pay on our website so there are no extra fees. You just sometimes have to sign up on their website to be able to use ours. It should not be this way,it is not the service we signed up for, but it seems the service we signed up for has been delayed.

@lionlaw and @sgreg I am disturbed to hear about fees. I will look into this. Your cc company should not charge you any fees. However, we are a UK company so did you get charged before when you used the BE website? I read somewhere that some US card co's started charging last year.

@lovebags2 - Paypal is and has always been an option as a last resort because it is not integrated with our website. I've asked everyone/anyone who has been asked for address verification to please attempt it first, with a simple telephone bill or something that is not sensitive. Paypal can always be used as a last resort.

@all - I believe that it is not MB which charges you but your credit card co./bank. I think but I am not sure that they would do this whichever provider you paid with on our site, (maybe even PP if it was integrated to our site but I'm not sure) Since TropicalGal was not charged anything and she is paying with a US card, this suggests to me that it depends who you bank with. Again, I am not sure but unless it is an Amex, which does cost more to process, it is not us or MB charging this 3%.

@lovebags2/@carterazo- what I meant is that BE receives less money if we use Paypal, the difference doesn't make any difference to the buyer. Paypal gives us a bad conversion from US dollars to UK sterling.

@cornflowerblue - there are numerous reasons not to use paypal,the cost is the last thing. We need a professional solution, not a wallet. MB was not supposed to be an e-wallet solution on our site, it was supposed to be a white label solution but their upgrade hasn't happened yet. We've been told that this will be fixed by January latest. We're hanging on because using MB will allow us to integrate payments for BEC bags on our website - so that we don't have to manually charge balances.However that will require a wallet, so given all these problems I am reconsidering this. But changing payment provider does not happen over night. We had to plan for 6 months for the change to MB from HSBC and we have invested considerable amounts so we have to consider everything carefully and establish how we can solve these issues before making a decision.

@karmenzsofia - again, I am pretty sure that unless you used Amex, we haven't charged you this. Would you mind enquiring with your bank about it because I would like to know why you have been charged and who charged you. If you pay with Amex, it costs a bit extra because of the fees Amex charges us. Was it an Amex?

@cornflowerblue - I do feel as though I am doing battle :). Various people here have seen my emails to MB and I have told them that I have scheduled a telephone conference with the CEO of MB for next week. So we are taking this very seriously.

On the topic of MB T&Cs - after September 11, all banking institutions have very strict rules under anti-terrorism legislation. I checked Paypal T&Cs and they are exactly the same - they reserve the right to request social security# and other personal data. This was the same with HSBC and there is nothing I can do about this because it's the law.

But they usually don't ask for it and as I understand it in practice they should need very real reasons to do so (although in theory all financial companies policies state that they reserve the right to ask for any reason, of any person, at any time), which is why I am asking them not to request this information as I know that the thought is upsetting. I have been told that there is no reason to require this information and the person I spoke to agreed that a bank statement was not required and should not be requested. I am wondering about arranging a 3-way conference call with anyone who is asked for it and a CS representative so that I ask why they ask for this, but I will probably be told that this is not possible for security reasons.

To summarise - no fees should be charged by us, MB should not ask for sensitive info. and we understand and are fighting against this (but if for legal reasons they absolutely need to then I guess they will), 99.9% of people so far have had no problems and have been verified quickly and without this sensitive data, you will pay directly on our website and this 1.9% fee does not apply.

It would be great if anyone who has a problem paying on our website makes one attempt to verify themselves. I think almost everyone has, for which thank you.

It was not our decision to change payment provider but it has been forced upon us. I
am so sorry for any inconvenience and you can be assured that I am working tirelessly to
get any issues resolved.

Sorry this is long, I wanted to be thorough.

Have a good day. XOX

[Tanja]

I just paid like I usually do with my cc and for me it didn't make a difference to before. I didn't have to verify anything.May be because I buy from Germany.
By the way Moneybookers isn't a German company it's a UK LTD just a big German corporation the Metro Ag invested in it but itsn't the main owner. See under General terms & conditions 1.2: .Moneybookers Ltd. (the 'Company' or 'Moneybookers'), a company registered in England and Wales under no 4260907 with registered office in Welken House, 10-11 Charterhouse Square, London, EC1M 6EH, United Kingdom

[TropicalGal]

Thank you Jackie, for these reassuring explanations.

[lanasyogamama]

Thank you Jackie for taking the time to address individual concerns!

[Jenova]

Verified my address with the code that was posted to me today and

....then tried verifying my card by transferring funds into MB from it on line (as MB man originally suggested) - won't let me because I am still 'locked'.

Still obliged to actually go to my bank and arrange the wire transfer there.

Bet my account remains locked because it still seems to be asking for other stuff as well as the wire transfer.

[karmenzsofia]

Hi Jackie,

Thank you so much for addressing all these issues. I'm sorry that collecting payments on the website has turned out to be such a complex matter further complicated by the various laws affecting this sector.

I didn't use Amex kuz I saw a fee when I was checking out, so I switched to Visa and made the payment easily and without any additional fees that I could see. Then someone mentioned that her bank charged her 3% for the transaction, so I checked my online account and found the same charge.

For reasons beyond my control (kuz if I could, I would be gone!), I haven't traveled outside the U.S. in a long time and couldn't imagine that if I did and used my Visa, the bank would charge a 3% for every overseas purchase I made. So I called the bank, and indeed it turns out the fee is among the many lovely changes the banks have been implementing (in fine print, so we don't see them) to extract even more money from consumers.

I was told that sometime in 2007 the bank added this fee and that I should've been informed about it via a mailing. I don't remember getting a notice about it, though I suspect it was probably included in some other document (on the back, in tiny letters). Plus I do all my banking online and didn't see anything about it in the website (probably kuz I would've had to go digging for it).

So, yup, it's the bank charging that 3% for "foreign transactions." All these fees make me wonder why they still need me (us taxpayers) to bail them out...ugh!



Thanks again for your help!

--KZ

PS: I'm soooo looking forward to seeing my new bag!

[lilac0485]

So far my BE purchases have not be charged the 3% foreign transaction fee using a Mastercard. But I have had other international purchases on the same card charged the fee.

[Cornflower Blue]

So if someone wasn't aware of any of this and decided to buy a BE bag from the website, what would happen? I mean when it comes to pay are you then routed through to the Moneybookers site? If so can you just do a one-off payment through them rather than doing any verification thing (which presumes you're going to be using their services in the future for other payments)?

I'm just a bit confused as everyone seems to have had a variety of experiences - some seem to have no trouble at all and just put in their cc details as normal and everythings OK (fingers crossed!) and others are having a heck of a time. Is it only the people who signed up to the MBs site who are having these difficulties??

Don't know if I'm making any sense here, but I'm pretty sure that I've been able to make on one-off payment on a different site in the past using my cc via paypal even though I'm not actually signed up to paypal...

[pixiechic]

Cornflower Blue, since the Moneybookers change I've made two payments on the BE site using two different credit cards and the process worked exactly as it always has. I didn't have to do any verification or go the the MB site for any reason. These were both relatively small payments (under $300) so maybe there is a dollar amount threshhold?

[Cornflower Blue]

Thanks pixiechic - I'm glad to hear it.

Good point, maybe it is something to do with the amount then ....?